40s and Free Agents: Running Back Prospects with Maurice Jones-Drew

NFL Network's Gregg Rosenthal and Daniel Jeremiah are joined by former NFL running back Maurice Jones-Drew to talk all things running back. Aside from the news of the Dallas Cowboys acquiring QB Joe Milton III from the Patriots, the trio talks almost exclusively college running back prospects, from ASU's Cam Skattebo to UNC's Omarion Hampton, and of course, Boise St.'s Ashton Jeanty. Just three weeks from the 2025 NFL Draft, don't miss one of the most nuanced discussions about RB prospects in all of football media on the latest "40s and Free Agents." 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
And welcome to Forties and Free Agents. I'm Greg Rosenthal
here with America's favorite draft analyst, Daniel Jeremiah. One of
my favorite days of the week, Forties and Free Agents Day.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Although it has been a tough.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
Week for one of us here, Daniel, sad news came
across the NFL. It came during the league meeting that
they will no longer be using the chain game.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
And you know, Sony announced it.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
And you've built a nice little career here on with
Move the Sticks as your Twitter handle, And what are
you going to do now, buddy?

Speaker 3 (00:45):
Well, first of all, I appreciate everybody reaching out. You know,
I was not really ready to talk about it at
this point in time. I just appreciate if you respect
my my and my podcast privacy during these tough moments.
But I do want to thank the outpouring of so
portant love that we've received through and what's been a
pretty difficult week. Greg.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah, let's think of the real victims here, you you know,
not the poor gentleman on the sidelines who are just.

Speaker 3 (01:11):
Going to be there. They're still going to be there.
Their insurance, their insurance guys. Now you know what I
mean that if you need them. They're going to be
as reliable as ever, waiting on call, ready to go,
ready to deliver.

Speaker 2 (01:22):
At least for one year.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
And yeah, you know, way back in the day, I
remember this, this good Twitter handle move the sticks popped
up on Twitter.

Speaker 2 (01:29):
Who is this guy? A mysterious scout.

Speaker 1 (01:32):
Didn't reveal his name at first, had a lot of
good analysis, but I guess you can see true.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
Your name it name?

Speaker 3 (01:39):
What are you talking about?

Speaker 2 (01:40):
Come on on, you're ruining the vibe here.

Speaker 1 (01:44):
Let's do a little news as we're starting to tape.
We learned and yes, rest in peace to the Chain Gang.
They had a good run. It's been a it's been
on a hundred years. Let's see if we've got a
lot of footage here, Abod it's shot that much footage
of the Chain Gang, it.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
Was pretty amazing.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
We got some news on Thursday morning that the Patriots
are trading Joe Milton and a seventh round pick to
the Cowboys for a fifth round pick. The Cowboys just
love giving up picks for potential backup quarterbacks.

Speaker 2 (02:13):
They gave up on Andrey Lance.

Speaker 1 (02:14):
He's no longer even on the roster, so Joe Milton
has one year with the Patriots, he ruins their chances
of having the number one overall pick because he beats
the Bills in Week eighteen, and then they get a
fifth round pick back for What did you make of this?

Speaker 3 (02:30):
Well, I mean, look, I don't blame the Cowboys for
trying to, you know, upgrade the backup quarterback position after
Cooper Rush walked out the door, So made sense for them.
I think with the Patriots, obviously Drake May is that
guy and going to be that guy going forward. The
only thing I would have thought of from the Patriots
standpoint is, you know, you still have an offensive line
that's a little bit leaky. So if for some reason

(02:52):
Drake May weren't to be able to trot it out
there for seventeen weeks, I think you get an opportunity
to display him again, and maybe that even goes up higher.
But you know, look, you got a chance to, you know,
get a nice pick form at this point in time,
with very little that he's had to play. You know,
it's hard to fault. It's hard to fault the Patriots,
and I totally get where the Cowboys are coming from.

(03:13):
I feel like the Cowboys are getting a lot of
grief for this. I mean, I've never understood that. I
remember having a conversation with Howie Roseman a long time
ago about the value of the backup quarterback and he's,
for the most part, has always had, you know, has
always paid that guy in that position. And he's like,
I can't understand how you know you could pay like
some of these other positions of lesser importance, this kind

(03:35):
of money, and then if our starting quarterback goes down,
we're cooked, Like that's it, Like, why would you not
invest in that position? So I'm okay with it.

Speaker 2 (03:42):
They should invest, but it was weird to me.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
The second Mike Rabel took that job, we immediately started
hearing like, hey, Joe Milton could be available. So for
whatever reason, they just did not want to keep him
after one year. And he looked dynamite. In that one game,
he made a couple of throws that made Taylor Rap
looked flat footed on the on this throw across his
body that ended up being a touchdown to Kendrick Born.
He had another throw down the sideline that was measured

(04:07):
as the fastest throw I believe in MGS history. The
defenders thought the play was over and he gets a
touchdown out of it. They ended up calling it back
as a penalty, So I don't know why they want
to get rid of them, but they got Josh Dobbs
and that'll be their backup quarterback. It does feel like
you need another veteran in that room. But when I
started hearing the takesters say that, oh, like what does
this mean when it comes to Dak Prescott, Like it's like,

(04:31):
this is one of those stories that if it happened
the second day of free agency, it would have been
thirtieth on the rundown.

Speaker 2 (04:36):
But because there's nothing to talk about right now. Leaving
the show with Alough, I like, Joe Milton, I mean.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
You want me to give you my Milton notes coming out?

Speaker 1 (04:45):
Yeah, I am curious about what you thought of him
coming out because they didn't even really get a clean
fifth round pick. They're sending the seventh back, so it's
like a pick swap, not even getting.

Speaker 4 (04:52):
A full ye.

Speaker 3 (04:53):
So for people forget like Milton coming out, he was
a little over six five, two hundred and thirty five pounds,
He's got big hands, ten and a quarter in chans,
big old mits ran four six tu it his pro day,
so he's obviously hightweight, speed, athleticism. Six years in college,
he was twenty four coming into the draft. Re member
started at Michigan, then goes to Tennessee, huge, huge arm.

(05:14):
I thought he had quiet feet, like he's real comfortable
back there. His issue, and it would followed him through
college through those two stops, was he got a little
stuck on his first read and just wasn't he just
wouldn't get deep through progressions. But like, just go out
there and watch him throwing warm ups and watch him
spend a football, watch him run around. The talent was outrageous,
and he was a very gifted runner, although he was

(05:34):
a reluctant runner coming out, but that's an element to
his game. I thought wherever he got an opportunity in
the NFL, they might tap into more of that. But
Joe Milton's been a guy everybody's been dreaming on through
all of his collegiate career those six years. It was
always the next year was going to be the Joe Miltonere,
and then the next year is going to be the
Joe Miltoneer. It's always been potential, and then he just
gave you a little taste just gave you a little

(05:56):
taste of it at the end of the year last year,
and you can understand why teams are going to always
be excited about that.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
It broke broke my son Walker's heart. He's a big
preseason guy. Joe Milton put up some nice preseason tape two,
so I'm not surprised that a team was interested at
least for that she pick. Let's talk a little bit
about the real news that came out this week. DJ
has got a new top fifty prospects. I believe it's
four point zero. Came out on Wednesday. Not a lot

(06:23):
of crazy movement in this. I'm curious, though, what is
happening between three point zero, which was I would say
about a month ago, maybe six weeks ago, Like, what
is happening it was post combine between then and now
to get these players moving.

Speaker 3 (06:38):
Yeah, I'm glad you asked that, because, in full disclosure,
I asked you to ask me this question. I want
to be honest with you. Could yeah, no, I'm I
want to be truthful and transparent here. I get this
a lot, which is they haven't played games in so long.
How did these guys move up and down the board
and it's not specific to you know, just the media
side of things. This is what's going on with teams.

(07:00):
Guys are going to move. You try and anchor the boards.
You don't have wild swings on there. But you are
going to get more information and you are going to
have an opportunity to watch more players. From my side
of things, the analogy that I you know, I think
maybe this will make sense if you're of our generation. Greg,
you probably did this as a kid. You probably more
than me, just you know, maybe a little bit close.

Speaker 2 (07:21):
But you take the change.

Speaker 4 (07:23):
You take.

Speaker 3 (07:23):
Remember when you were a kid, and you'd have like
a like a piggy bank. You'd have like a place
where you keep all your change, and you dump all
your change out, and then you would sort it. You
would take the quarters, the dimes, the nickels, and you
just separate them. That's like the first part of the
draft process. It's like, Okay, I know, these are all
the quarters, these are all the dimes, these are all
the nickels, these are all the pennies, and then you
could go through once you've got him kind of in
those piles. Now it's like, okay, I could look at

(07:43):
the dates on here and now I can go inside
the dimes. I can just kind of sort the dimes
based off the dates on the penny, Like this is
what you're having to do.

Speaker 4 (07:50):
Now.

Speaker 3 (07:51):
Initially you go through, it's a it's like a broad stroke.
You get you know, you know, don't get as deep
on the players. But I can kind of put them
in their clumps and kind of and put them there.
And now later in the process, I can go back
and just okay, let me watch these targets for these
three receivers that I have real close together. And then
that's where you get a little bit of the movement.

Speaker 1 (08:08):
I don't know what you're trying to say about me though,
that I'm doing it more than you. Maybe that you
were growing up in the lap of luxury down there
in southern California, and you know every piggy banks.

Speaker 3 (08:17):
Every time, every time we go down to Tijuana, you
get you get a Tijuana blanket and a Tijuana piggy bank.
Man as a kid in San Diego, doesn't getting better
than that?

Speaker 1 (08:24):
That's awesome, And hey, why not just watch more tape?
And sometimes he changed your mind if I found making rankings,
I'm always changing my mind based off the last thing
I saw about it.

Speaker 2 (08:34):
It happens absolutely.

Speaker 3 (08:36):
They think that you just whatever your first thought is,
that has to be gospel.

Speaker 1 (08:40):
Let's talk about some of the big movements. Tem McMillan
dropped to eighteen. It wasn't a dramatic drop. I would say,
you've been a little lower than consensus on him throughout
if you kind of look at the rest of the
boards and he's still very high. You like him as
a top twenty player, which is great, but he did
start out as the second wide receiver behind Travis Hunter
for calling Hunter a receiver, and now he is the

(09:02):
fourth on your list. So I am kind of curious
in terms of stacking. You talked about sorting the dime,
so when we're sorting these wide receivers, why has he
fallen a couple notches?

Speaker 3 (09:13):
Well, a couple of things. I mean, first of all,
he wasn't I mean, he's big, he's a big guy,
but not quite as big as you thought. Initially, he
ran okay, didn't run great, So that's the testing side
of it, But that really wasn't it for me. You know,
some of the issues that I had with him is
just I want to see him be a little more physical,
play with a little more urgency, be a little stronger,
you know, work back through the defenders a little more aggressively.

(09:35):
He has got, as you can see on the clips,
unbelievable ball skills, like he has got a crazy catch
radius that volleyball background. You can see the coordination and
the ability to get up in the air and make plays.
I just thought it was more so about what those
other two guys did do with Golden and Abuka. First
of all, they both ran really well, which that's nice,
but that really wasn't it. I thought both those guys

(09:57):
just played stronger, played firmer, played with more agency. I
feel like I know exactly what I'm getting with them.
I think McMillan still has the highest ceiling of those
three guys, and if you hit you could you could
really hit it. I just thought I was a little
more sure in what I was buying with the other two.

Speaker 2 (10:14):
Yeah, and they're all very close.

Speaker 1 (10:15):
Matthew Golden from Texas is at sixteen a Mika Buka
at seventeen from Ohio State.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
I'm with you.

Speaker 1 (10:20):
You can kind of see those two receivers and you
just know they're gonna be rotation solid, second third receivers,
whatever it's gonna be, they're going to play in the
NFL or McMillan, I'd be tempted.

Speaker 2 (10:31):
Is this.

Speaker 1 (10:31):
I'm just throwing this out there, and I know he's
not even in your top fifty. I'd be tempted. If
you're into the McMillan archetype. I like James Higgins. Take
him in the second round.

Speaker 3 (10:38):
You're together. I'm a Higgins guy, like Higgins a lot too.
And Higgins. You know what's funny is my son is
at Baylor and he works in the recruiting department. And
one of the things I did with him when he
was home was I watched McMillan and I watched Higgins,
and I said, this put him side by side. Just
divorce yourself of anything, you know, because we've been hearing
about McMillan forever, and just watch him and tell me
what you think. Because Higgins does compete for the for

(11:01):
the ball a little bit more. He draws a ton
of a ton of DPIs because of how competitive and
physical he is. He's not quite as smooth and as
polished a mover as McMillan, but he's he's stronger, firmer, tougher.
So there's an argument that I think you can make there,
and I would go out and a limit, say, I
think some teams will have it that way, that he
actually would be over McMillan on some boards breaking news.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
Your son's in the scouting department.

Speaker 1 (11:26):
You're going to try to replace me at some point
here on forties and free agents.

Speaker 3 (11:30):
No, no, no, no, he does the scouting like the
real football side, not like you know, kind of like
you know Greg's personality. Guys, he's more of a on
the football side.

Speaker 4 (11:37):
One of them.

Speaker 1 (11:38):
Yeah, someone's got to be Let's talk about Jackson Dart.
He's up four spots to number thirty six.

Speaker 2 (11:46):
Yeah, since our last show.

Speaker 1 (11:47):
I gotta admit it's the first time i've I've actually
watched a lot of Jackson Dart.

Speaker 2 (11:51):
I get why he's there.

Speaker 1 (11:52):
I have no problem with like where you're putting him
because to me, you see, the athleticism is awesome. He
can he can throw it. You can see a team
fall in love with them. But if I had a criticism,
it's like, you don't see a lot of quarterback e
stuff to you, like it's a lot of one read
it's a lot of system specific and you can see
if he gets with the right coach. How do you
rank a guy maybe that you haven't seen him do

(12:15):
a lot of the stuff that you need to see
at the next level, Like are you asking around about
how he can pick up stuff because you don't necessarily
see it with him on the film.

Speaker 3 (12:24):
Yeah, I think it's hard to find any colleges nowadays
that do that. I mean, we have this discussion with
guys every year. Last year was bo Nicks. It's just
a lot of pick and stick, you know, like the
balls out, you just you know, they have a lot
of stuff predetermined, quick hitters, balls gone with Jackson Dart,
it's a lot of as we're seeing on the highlights here,
it's a lot of shot plays. It's a lot of

(12:44):
schemed up winners. There are opportunities where you see him
get from one to two, but you know, as not
reading things all the way out. But gosh, Greg, there's
just not many times you see quarterbacks do that anymore.
So it's always going to be a little bit of faith.
It's always going to be important to go through the
meeting process, give him information, see how he absorbs it

(13:05):
and things like that. But you know, you don't. Ever,
as we saw last year with Caleb as highly regarded
as he was, there's still some faith and hope involved
here once you get these guys in the building, because
in college you're just not gonna be asked to do
all that stuff.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
And I see you have been thrown out the Jalen
Hurts comp I do that aro oute to some people.
I will say Jalen Hurts as a runner in college
was a little next level, just the same as an athlete.

Speaker 3 (13:30):
No, yeah, yeah, of course.

Speaker 4 (13:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (13:32):
But if you look at a lot of the traits
that they do share, they have the same type of
a build. They're sturdy, strong guys. They're ultra ultra competitive.
They're not looking to run out of bounds either one
of them. They're going to fight you free yards. They
each got better throughout their college career. Hurts was a
son of a coach who the makeup and everything was
off the charts. Everything I've heard from Jackson Dart from
that standpoint off the charts. So that's where the similarities

(13:54):
with Hurts come in.

Speaker 2 (13:55):
I see the vision. I think you got them in
the right spot.

Speaker 1 (13:57):
It might be a little rich to take them too early,
but if you're get him at the back of the
first round of the second round. That makes a lot
of sense to try to develop him some cornerback moves.
I saw Benjamin Morrison, not a guy that has been
getting a lot of pop moves up from cornerback seven
to cornerback five. But I actually wanted to ask you
about Will Johnson, So he fell down one spot to fourteen,

(14:17):
and he's someone I just wanted to ask a bigger
picture question while I got you. If you just went
off his twenty twenty three tape, I would guess he
would be higher on this list. So how do you
like evaluate a guy that was so electric a year ago?

Speaker 2 (14:34):
So you know it's there.

Speaker 1 (14:35):
For him with maybe the tape he put out this
year that wasn't as good, Because to me, I don't know,
would I would go with last year's tape and just
great off that that's what I would do?

Speaker 3 (14:46):
No, And then Stingley would be the argument there, right,
you know, because Stingley didn't see much of him as
last year at LSU, and there was some questions and
concerns about him from a tackling standpoint. A couple of
those questions popped up this year with will John Onson.
But you know, to me it was a little bit
of the collective of he's had some injuries throughout his career.

(15:06):
I don't know. I mean, Stingley's a four to three guy.
He doesn't have that type of juice, that type of
top speed, but he's got you know, the size, the length,
the ball, skills, the awareness outstanding and that's why he's
he is where he is on my list. It's pretty
darn high. I mean, he's a top fifteen player on
my board. But I do think you can't just throw

(15:26):
out what you saw this year, which to me was gosh.
A couple of times he got stretched vertically and I
had some questions about the speed. Now he has a
pro day scheduled for I think a couple of weeks
from now he go, and that's one it's a big
one for me because he goes out there and actually
runs and he and he puts anything in the four
fours in there like that. Can that can be enough
for me to kind of move him up a couple spots.

(15:47):
But that's my that's my lingering question that I have,
and I'm there. I know there's a lot of people
in the league that are that are believe it when
they see it. When he runs a forty, they're kind
of like this is there's a lot of guys who
have later pro days and then a team. You know what,
I'm a little tight. I'm going to do the field
workout today. No forty, so we'll see if he puts
his hand on the line.

Speaker 1 (16:06):
It runs April fourteenth. Is the Michigan protein.

Speaker 2 (16:10):
Yeah. I just keep hearing about in.

Speaker 1 (16:11):
This class like there's not these like blue blue chip guys.
He seems like a guy at least has a chance
maybe to be a blue blue chip guy.

Speaker 2 (16:17):
So maybe he gets taken a little higher.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
Walter Nolan was a big riser up to twenty eight
up six spots. Had a good workout, I believe. But
we're we're out of time because we got to put
you on the clock. It's back to on the clock.
And I should have mentioned at the top that we're
talking running backs today. I like a good theme of
a show, so we're putting you on the clock talking
running backs. And then after the break we're going to
talk to Maurice Jones Drew.

Speaker 2 (16:40):
And his show up is he here?

Speaker 3 (16:42):
We need to do it.

Speaker 1 (16:43):
There's been some negotiating behind the scenes.

Speaker 3 (16:45):
I knew there is we remem for to get him.
I didn't know that we reeled in the fish. I
didn't know.

Speaker 1 (16:49):
We do believe that he's going to be there. I'm
not sure he was totally aware the entire time. But
We're going to put five minutes on the clock and
I'm just going to start with a question that the
rest of the country does it no, And I'm sure
there's some draft knicks out there that want to.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
I'm going to ask you about running.

Speaker 1 (17:03):
Backs outside the top fifty, because this is a class
that is believed to be so deep.

Speaker 2 (17:09):
That's what's so great about it. It's deep.

Speaker 1 (17:11):
And yet you know you got plenty in the top fifty.
You got four, But I'm curious about who's caught your eye.
Give us a little preview of who you like outside
the top fifty.

Speaker 3 (17:20):
First of all, I think I have five in the
top fifty, don't I. I'm not going to put you
to the test on Matthew.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
You're actually right. I forgot about Caleb Johnson.

Speaker 3 (17:29):
I think Caleb Johnson man. Can we get Gregor researcher?
Just let's just assign a researcher to him and let's
give the guy some help. So guys I like outside
of that mix, I'll give you, I'll give you some
interesting names here. Dylan Samson is one I love from Tennessee,
like crazy, crazy production there. He ran. He's a little
over five eight, two hundred pounds. He ran low four fours,

(17:50):
super twitched up. He plays fast, he can get skinny
in the hole. He's got you know, instincts. You know
he fumbled the ball four times, like to see that
clean up a little bit and in past protection. Still
a little bit of a work in progress there, But
just as a pure runner, I'm a big fan of
him and what he brings to the game. I think
in that in that same tier you're talking about guys

(18:11):
like Trevor Etn from Georgia. Obviously everybody knows the family
name there. At almost five nine almost two undred pounds,
ran low four fours. He wasn't healthy all year. When
you do see him out there and he is healthy,
he's got some some burst to him, he's got some
bounce with the way he runs, he's got good vision
and feel. He's he's a really really good player and

(18:32):
a personal favorite of mine who I'm curious to see
where he goes. And I'm curious to see what our
guest thinks of him because I'm a I'm an RJ.
Harvey guy out of Central Florida. At five eight, two
hundred and five pounds, ran four to four flat. I
wrote my notes. He's like a mix of Tarik Cohen
as well as DeVante Freeman. It's like they kind of
squished him together. So a guy who runs just load

(18:53):
to the ground. He can he can get away from me.
He's got big time burst. They use him as a
wildcat vision. He can catch the ball. You'll see him
get out on wheels and and really track the football.
He just gets a little bit small pass protection, but
he is He's like of that group of guys. He
might be my favorite guy to watch.

Speaker 2 (19:10):
Well, you know f did he loves like a short
running back, so.

Speaker 1 (19:13):
Why I'm sure he likes it, and you could you
could be doing some research by the way, too. He
has his running back rankings out there and yeah he
does have Harvey pretty I I'm totally with you.

Speaker 2 (19:20):
I'm glad I was told.

Speaker 3 (19:22):
I was alerted a long time ago by our expert
producer that there was a chance they were aiming to
angling to bring in MJD. And I like authentic podcast
slash TV shows where I can be surprised and I
want to I want to hear it first out of him.
I don't want to. I don't want to cheat the
system here.

Speaker 1 (19:41):
That's outstanding and you can hear it first for me.
I'm so with you on Dylan Sampson Man the way
the instincts that kid runs with.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
I don't know, he just got something, I know in
a great conference. Yeah, I know he.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
Didn't quite see the receiving, but like he seems like
he could do that too.

Speaker 2 (19:55):
He he just seems like he has something there. So
I am with you.

Speaker 1 (19:58):
The one question I want to ask about the top
two backs, which accid genty was incredible. It was fun
to finally like go through it and see how incredible
his balance is just so impossible. To get him on
the ground even when right, even when you tackle little
get him on the ground, the play just ends. He's
out of boundary, but he's standing up. But he's still
standing up and he's electric. And I thought Amari and Hampton,

(20:19):
I usually don't like like the big backs like that
who aren't going to make you miss, but man, he
was special too.

Speaker 2 (20:25):
So to me, those are the big two and it's
a pretty big drop up.

Speaker 1 (20:27):
I think Hampton is outstanding, and according to your rankings
you agree with me. The only question I have about
the two of them, are you at all concerned about the.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
Huge workloads that they had last year?

Speaker 1 (20:36):
Because if you were in the NFL and you had
the workloads that those two kids had, you'd be a
little worried coming back the next year. Is there is
there any concern that that they took a lot of
juice out of these kids to have the amount of
carries in the in the receiving that they had a
year ago.

Speaker 3 (20:50):
A couple of things. Let's start individually here. Let's go genty.
First of all, I kind of liked the fact that
he wasn't in the you know, in the big ten
or the SEC so even though he was getting a
lot of workload and a lot of touches, I don't
think he was getting hit like he would have got
hit in those conferences. Obviously, he's built like a you
know what, brick house, so's he's and he doesn't take

(21:13):
because of the way he's built, and he's so compact.
He doesn't take a lot of big shots, So to me,
that's you know, I think he's kind of built for that.
Now again, are we talking about we get the second
contract discussions, that's we'll see. Time will tell nobody.

Speaker 2 (21:27):
Can I can't worry about that now.

Speaker 3 (21:29):
But I'm gonna have a heck of a run for
the next five years. I can tell you that I
I don't think he'll have any trouble staying healthy. And
then Hampton, I'll just give you one nugget on him.
I talked to the folks where he trained in the
pre draft process, and I asked him, I said, with
all this workload, They said, he came in and they
do a full medical check up on him and beause
they want to get these guys in the system. They said,
this guy did not have a hangnail, like he's a freak.

(21:50):
Like his body. After all that, he showed up and
he was like he had just taken two years off,
like there was nowhere and tear.

Speaker 1 (21:57):
That is exactly five minutes. You nail it on the clock.
And I'm with you. You know what you want to
see out of those guys. If if gent's playing against
lower competition, you could say Hampton's doing the same. Hampton
looked like a man amongst boys. He looked like the
best player on the field in so many of those games.
And I wanted to watch the gent playoff game too,
thinking like, oh, they held him down a little bit.
He was the best player on the field in that
game too, even five tackles.

Speaker 3 (22:18):
See it might only got eight yards on some of those,
but he had to go through five guys to get
those eight yards. It was an impressive game.

Speaker 2 (22:24):
Yeah, I get it.

Speaker 1 (22:25):
And I love that we're back in the NFL in
a place where running backs actually will get taken in
the first round. I think those two at least, well,
let's take a quick break. We're gonna come back. We're
gonna talk to maur east Jones Drew about his rankings,
about his mock draft, about his favorite running backs in
just a minute.

Speaker 5 (22:49):
There's a very easygoing guy that likes to have fun
and just you know, hang out with friends. I have
a dog, you know, puggle. A lot of people don't
know about those yet, but I have a puggle to
you know, just like to hang out and just relax.
It's a mix between a pug and a beagle. So
it's pretty it's pretty weird, but a lot of people

(23:09):
starting to get him now. So I think I started
a trend, yeah, said trend we've always been, you know,
I try to set a trend in LA with the dreads.
It's not really working too well right now, but I
think it might come in a little bit later.

Speaker 3 (23:23):
So fantastic. I've never seen that before.

Speaker 1 (23:30):
That is from two thousand and six. That's our guest.
That was his first interview at the Combine with the
NFL network. Who knew he would be working with us
all those years later?

Speaker 2 (23:41):
Did you make the dreads trend? Like they're no longer there?

Speaker 4 (23:45):
Obviously we see our colleague and coworker, Mike Robb have dreads,
So I feel like, you know, it kind of went
a little more national. We we we thought it was
just going to be an LA thing, and it kind
of blew up to more of a national thing. So, uh,
it is what it is, you know, the puggle the
puggle thing blew up though. The puggle thing, like I
want to say, parents, I've never heard of. It was

(24:07):
like crazy, it was crazy. I think she saw that
interview was like, let me see what this little things about?
What the prettiest dog. But you know how like pretty
people get ugly.

Speaker 3 (24:16):
It's like the Paris Hilton, like Nicole Ritchie, like is
this like those days?

Speaker 4 (24:21):
Okay those days? And so we were trying to because
I was then, I had to have a puggle to
balance balance out that he was ugly. So I was
handso and made created balance.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
But that's what you're bringing to the show. DJ said,
I'm bringing a personality. That's what I bring, not not
analysis or good look.

Speaker 3 (24:39):
Loose definition of personality on that one.

Speaker 1 (24:41):
By way, m Viddy one of my favorite people at
NFL Network. We do the games for the international audience
on Monday Night. But he is a running back through
and through. He's a running back expert, and the assignment
desk put him on the case to make some.

Speaker 2 (24:59):
Running back rank.

Speaker 1 (25:00):
So we're just gonna talk running back to this kind
of the running back show, Maurice. But we're gonna put
up the four guys that you said were Day one
starters for this draft. That's Ashton Genty no surprise there,
Traveon Henderson from Ohio State, quinch On Junkins, his teammate
from Ohio State. All guys that are in DJ's top forty.

(25:21):
And then a little bit of a surprise here Cam
Skataboo as the fourth guy on your list, and you
actually have him ranked a head of Judkins. So let's
just have a Skataboo conversation. It's been too long, like
why is he in that tier for you?

Speaker 4 (25:34):
So two things. Being from the Bay Area, I have
a lot of friends that know him, that have watched
him when he was at Sack State that kind of
balled his career from the North Bay all the way
to Arizon the State, and everyone's like, you got to
watch this kid, you gotta tell us about him. So
I tried to hold off because you don't want the
outside influence. But when you turn on the tape, he's
just a pure football player, period, point blank. There's nothing

(25:56):
about his game that you don't like. Obviously he doesn't
have the long speed, but you can set is right there,
the short area of quickness, the contact balance, the competitive spirit,
he finishes every run. He's tough to tackle. And then
listen to this DJ. This is the one thing I've
always tried to tell people. Look at the college playoffs,
which teams had success, right, the ones that had tough

(26:17):
running backs and you look at this. This dude here
took over the Texas game. I mean, who doesn't want this?
I just like, and this is not even looking at
anything else. Just watching tape. I found myself late at
night watching scatterbo tape. That play right there is really
what kind of took me over the top. The way
he finishes runs. I mean, it's just he can play

(26:38):
in any system that you want him in. He doesn't again,
the long speed is a concern, but to me, he
can go to anywhere and start right now. Be a
third down back pick up blitz is everything you'd be
looking for.

Speaker 3 (26:49):
I want to jump on on this, MJD. So I'm
going to give you something to aid your argument here.
So they question, did Arizona State win their conference the
Big Twelve?

Speaker 4 (27:01):
I have no idea they did.

Speaker 3 (27:04):
They did, They won the conference, they made the playoff,
They almost knocked out Texas. Do you know how many
of Cam Scataboo's teammates got combine invitations?

Speaker 2 (27:16):
Zero?

Speaker 3 (27:17):
One man band and he almost they almost took down Texas.
If they don't get a fourth down conversion late in
that game, they move on. They take out Texas and literally,
I don't know if I've ever seen a team, especially
with this new obviously is new with this new playoff,
but as competitive as college football is and as much
as you know the powerhouse programs have been able to

(27:38):
coalesce talent like we've never seen it like this. You
see it in the Final four right now, Like this
was a one man bent that had one combine invitation.
It was him and he almost bowled his way through
the Texas Longhorns with a stacked roster. That's a big
feather in his cap.

Speaker 4 (27:54):
For sure. He could catch the ball out of the backfield.
He can run rouse like a wide receiver. Like I said,
he he does everything. And I guess watching all these
running backs watching his tape. I've talked to probably twelve
running back coaches in the NFL and they all look
at me crazy. But then when they go and watch
the tape, they're like, this is the type. This is
what you're looking for at a running back, right this

(28:16):
is this is the vision. The short area of quickness,
the ability to break tackles, to push guys forward, finish forward,
everything that you want in a running back.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
Scatabo has I agree, like the creativity, the vision, like
he makes space. I think more than some of the
guys that are ranked highly. I'm with MJDM. I'm breaking
the tie here. I would put him over Travon Henderson.
I would put him over Quinnchod Jenkins. And I know
you look at him and you think they're maybe bigger, faster.

Speaker 3 (28:46):
What I'm saying that you're splitting the tie. When MJD
agrees with me and has Trayvon Henderson over the scattered
that's one.

Speaker 2 (28:53):
So you're losing here.

Speaker 3 (28:55):
Two of them have one guy, one has the other.
You're on the wrong.

Speaker 4 (28:58):
Side the matter.

Speaker 2 (29:00):
My point is that he is. He is up there.

Speaker 1 (29:02):
Like MJD has him in his top four, he has
him as a true day one starter type of guy.

Speaker 2 (29:08):
You don't have him in the top fifty. To me,
I don't think he's going to go.

Speaker 3 (29:12):
I don't think he's going to go in the top fifty. Yeah,
I don't think he's going to go in the top fifty.
But I think he's a I think he's a really
good player. He's just outside that for me. I think
he's going to I think he's most likely going to
go in the third round. And I agree that he
does all those things well. He does not have the
juice that you're going to see guys traditionally have that
go in the top three rounds. It doesn't mean he's
not going to be a great player. He's like, to me,

(29:34):
he looks like James Connor if you left him in
the dryer too long him jd Hey.

Speaker 4 (29:38):
So this is the thing. It's so funny when I
do the rankings. It's not about where they get drafted.
It's about of course, right, I just like it. I
think that's where it gets twisted because this is a
draft show, right, So it's like, well, why don't you
have a Marion Hampton in this way? He's gonna get
drafted higher. He probably is going to get drafted. I
actually have him one lock draft going to Denver later

(29:59):
in the thing. So it's not that the kid is
just when you look at his tape, Scatabo's tape and
you look at Hampton's tape, completely different players, completely different
players and a completely different running back. To me that
I think scata Bow kind of just shows a little
bit more. Now you said Trevion Henderson, listen off of
just pass blocking period.

Speaker 3 (30:19):
He's he's almost number one animal, almost number one freaking
he almost MJD, Shawn Marry and some dudes in that
tape like he attacks dudes like I've seen him.

Speaker 4 (30:31):
I've seen guys go between that guard and tackle gap
and then there's nowhere to be found outter that like
they get, they get, And so I again, like before
I do the rankings, I kind of call some of
my mentors and old coaches and see, to a man,
every coach that I talked to that watched his tape
was like, he's number one on the board just off
of pass blocking in general. Wow, right, because again, you
got to protect the money, you got to protect the quarterback.

(30:53):
You know right away that he has the will, he
has the want to and he knows where he's going
with the You've seen him scan. He'll and back from
right to left and pick up guys like that alone,
just off of not even touching the ball. They were like,
he's he's a top guy on our board just because
of that.

Speaker 1 (31:09):
Yeah, I don't I don't think he's as creative like
making guys miss, but he's good enough.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
He's big, fast, drunk, Like I get it. Why he's
a home run hitter, right would.

Speaker 1 (31:17):
Be so high and yet home run hitting I feel
like it's a little overrated. It's a lot about I
doesn't have the long speed that comes up a handful
of runs every year, and it's nice if your guy
can go sixty five and like like MJD used to
do instead of forty.

Speaker 2 (31:31):
But you're happy with that forty.

Speaker 1 (31:33):
And the guys that you say don't get taken in
the first three rounds a lot of times, like a
Kyron Williams or I guess he went third round, but
not not early. Those are the guys that are more
effective on a down to down basis, and that's why
I like Scott.

Speaker 3 (31:45):
I also think though, to me, I think it's become
more important to have to have some juice. And I
think that to me when you see as much too
high safety stuff and it's not I know, Greg, you're
talking about like, okay, turning a forty into a sixty
now with two high safeties. I'm talking about turning a
four into a twelve, like just like those yards, if
you got somebody can go get him right now. I
think there is value in having guys, and I think

(32:07):
jimior Gibbs, obviously what he's meant to the Lions has
everybody's trying to in it easier said than done, but
people are trying to find that. They're trying to find
that type of juice and burst to add into their offense,
knowing we're going to get these lighter boxes and stuff,
so I don't want a guy to kind of plow
his way through and get me five yards. I think
these guys can can make up for some of the
explosives I'm missing in the passing game because they put

(32:28):
a roof on everything.

Speaker 2 (32:30):
That's a that's a good point. You have a future
in this business.

Speaker 4 (32:33):
I like that point.

Speaker 2 (32:34):
You kind of convinced me. MJD.

Speaker 3 (32:36):
Though, by the way, by the way, one quick hold,
I'm cutting you off because I want to ask MJD
one thing because I'm always looking for new scout terms.
So when pass protection, like when he hits guys, you'll
hear guys always say like it was a yard sale, right,
you know, like the ear piece going, or like you
guy just he just hits something that looks like a
yard sale with him. I watched it and I was like,
I can't even say this in report because it can't
explain it, but I'm like, it looks it looks like

(32:57):
the when he hits guys, it looks like the matrix
looks like, oh my god, like this kind of like
blow whichever kid.

Speaker 4 (33:04):
I don't I don't even know what team it was.
It might have been like a purple. I don't even
know it was. Some guy ran in between the B
gap and you had showed it on like Instagram and
he hit this kid and I was like, someone go
check on him. Like he got up and he kind
of did his thing, but he took football. That's a

(33:24):
great that's a great term that they say you take
a little football out of people when you hit him
a certain way. Treyvon Henderson takes football out of kids.
Every time he passed blocks. I mean like, you're not
going to rush the same way. You're not gonna blitch
with the same intent. You're gonna be looking for him
as as you again, like he's coming and you can't
see him from all these these big linemen that he
comes out of nowhere and he's just like it's like,

(33:46):
oh so, I don't know, man, you loved I loved
that part of his game. Like I said before, that
alone almost had him up their tier with with gent.

Speaker 3 (33:55):
Obviously, where did you I know, Greg I'm hijacking your hair,
but I know we're probably supposed to get into this.
I'm gonna go off, But where did you have him
go in your mock?

Speaker 4 (34:04):
Because there you know you're going to go to Bears
see see.

Speaker 3 (34:07):
And I honestly, and I'm sure you'll probably get some
blowback on that. It feels a lot like Jamir Gibbs,
where like I had him ranked and I'm like, gosh,
I love Traveon Henerson. He's for me. Where is he? Greg?
You probably have my list. He's probably like early thirty yeah,
early thirties. And but if you if we woke up
on the day after the draft, then he was the
tenth pick, Like I wouldn't I wouldn't shock me at all.

Speaker 4 (34:30):
Okay, So I'm gonna break some news for you. I'm
not saying that they're going to do that or not.
But the running back coach the Chicago Bears texted me
in the middle of the night all the time about
certain people and we've had we had a good thirty
minute conversation about his blitz pick up. And that certain
running back coach was Eric Bienemy, who coached me in college,
and his number one rule was if you can't block,

(34:50):
you can't play. So I can tell you right now,
no rock Yeah, no blocking, No Rocky. And we're just
showing his ability here to make guys miss and his
patience and he has all that good stuff. But I've
talked to a bunch of running back coaches from all teams,
college coaches, everyone talks about his past pro and that

(35:12):
to me, we know in the NFL. Look, it's one
thing to be able to do something with the ball,
but where you really separate yourself in the NFL is
what you do without the ball, and that ability Beck
Caleb Williams. Again, a lot of my mock draft was
about protecting the quarterback or helping the quarterback. Well, if
you're talking about Caleb Williams, who got sacked at gazillion times,
people who are blitzing him, you put a running back
in there that you know and wants to go and

(35:34):
willing to go and pick up blitzes. You got to
do the third down back then go in there and
step in right away.

Speaker 3 (35:38):
For you, as they like to say, Greg, that's the
last butt between you and the defense is the running back.
So I prefer him to be able to block.

Speaker 1 (35:48):
He I mean, you could see that he's going to
have a roll right away. You got to be worried
a little bit, MGD. If Eric b Enemy listens to
forties in free agents, whether you're still going to be
getting these texts late at night.

Speaker 4 (35:59):
Oh that's all good. I mean, that's my guy. You know,
we were at UCLA. Didn't work out. I'm really sad
about that. But he's he's still you know, a guy
that I lean on a lot. There's a couple others.
I won't say any more names, but there's a couple
others that I lean on a ton when it comes
to the running back position.

Speaker 1 (36:16):
So if they take him ten, that would be interesting.
He did have some nagging injuries. He was never the
guy at Ohio State was always sharing the workload, so
you haven't seen that. And where I disagree with you
the most on your rankings, MGD. And I like that
you're not trying to be like the consensus. You're clearly
just saying what you believe, and that's more accurate for
I think how evaluators are around the league. There's a

(36:38):
lot more disagreement than I think we see in some
of these consensus boards and everything.

Speaker 2 (36:42):
But you Haveio Hampton.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
Very fairly low, and DJ was talking about how you
need some juice at the position, and I look at
Amari and Hampton and I think, man, it's not always
the type that I love, but you see it. I
could see him going number ten to the Bears because that,
to me, looks more like a guy with next level
ability as a runner. And he made some of those

(37:07):
opponents in the acc look like children among men, and
he was the man.

Speaker 4 (37:13):
No I listen. I tell people all the time again,
this isn't Those rankings are just what I see and
how I see it. I know he had a great season,
but it's tough when you see a fellow running through
gaping holes. A lot and a lot of it is
scheme based, right. My concerns with Hampton was just his
start and stop. He's not He's a guy that has
to be on the track, and when he's on the track,

(37:35):
he's gonna be tough, tough to tackle. When he has
to stop his feet, it's hard for him to kind
of get back going again. It reminds me a lot
of Derek Henry and the reason and I want people
to understand this. I had Derek Henry ranked high because
Dereck Henry was six four to two hundred and fifty
pounds ran a four or five. And when he's on
his track, Dereck Henry is hard to stop. But if
you ever notice when people get around his feet and

(37:56):
he has to stop his feet, he gets tackled very easily.
And I saw a lot of that with Hampton. And
again it's not to knock what he's doing is just
The NFL is such a start stop league, especially at
the running back position, with stunts and the way defenses
are firing and blitzing and doing different things. You just
have to be able to start and stop a little
bit more. And again if you get with the team
that you know if he goes to the Broncos. Sean

(38:17):
Payton did a great job with mark Ingram, who was
very similar where you get him downhill, you get him
rolling a little bit that goes, but it again, it's
just for me. It was a start and stop that
really hampered me to have him at number seven.

Speaker 3 (38:30):
How would you compare him personally to Jonathan Taylor when
he was coming out?

Speaker 4 (38:36):
So I had John, I had him at six. I
had Jonathan Taylor six, and people thought I was crazy.
But again it's it's about the system fit that you
have to go to Jonathan Taylor.

Speaker 3 (38:46):
Look at that's my point.

Speaker 4 (38:48):
He went to the Colts. They had a great offensive line.
Jonathan Taylor, when he stops his feet not as good
compared to some of the other guys.

Speaker 3 (38:55):
But he's a great runner, right exactly.

Speaker 4 (39:00):
And so when you get him to where he doesn't
have to stop, he's one of the best. But I
don't know what team was going to draft him. I
don't know where he's going to go. And if you're
just watching the taper saying, look, do we have the
offensive line to create holes or like what kind of
what is And again, when he's on his track, no
one's tackling him. It's just when he has to stop
his feet or like a guy flashes in front of him,

(39:22):
he's easier to tackle. Right.

Speaker 1 (39:24):
I think you have to be special to be an
exception and be that style of back and make it work.
But he looks like he could be in that category
where he is the exception you had. You had defenders
just just bouncing off him at time, and I thought
he was pretty good at picking a hole. But like,
if he lands with a team like the Rams, Like
I could see him like Todd Gurley running down the field,
not that he would.

Speaker 2 (39:44):
I don't think the Rams are looking for a running back,
but that's style.

Speaker 3 (39:46):
I was looking at it. I was looking at him
with the other LA team. It's a compliment to nausey
because they want to play it physically. Those are two
physical backs, but two different backs. Yeah, but like if
you want to lean on people and where people with,
you know, with Alton Mackay Beckton lining up next to
each other, like let him let those guys get creases.
To me, it would be like you almost have nausee

(40:08):
kind of body blowing people to death and all of
a sudden that crease. Hampton hits that crease and he's gone.

Speaker 4 (40:12):
Well, that's why I sent them to the Broncos. I
sent them to the Broncos, just real quick, Greg, just
because if you look at their running game, it's a
lot of downhill. They have really their really strong interior
guard to guard. You can kind of get him going
and more people down. And we know how it is
in Denver. You have to have a good running game
if you're the Denver Broncos. That's the way you've had
the most success. Even when they won their last championship

(40:33):
with Peyton Manning, c J. Anderson was killing people right,
So if you can get a good running game going there,
you have a great opportunity. And then obviously with Williams
going to the Cowboys, I thought that was a good slot.

Speaker 2 (40:44):
Shout out to CJ. Anderson.

Speaker 1 (40:45):
I love a good random like Super Bowl run solid
for a running back. How about Sony Michelle, Yeah, you
could have had Lamar Jackson in that draft. There were
rumors for some reason the Patriots might take them. You
pass them, But Sony Michelle got you that last title bill.

Speaker 3 (41:00):
According to punditry. According to the punditry rules, the fact
that Sony Michelle has a ring and Lamar Jackson doesn't,
that's punditry rules. Now that that means that he's a
better player than Lamar Jackson.

Speaker 2 (41:10):
That people that dog that pick. It worked out for
that year. It was worth it.

Speaker 1 (41:15):
You got you got a ring. More to come on
forties in free agents.

Speaker 2 (41:18):
Back in a.

Speaker 1 (41:18):
Minute, we are back on forties and free agents. Uh,
no love for Caleb Johnson for you from from Iowa, Maurice.
This is the one top fifty guy that we haven't

(41:38):
really talked about. You have him at forty five DJ,
another guy that might depend on the scheme a little bit.
If he gets in a zone scheme. Seems like that
would be a good fit. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (41:46):
Well, again, I think that's the tier that you see
guys in when you're when you if you can't play
in every system, you can't be explosive in every system.
It's gonna be tough to me. This guy is Aaron Foster.
That's what he is. Guess what. Aaron Poster went on Draft,
got with the great system and became one of the
best running backs that I had to compete against. Came
one of the top rbs in the NFL for multiple years.

(42:09):
The thing that I have with Caleb is there's just
no change of pace, right, There's no when he goes,
it's the same pace throughout. There is no like if
you watch RJ. Harvey or if you watch an Asking Genty,
or if you watch any of the guys, there's a
change of there's a change of pace when they take off.
With Caleb, it's kind of the same pace, which is

(42:29):
great for the zone system. And I think, again, I've
talked to a lot of coaches around the league and
they all see the same thing, Like he has a
great job of being patient, his long stride. His style
fits more of a zone system, which a lot of
the league runs, but not everyone, and so when everyone
doesn't run it, you can't fit everyone's system. To me,
you drop down a little bit.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
Two things for me, MJD. Number One, I love the
fact obviously as you played and in this role now
where you're having to do what you do on the
scouting set of teams, which is ranked teams, ranked players.
I think you appreciate it that when you don't have
a scheme or a team and you're asked to stack
players and then you can be held accountable for this
player did well and this player didn't. I'm like, yeah,

(43:11):
but I don't. I don't know the fit like that,
that's not the right fit or this is a perfect
fit for this guy. That's why he's going to do
really well. That's one of the challenges. I don't think
that like the people from the outside that don't make rankings,
and Greg has to do it in free agency as well.
That and I'm not saying like, oh, just absolve us
of every bad ranking we've ever had. That's not what
I'm saying, but it is a challenge when you're not
with a specific team, when you're stacking players.

Speaker 4 (43:33):
Oh, no question. I mean you just talked about Jonathan Taylor.
I had people telling me how crazy I was that
Jonathan Taylor was six. I go, He's playing at Wisconsin
and the size of this room I'm in, those are
kind of holes he was running through, like like five six.

Speaker 3 (43:46):
But the holes he has an MJD has a big house.
If you don't know, so I don't.

Speaker 4 (43:52):
But anyways, I'm just saying that. And then so what
if he went to New York where they weren't as
big of holes, or what if he went to the
Jets where they struggled unning the football? Right? And then
all of a sudden he goes to the Colts and
everyone's like, well, you had him six. Well yeah, if
I would have known he was going to the Colts,
I would have for sure put him in the top
one or two because they had a great offensive line
at that point, right. And so it's just one of

(44:13):
those things, like you said, you're trying to figure it out.
But like I said, with Caleb, I thought he was
very productive the scene, the system fit hit what he
was doing. And if you're the NFL, that's what you're
gonna look at, like, does he fit our system? That's
how we're gonna rank guys. I'm not going to put
Caleb uh into Ah. You know, I don't know uh
Downhill Baltimore Ravens system. That may not fit what he does. Right,

(44:35):
He's more of an outside zone. He's going to press
the whole cut. He see the hole. He has great
vision he has he's a great feel for finding the
wave and following the double teams. And that's what you
want to get him into.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
I mean, you better have a big house. What was
that holdout for with the Jaguars? If you don't, I
mean you earned it.

Speaker 4 (44:52):
H Greg. You know that.

Speaker 3 (44:58):
There's there's two types of people in this world. Greg.
There's the type of people that have to go get
their hair cut and there's the type of people that
have them come to your house and cut your hair.
I'm just saying, MJDS, I go to the shop.

Speaker 4 (45:09):
I go to the shop. That really Yeah, I'm a
shop guy. You see.

Speaker 3 (45:12):
My line is where is the shop on your property?
By the way, is that towards the towards the back
of the property.

Speaker 4 (45:17):
I wish, I wish.

Speaker 1 (45:19):
We're supposed to talk about your mock draft, and we will,
but I this is the only time we're going to
get deep into the running backs on this show. And
you have such a great eyes front. I could tell
DJ is really lightening up when when he has someone
that he actually respects to talk to on this show.
So let's talk about some of these running backs that
you like that are pretty high on your rankings. DJ

(45:39):
gett Ins from Kansas State and R J. Harvey from UCS.
And you were excited about R. G.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
Harvey.

Speaker 1 (45:45):
You have him five and six on your rankings. So
just give me a little flavor of why you like
these guys.

Speaker 4 (45:49):
I mean, I don't know driven a stick. Any of
them here ever driven a stick?

Speaker 2 (45:55):
Yes, my first three cars were all sticks.

Speaker 4 (45:57):
Yeah, yeah, me too. Like you know how you can
control the car and you can slow it down and
you can get it going if you want to race,
Like I was like a young kid racing people in
my little Demu that I had probably was like a
B four, but I was making it sound like it
was a B tip. That's what RJ. Harvey is. He's
a V ten. Like when he gets going, it is
see you later. And I got a chance to really
watch him during the season because my agent was recruiting

(46:19):
the obvious, so he went with another guy. You know,
my agent was sad about it. But when you watch
his tape again, it's it's just about the tape and
I know we're gonna show some b roll here when
he gets going, when he decides to go, it is
good night. And you talked about and DJ's talking about juice.
That's all this is. You give him a scene and
he's gone. He could catch the ball out of the backfield.

(46:41):
He can run inside, he can run outside, he can
make you missing a phone booth. He can do everything
you want. Yeah, he's a smaller guy, and I get that,
but again, there's a there's a change of pace. Can
we show some be roll here? Do we have some
b roll of our Harvey just so we get do
we not? We don't have it.

Speaker 3 (46:55):
I don't know what kind of budget you think we're
working with him.

Speaker 4 (46:58):
I saw the Kayla can't little bit all the job. Listen.
When you watch his tape, it reminds me of just
like he's like, oh.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
Just imagine it, just everybody, just imagine what.

Speaker 2 (47:09):
This here ahead, MJD.

Speaker 1 (47:11):
If you don't say that, they can add the post
and then it's also a podcast. I'm happy if you're
checking us out on YouTube, check us out an NFL network.
But we got the most people listen to it as
a podcast, and you're ruining it by call it.

Speaker 4 (47:25):
It's okay listen, okay, so here, close your eyes while
you're driving. Then, since you want me to help you out,
you can visualize this, Okay, Imagine being in a Corvette
and you decide to just step on the gas. Right
you step on that gas, car's gonna like kind of
rep up and then go right. He's not that. When

(47:45):
he steps on the gas. It is no revving up.
It's like he is taking off right now. He's off
the line. He is rolling. And so I've seen him
make people shut it down, which to me is with
DJ's point at the two high safeties. If you get
a guy that I've seen again, I call it answered
the rams. I've seen Kyron break thirty yard runs. Those
thirty yard runs are gonna go ninety right like again,

(48:06):
if you have the crease and he can fight it
and he can go, he's gonna go ninety to the house.
And that's what coaches want, is that if you're a coach,
I don't want to call anymore players. I want to
be able to hand the ball off to you and
you go ninety if possible. RJ. Harvey has it and
then Gettings on the other side I put on this tape.
He was a little banged up throughout the year. I
think he had like a wrist or a hand or something.

(48:28):
But I've never seen anyone at his size stop and
start and make people miss like he does on a
consistent bring. He is slippery at that size, like a
guy will be coming full speed and he'll just slam
on the brakes and then he'll just take off again
like again. The start, the stop and start, to me
is what the NFL has become. If you ever if
you watch Saquon Barkley and a lot of his long runs,

(48:48):
a lot of them are starting stop and start, like
he'll stop, then he'll explode out and he'll be gone.
And so to me, when you look at Gettings, he
just has that suddenness where like a guy's I mean,
he can make you miss at the last second. To me, uh,
that's special. I think he ran a four four forty
or something around there.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
He ran four four to three as a speed.

Speaker 4 (49:11):
He has the ability to stop and start like man
and then again. And I don't like to knock colleges,
But I don't know who was at Kansas State this year.
I really have no idea because I was just watching
the running backs. But it wasn't like he was running
through gaping holes, like he was sliding through holes and
making people miss. And so to me, when you watch that,
I've gotten into some disagreements with some scouts that I

(49:34):
know that I've grown up with or played with, and
they're like, oh man, I was like, listen, I don't
care what you're talking about. To make a person miss
at full speed is incredible. Not many people can do it,
and this guy hasn't.

Speaker 3 (49:47):
It's his last name of color. By the way, the
person you're referencing anyway, the I'm already inside MJD's head.
I know who he's talking about. Pola's referencing. So I
just kept that on the DL. But to me, the
interesting thing about him too, MJD is he's kind of
he's a little upright, but a lot of times you
get upright guys they're stiff. He's a loose, fluid, upright
runner who's able to kind of his slithery can make

(50:09):
you miss, which is an unusual combination when you watch him.

Speaker 4 (50:13):
Yeah, I mean I thought of I don't even know
who there was a plows just chart. Like you said,
I when I look at most guys like high cut
and kind of like they run straight up.

Speaker 3 (50:23):
And down the line, they're linear guys.

Speaker 4 (50:25):
Him linear guys, right, not not the guys that can
move and you know, flow like some of us. Anyways,
to see him the sut like like I said, it's
just certain things that you see in a like a
word pops up. You rarely hear sudden, but that's what
you hear with him like that. And then he's off
going somewhere else, and then he's making guys miss. And again,

(50:47):
I think again, in the right system, I don't know
what system that would be, but he could be a
real valuable player for a big team.

Speaker 2 (50:54):
Yeah, I hear you on Harvey by the way too.

Speaker 1 (50:57):
I think he would be a fun fit in one
of those schemes where it's a lot of RPOs and
you have a running quarterback and you combine him with
the Jets. Maybe they don't use a running back ear.
You combine in with Justin Fields and what they're trying
to do, or the commanders if they want to look
at kind of a long term echo Li replace and
you put him with jayde Daniels. That would be explosive.
Let's get to the mock. Let's talk a little bit

(51:18):
of the mack. You have a lot of surprising picks
here and I like it.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
MJD.

Speaker 1 (51:23):
He knows what matters in mock season. It's getting a
little attention for the mock. And he puts Ted McMillan
at number five for the Jaguars. He has Shuter Sanders
number three to the Giants. Travis Hunter falls all the
way to seven to the Jets, which would be interesting.
Trevon Henderson we mentioned before at ten, Membu falls to
the Saints at number nine, which they would absolutely love.

(51:44):
But since you're mister Jaguars, and I don't know if
you still have a lot of moles inside that building,
but you are mister Jaguar. You know they've had a
regime change. I'm guessing you do. I that's the pick
I go to just as a consumer immediately, Oh who
does who does MJD have go into the Jaguars. Interesting,
you have Tech mc millan going there.

Speaker 4 (52:04):
Well, if you look at Liam Cohen where he came from, right,
he came from Tampa where they had Godwin and Mike Evans. Well,
you already have Brian Thomas Jr. Who has that jump
ball six' five big. Frame you saw how they Used Mike.
Evans and to, me this is all About Trevor Lawrence's to,
me this pick is all about putting players Around. Trevor
up there goes the b. Roll see that's, crazy that's either.

(52:27):
Here they're. There but this pick is all About trevor
and Getting trevor and making him the most comfortable that
you can make. Him you've let all these, Guys Christian
kirk has, gone you have all these different. Things put
a playmaker around him and let's watch his young head
coach call plays with all these new toys and this
new weapon and make them. BETTER i, mean let's be,

(52:47):
honest The jags have been, close but this is the
time now for you to take the top off with
two explosive players THAT i believe could really change the
trajectory of The.

Speaker 3 (52:58):
Jaguars, yeah what about him? Though give me, him give
me reasoning on him Over travis? There why not just
Make travis your receiver and take him?

Speaker 4 (53:08):
There, WELL i Think travis is a, luxury, RIGHT i
think he's a luxury when and, again when you talk
about being the best, player you can play offense and,
Defense but that size is hard to come. By Right,
again in THE, nfl there's not many six four, corners,
right there's not many six two. Corners so to have

(53:28):
a guy that's legitimately six' five that you could throw
jump balls to in the red zone that you can
do some, different things, to me it just it just
it just it made more sense to See The mike
evans cop and and kind of Picture what tampa was
like last Year with Baker where baker threw, forty touchdowns
to see that kind of comp Go With liam kohn
because that's what, he was that's where.

Speaker 1 (53:49):
He, was like If the patriots Pass On travis hunner
and Then the jaguars And the raiders Pass On, travis
hunder what are we?

Speaker 4 (53:56):
Doing?

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Here people they all. Need him and this is.

Speaker 4 (53:59):
The thing you look At the raiders and again a
TEAM that i grew up LOVING and i, played for
we Know What pete. Carroll wants they want a physical.
Running game they have a great weapon In. Brock, bauers
already you Brought In. Geno smith they don't have a.
Running Game And pete carroll out, of everybody he loves
to run the football and. Play defense and so THAT'S

(54:21):
why i. Went there the only thing With the PATRIOTS and,
i again this is. The problem when you have a
corner receiver that can do a little bit, of everything
someone has to protect. The quarterback like let's Remember drag
may was running around for his life. Last YEAR and
i know the TACKLE from lsu has short arms or
that's what, everyon saying he's a short, arm guy whatever it.
May be, but, listen well you have to protect. Your

(54:42):
QUARTERBACK like i would love To Have, Travis hunter but
what's the purpose of getting HIM if i can't get him?
The football, last year like calling games For Drag may
wo Again the rams Played. The patriots he was. Running
around either the ball was getting out in a two,
step Drop which i've never, seen before or he was
scrambling round like a chicken with his head. Cut, off
eventually we got to protect.

Speaker 3 (55:02):
Our, guy well one of THE things i Do when
i'm Doing the charger games and getting ready. FOR it
i TRY and i study the, offensive LINE and i
TRY and i try and circle. THE guy, i like
this is, The, mark like this is the. Guy, that
okay let's see where they want, to move, you know whoever, It,
is khalil, mack bos whoever, they want this is the guy.
To ATTACK when i Did the, PATRIOTS game i, was,
like well wherever, you want there's. A lot there's a

(55:25):
lot of points of entry here along this. Offensive LINE
so i get what. YOU'RE saying i think in The ideal,
patriots world you would trade, back though like you want
to Get, Either, campbell. Membu whoever but let's let's get some.
Extra value let's trade back a, little bit not necessarily
have to do. It There but MJD's not gonna do all.
The trades. He's not he didn't need to get that
complicated in.

Speaker 4 (55:43):
This listen i'm TRYING to i try to do a
little bit here. AND there i can't do the double
trade Where the texans. Trade up they're at two and
they trade up to three and they picked the top
two guys and get. IT right i just can't. Do
that that's a that takes a lot to. Do it,
you KNOW my mob draft is more of Based on
i'm looking at, The team i'm looking at what they
did last year and then where's. Their need, And Again,

(56:05):
TRAVIS hunter i think is is probably the. TOP receiver
i just think that when you have a coach that
played with two big giants like he Did, in tampa
tet dismatches more Of What mike. Evans was and when
you see, how like it just reminds me Of When
liam cohen through the little five yard route To Get
mike evans his thousand yards to keep it? Going right
did you see how excited? Everyone? Was like did you

(56:28):
See HOW and i get and that when you bring
human nature, into it, Is, like okay you see these
two giants running down. The field you don't think that'll
help your quarterback to. Become better and so, to me
that's kind OF what i was thinking with THE The t.
Mac VERSION plus I Know T mac i coach Against
t mac in. High school i'd Love for temac to
come To the jags and get.

Speaker 1 (56:48):
Us, right yeah and LOOKING at i just get.

Speaker 3 (56:52):
INTO it i would JUST eventually mjd is going to park,
that car, you know and that was where it landed.
Right there he'd known him since he was. A kid, Go, ahead.

Speaker 1 (57:00):
Yeah so at least he's talking about his. Biases openly
one of my biases IS telling dj He's Got mason graham.
Too HIGH so i like that you didn't even have
him in your top ten in the mock so And
No kenneth grant apparently You. Hate Michigan jday barrion is. Thirty,
first overall. That's interesting and then we didn't notice. A
trend i do have a small, research department and they

(57:23):
came up with the trend that there was a lot
of similar picks between you and DJ's, mock draft a lot.
Of copying twelve picks actually. WERE technical i know you've
been traveling around. The world you don't GOT the lsu tackles,
Name HERE so i don't, BLAME, you mdd but we
just noticed twelve picks are.

Speaker 4 (57:41):
THE same, I staid i'm not, gonna cheat. You know
but also at the, same time it's like that does,
make SENSE and i think that's what a lot of. Those.
WERE like i didn't really go mock draft. FIRE fire
i wanted to. Make sense used to, go heavy you
used to get high.

Speaker 3 (57:59):
On you you kind.

Speaker 4 (57:59):
Of, Bet yeah i've told a little because, you know
the comments start to get to you after a couple.
Of years, you know.

Speaker 3 (58:07):
Everybody says it doesn't. Bother them they all said it doesn't,
bother them and they jump IN and.

Speaker 4 (58:12):
I again, i agree it. Bothers ME but i would
like there was A run I think i did or
edges late and, then LATE and i kind of to,
be honest working For, THE rams. I hadn't i have
no idea WHO the rams are going, To TAKE like
i don't know who's going to be there If t
mac falls and yeah, That's AWESOME like i have. No
idea but when we, got THERE when i got TO,
THE rams i, WAS like i have no idea who's

(58:35):
available and who they're going. To take AND so i, just,
like hey go With edge. Rusher again, Forget it like
get Another? Edge rusher? Why not like you can't have
you can never have enough. Of THOSE and i think
that's kind of where, you know you saw some of
the similarities go on some of. Those teams it's.

Speaker 3 (58:51):
Just chance it's A random, i mean, come on that's
just a. RANDOM chance mjd knows the beauty of a.
Mock draft my son used, this TERM which i had never,
heard before but apparently it's.

Speaker 4 (58:59):
Very.

Speaker 3 (58:59):
POPULAR greg i think we talked about, this before but
HE was i turned in my first mock draft. This year,
he goes you put any rage bait, in THERE and i,
was like, Rage, bait like you got to get some
rage bait in there that gets everybody all. Stirred UP
so mjd knows there's about before you need about four
like four Like, The Jets oh Jets And. Travis hunter
that's a week worth of content For The new. YORK market,

(59:19):
i mean that's.

Speaker 4 (59:21):
Name is, Out there your name is out there for.
A while it's it's going to. BLOW up, I mean
shador sanders to, the giants even though after they, you
know EVEN though i did this mock draft two, WEEKS
ago i finished it two weeks ago and it's just now.
Being published, you know this Is before Jamis. And Russell,
but Chador like, Prime, said Shador with Jamis, and russell
that prayer is going to. BE easy i can't wait

(59:42):
to get the glimpses of that competition all over. THE
place i can't.

Speaker 2 (59:46):
Wait love To See brian davil manage. That group but
it would be a great landing spot.

Speaker 1 (59:51):
For him, and yeah, Rage bait LIKE mj d has
been doing rage bait since before that was. A term
MD's entire life walking around is. Rage bait we're in
a studio named for My Friend, chris WESSELING and i
remember the first few times HE.

Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
Met mjd, he's like what's up with?

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
This guy this guy's this guy's, a jerk LIKE because
mjd is going to give the business to everyone, six minutes,
you know six, months later a, year later we're we're
great buddies WITH. With mjd and he thinks he's a.
Great guy but rage bait is BASICALLY how. Mjd lives it's.

Speaker 4 (01:00:24):
Called, Competition right and some people are nice in, their COMPETITION.
Right dj some people like and we're all open, to
arms like come on, With that, LIKE me i got
to see what you're made of FIRST before i can
really let you into, the group Right and, greg over,
You know greg almost got kicked out of the group,
This year just so, you know we Almost take greg
out Of the monday night Group because greg never wanted

(01:00:45):
to show up until he needed Me and bridget or
you needed myself in bridget to kind of join and
do one of. His podcasts then he magically showed up
to do a Show. On monday so Just remember greg
only uses you until he.

Speaker 2 (01:00:58):
Needs you oh this is this is.

Speaker 1 (01:01:00):
Complete nonsense but the running back analysis was. Pretty awesome it,
was great adding another great into. The mix, Thank, You maurice.
THANK you dj will be Back next thursday with another
Episode of forties And. Free agents we are getting close
TO The, NFL draft us a few episodes left before the.

Speaker 2 (01:01:19):
Big day