March 31, 2022 • 33 mins
This week, Chelsea is sitting down with Allyson Felix – the most decorated U.S. track and field athlete of all time. They talk about Allyson’s journey to Olympic and World Championship gold, her decision to become an advocate for herself and others, and what needs to happen next in the fight for equality – in the workplace and beyond.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Chelsea Clinton and this season on in fact,
we're celebrating Women's History Month. I'll be talking with trailblazing
women at the top of their fields about their personal journeys,
the progress we've made, and how far we still have
to go. Today, I am thrilled to be joined by
(00:23):
Alison Felix, the most decorated US track and field athlete
of all time, to talk about the importance of advocating
for oneself and others in sports and in every workplace.
Born in Los Angeles, Allison started running in high school
and then when her first Olympic medal in two thousand
and four when she was just eighteen years old. From there,
she's been unstoppable, competing in every World Championship and Olympics since.
(00:47):
For the majority of her career, as you'll hear, Allison
thought of herself as a private person, separating her private
life from her public life as an athlete. But four
years ago, when Alison decided she wanted to have a
family and became pregny it, she made a gutsy choice
to take on an additional role as an advocate and
a voice for change. In Alison testified before Congress sharing
(01:09):
her own life threatening birthing experience, one that is painfully
not unique, to shine a light on the black maternal
mortality crisis in the United States. That same year, she
wrote an op ed for The New York Times bravely
detailing her fight for maternity protections from her then sponsored Nike,
leading the company to change its policy. And that was
(01:29):
only the start. I had the privilege of speaking with
Allison about the fight for fair maternal leaf policies in May.
A year later, she partnered with her current sponsor, Athleta
and the Women's Sports Foundation to create the Power of
She Fund, which provides grants to cover childcare costs so
mom athletes can compete and know their little ones are
well looked after. More recently, with her brother, she founded Safe,
(01:54):
a women sender lifestyle brand whose first product is a
sneaker designed just for women. In fact, Alison wore her
own specially created spikes when she competed last year at
the Tokyo Olympics. And at those Tokyo Olympics she won
two medals, bringing her Olympic total to eleven. That's an
addition to her nineteen World Championship medals, including the gold
(02:15):
she won just ten months after giving birth to her daughter, Alison.
Thank you for being here. Yeah, well, thank you so
much for having me. It's always so nice to talk
with you. You know, I think that most people know
you as well the most decorated dragon field athlete in
American history, and certainly know that you're that and so
(02:38):
much more. And I want to talk about this so
much more part in a moment, but I do want
to start with you as an athlete, and I wonder
if you could share just when you first started running
and when you first realized that this could be your career.
For me, I have a different story than a lot
of other Olympians. I actually kind of stumbled into the sport.
(02:58):
I found it in high school. I was a new
school and I didn't know anybody, and my family was like,
this is a great way to meet people and find friends,
and so that's why I came out for the team
and I did. I found like my best girlfriends like
to this day, but also fell in love with the sport.
And it was probably the middle of high school where
(03:18):
I realized I have a lot of potential. You know,
if I really dedicate myself, then I could really take
this somewhere, and it was pretty much a whirlwind because
I started my freshman year and then when I finished
high school the next year, I was in the Olympics.
So everything happened, I just got the chill. That's amazing.
It was very fast, but I found out, you know, quickly,
(03:41):
that was my passion. So when you were growing up,
even before you stepped onto a track, were there women
who inspired you, who you looked up to, either athletes
or not athletes. Since I didn't have any aspirations to
be an athlete, I really looked towards the people in
my family, so my mom, my grandma, like they were
(04:02):
the real life role models for me. You know, my
mom was an elementary school teacher, and so I wanted
to be just like her, and you know, really just
loved kids and all of that. And then eventually, when
I came into the sport, then I started to have
sporting heroes. I remember watching in nineties six the Olympics
and I saw Dominique Dawes, and I had no thoughts
(04:23):
of being an athlete or anything, but I was just
fascinated because here was this young girl who looked like
me doing something incredible. So I do remember being very
inspired by her. I was at the ninety six Olympics
and it was lucky enough to see Dominic Dawes and
are amazing American women gymnasts and other athletes as well,
and just was in awe of what like the human body, spirit,
(04:48):
and mind are capable of. And yet for all of
the amazing American women athletes who paved the way for you,
it wasn't always an easy journey, and you had, as
I understand it, a pretty painful realization of the discrimination
that you were confronting as a woman athlete who had
(05:11):
the temerity to also want to be a mom. Can
you share a little bit about when you realized that
there was discrimination in your life despite the fact that
you were already like multiple Olympic gold winner and had
already achieved more than most people could ever imagine. Yeah,
it was a really hard period for me. I became
a professional at seventeen years old, and you know, I
(05:32):
had seen women struggle through motherhood in the sport, but
I think being so young, it never affected me, and
so it's like I saw it in the distance, but
you know, I didn't really know the ins and outs
of it. And then you know, as I got older
and you know, more mature in the sport, I started
to understand what was actually happening. No one ever like
sat me down and was like, you shouldn't have kids
(05:52):
until you've accomplished this and this. But I feel like
I never saw a woman in my sports celeb rated
as a mother and competing. I saw struggle. I saw
a hardship. I saw women who hid pregnancies and tried
to secure new contracts and just all of this. So
when it came time for you know, I was really
(06:13):
excited to start a family, I was also terrified because
I was like, is this going to be my life
as well? And it was. It was crazy that in
and twenty nineteen that all of this was taking place,
the culture was really silenced regarding pregnancy in the sport,
and so I was really met with the reality that
(06:33):
I had to share my story in order to try
to push for some change, because I did feel like
if I didn't do it, you know, and at this point,
I had a daughter. I was going through this while
I was pregnant and eventually had my daughter, and I think,
you know, having a daughter really pushed me to speak
because I've been this really private person, but it was like, Okay,
(06:54):
I have to do this because if I don't, it's
gonna fall on her generation and this is just going
to be something that we never tackled. So Allison, I
know that while you were pregnant and then after you
had your daughter, you were in contract negotiations with Nike,
and it wasn't subtle or small. I mean, Nike wanted
(07:15):
to pay you, I think, seventy percent less than what
you've been paid before your daughter was born, and so
it wasn't like you were on the margins being told
you were somehow less then now that you were a mom.
I mean, it was substantial. Can you just share a
little bit about what happened my negotiations even before they
(07:36):
found out that I was pregnant, We're already at that
seventy less place after four Olympics. Yes, So, whether it
was me being too old or whatever it is, it
made me even more terrified to then share that I
was pregnant, because I knew it was just going to
keep becoming less and less and I wasn't sure if
there would be anything at all once I shared my pregnancy,
(07:58):
and so I wasn't shocked because it had been going
on for so long and I had seen other friends, teammates,
colleagues go through the same thing. But I thought, in
my position of having accomplished so many different things, that
it wouldn't happen to me. And so when I found
myself in that place, the money became whatever the money
(08:20):
was going to become. But what I could not stand
for was not having maternal protections. And so that essentially
was what I was asking for, was that, you know,
female athletes would be granted a certain amount of time
to be able to come back to top form to
not further be reduced in salary, because that's how these
contracts work, their performance based, and so even after you
(08:43):
have a baby, the way that things were in place
where that if Olympics or World Championships were three or
four months after you gave birth, if you don't show up,
make that team and get top three, then your salary
would be further reduced. And so so many mothers have
experiences that where they're barely making anything as a penalty
(09:04):
of having a child. They eventually told me that they
would give me a protection, but not tied to maternity.
It would be okay. For me. But the problem with
that was that it would not be okay for the
next person coming after me because there was no tie
to maternity. So that was the sticking point, and that
was really what I was fighting for. Your refusal to
(09:28):
accept that inequity really led to some pretty profound changes
and also led to a lot of other women coming forward. Yeah,
after the New York Times op ed, other colleagues came
out and spoke as well. I think there was just
power in that collective. I really start to understand that
I do have a platform and that it is okay
(09:48):
for me to speak on these issues that I'm facing.
It's like, once one story is shared, you know, you
realize you're not alone. You feel so isolated when you're
going through it. I felt before just so hyper focused
on performance and that maybe nobody would care if I
did speak up on something. But I was really met
with a lot of encouragement, and you know, I ended
(10:09):
up partying ways with Nike over this. But then after
I spoke up and colleagues and friends of mine did
as well. Then a couple of weeks later, you know,
the policy was changed, and now we're seeing women really
benefit from that clearly, equal pay for women, equal pay
for mothers is only part of the constellation of what
(10:30):
pregnant athletes and then new parent athletes deserve. Can you
talk a little bit about what you think really are
the necessary policies and procedures to ensure that pregnant athletes,
new parent athletes, especially new mom athletes, you really deserve
to be able to compete on an actual equal playing field. Yeah.
(10:52):
I think we just have to do a better job
of supporting mothers, but just women holistically. And I remember
when I came back to compete, my daughter was really young,
she was about eight months, and you know, I'm traveling
across the world with this newborn, and it was just
some of the just the practical things we're just not
in place. Whether it was because a woman had never
(11:14):
been at the table and people had not thought of
these things, but it was just such a struggle from
breastfeeding on the road, in in stadiums all around and
not having facilities to do that, and staying in hotels
with newborns, washing bottles, just some of the very basic things.
I remember going to World Championships and being given a
(11:35):
roommate and having you know, my daughter who was under
one with me and it just seemed wild to me
that you and your daughter had a roommate. Well, thankfully
we had the resources to rectify the situation, but I
always think about the people who don't, you know, the
athletes who would have to manage through a situation like that,
And so I think we can support in so many
(11:58):
better ways. We created a power she Fund to be
able to come alongside mom athletes and to be able
to financially support them with childcare when they're on the road.
So I think it's just thinking about things in a
different way and figuring out how can we better support
And what's the role of your male athlete colleagues here?
For the men who run track or for men who
(12:20):
want to be part of the solution, like what advice
do you have? And for men who may not think
this is relevant to them yet or at all, what
would you say? Yeah, I think we need men to
be good allies to amplify the story. There's so many
men in sports who have huge platforms, and I think
the shocking thing was a lot of people didn't know
(12:41):
that this was going on. And I think it only
would take you know, one strong man to stand alongside
and to shine a light on the situations and to
listen and to help. I think a lot of things
happen when we start to talk about things and have
these conversations and bring them to the forefront. And so
that that's what I always, you know, hope for is
(13:02):
is listening and supporting and really sharing the stories as well.
I completely agree that it's so important to drag conversations
out of the shadows, especially those that should never be
cloaked in in shame or embarrassment in the first place.
It's one of the reasons I've talked so much about
breastfeeding and pumping, even though I know it's made some
(13:24):
people uncomfortable, because I want people to then reflect on
why are they feeling uncomfortable, Like where do they think
they came from? What do they think their mothers did?
And I know that you've spoken so openly about breastfeeding
your daughter on the road, and I know you've also
spoken openly about your birthing experience and kind of what
happened when you were giving birth, and so I wonder
(13:47):
if you could share that with us. Two. Yeah, I
had a really traumatic birth experience. I gave birth at
thirty two weeks. And I felt great during my pregnancy.
You know, I was really healthy, I felt strong, I
was working out in very active. And then at thirty
two weeks, I went to the doctor for a normal appointment,
and my doctor had a lot of concerns and my
(14:09):
blood pressure was up and I was spilling protein and
so eventually I was sent to the hospital and diagnosed
with a severe case of preclampsia. And from their things
just kind of spiraled out of control, and it it
got very scary, and I ended up having an emergency
c section, and my daughter spent a month in the
NICK and it was just a really hard time period.
But I will say that my eyes were completely open
(14:32):
to a whole different world, and that was the maternal
mortality crisis that we're facing in America and that women
of color are facing. And I knew, I think somewhere
in my head I knew the statistics, but I just
never thought me, as a professional athlete with great health care,
would end up in this situation. And then the more
I educated myself and dove into this topic, I realized
(14:55):
that it has nothing to do with the healthcare necessarily,
but stories being believed pain being believed having to advocate
for your own health in the doctor's office, and I
just felt like if I could raise more awareness than
I wanted to do that because I know how hard
the situation was for myself. Also, one of the things
that I find really just hard to acknowledges that we
(15:21):
have a maternal mortality crisis in our country, that it
does disproportionately affect black and brown women, and also that
it's gotten worse over our lifetime. I think sometimes we
have this just visceral sense like things get better, like
things just naturally get better. This year is going to
be better than last year. And when we think about
maternal mortality in our country, women and especially black and
(15:42):
brown women are dying at higher rates today than when
you were born or when I was born, which is
so crazy, you know. And I think the thing to
me that is so shocking and heartbreaking but also hopeful,
is that so many of these issues complications death are preventable,
and it's just like we actually can do something about this,
(16:04):
but we do have to acknowledge that it is a
real issue and start to take those real steps to
fixing this very real problem. We'll be right back stay
with us. Was there ever a moment when you thought, Okay, thankfully,
(16:30):
my daughter is healthy, I'm healthy, I've done enough, or
did you quickly realize you did need to step in
as an advocate to use the platform that you have
to raise awareness both about the maternal mortality crisis in
our country and also about what you know can really
help make a difference to save moms and their babies lives. Yeah.
(16:51):
I definitely felt right away that it was important. I
think because I was also going through that whole contract issue,
you know, at the same time, and I had just
found my voice, you know, I realized the power of
using my voice, and so when I went through this experience,
I felt like, here's another area where you know, I
(17:12):
can really speak up and share and hopefully do something.
Or even if just one person is able to think
about this issue or educate themselves because they are at risk,
then I felt like it was necessary. So it was
kind of breaking outside of that box of being so
private and trying to be more vulnerable and and really
share some of the things that I've been through. And
(17:33):
do you have younger athletes now coming to you and
asking for advice on how to navigate their careers, I'm sure,
but also how to navigate their lives in which their
careers are a hugely important part, but not the totality
of their lives. Yeah, and it's something I never had
really thought about before, but it's been a really neat
(17:53):
position to be in. I feel like when I came
into the sport, there wasn't this sense of sisterhood necessarily.
It felt like there was a more competitive nature, where
like only one person could be successful, only one person
could cross over succeed, and so we didn't really talk
that much. And now I feel like the culture has shifted,
and it's been such a neat position to be able
(18:15):
to help younger athletes and to share and to celebrate
in their winds. And I have had a lot of
these conversations, even about maternal protections and talking to athletes
about what their contracts look like if they were to
have a child, and what should they ask for, what
should be standard, things that I never would have thought
of as a younger athlete. But being able to shed
some light on that and provide some advice has been
(18:38):
really great. Why do you think the culture has shifted? Like?
What what is different today that has enabled those conversations
to happen that wasn't there when you were starting out
at seventeen as a professional athlete. It's really interesting. I
don't know if there's one thing that happened, but I
think some of the walls are starting to break down.
(18:58):
I think I know for myself, I've tried to just
be more transparent with what goes on. I think we've
had this shift, and you know, we we're focusing more
on our mental health, and we have greater access to
each other and we know what's happening in our lives.
You know, people are sharing more. I hope from being
an older athlete in the sport and trying to model
(19:19):
that and trying to say, like, you know, we should
have these conversations, or let me help someone who's aside
of me and let me try to lift them up.
I have a foot in the door, let me try
to bring them along. And so I hope that you know,
as more athletes try to do that, that it has
shifted the culture more. Do you think it's also a
shift in in coaching, in in sponsorship, partly because athletes
(19:43):
like you, thankfully have demanded more for everyone. I think
we're starting to see that we can go a non
traditional route. I think earlier on you felt like there
was one way to do things, and that was it.
You get a big footwear sponsor and you run fast,
you have performances, and that's how you you make your thing.
But I think we're seeing that you can go to
a smaller company. They can support you as a whole
(20:06):
person and celebrate these different aspects of you and you
can be successful in that way. So I do think
as we take a different approach to sponsorship that has
helped as well. And you're talking about being more involved
in having more agency and authorship over not only your contracts,
but what you're doing and what your name and your
(20:26):
brand are attached to. And I do want to ask
you about the sneaker that you created. Did you always
want to design your own shoe? How did that happen?
It actually just happened very authentically and out of necessity.
So out of necessity meaning like you were like, I
need better shoes, I'll go create one. Essentially, I had
(20:48):
been to four Olympics, you know, and I had part
of ways with Nike, I had a new apparel sponsorship
with Athleta, and I was really inspired by the way
they did business, you know, percent female lead, and so
I was like, I want to find this in footwear.
I'm a runner, Like I'm preparing for the fifth Olympics.
How do I not have a footwear sponsor? And you know,
(21:09):
I think there's a lot of reasons to that. I
think there were definitely consequences of speaking out in regards
to Nike, and I had been a heavily branded athlete,
but I was just exhausted of trying to get companies
to see my value and my worth and all of that.
And so I'm sorry we paused here for something. You're
like trying to get companies to see your value after
four Olympics, I know, but it was my reality, like
(21:31):
it was. It was so frustrating. So I was talking
to my brother and I was just sharing with him,
like I feel defeated. How am I at this place
and I'm still begging begging for things? And he just
looked at me. He was like, well, what if we
did this ourselves? And what if we you know, And
I was like, create a shoe company like that seems massive.
But the more I sat with it, I was like, wow,
(21:52):
you know, here is an opportunity instead of asking for
change to be and to create that change, and so
we did it real. We created Sage, which is a
lifestyle brand for women, and our first product was a
lifestyle sneaker and you know, it's designed, engineered by women,
It's specifically made for the female foot. And my proudest
moment was going to the Tokyo Olympics and competing in
(22:15):
shoes that my brand made. And I felt like for
anybody who had been told like they were done too
old your mom, now you know I was able to
come up against that and really be that representation. And
so it was so much bigger than the performance, but
it was a really proud moment for me. Can you
just tell us a little bit more about designing the
shoe and how you found the designers to work with.
(22:38):
Was it a long process? Is short process? How many
laps or miles or whatever the right metric is? Did
you have to run in like different models to find
the right shoe? Just how did the process work? Yeah?
I started out obviously I was diving into a whole
different industry and so I was like, I know that
I want this engineered by a woman, and so I
(22:58):
literally just reached out to Tiffany Beers, who is a
legendary engineer who has made iconic sneakers, and I was like,
you know, she's the top of the top. Maybe she
can lead me in the right path. And I think, again,
it goes back to that sense of sisterhood, because she
was just so open and welcoming to me, and she
really educated me on an even bigger issue that we
(23:21):
were facing, and that's that shoes have historically been made
for men, so shoes made on a last, which is
essentially just a mold of a foot, and it's a
man's mold, a man's foot that we use to make
women shoes. And I was like, that's absurd. So right away,
you know, we were able to dive in and tackle
issues like that. But it was really creating the team,
(23:42):
and she really connected and led us in the right path,
and we started to build and to create, and it
was so much fun to be a part of the
process because I have always loved shoes and to really understand,
you know, how they're made and the specifics ins and outs.
And then obviously there was a ton of trials, you know,
to be able to make this shoot very technical and
(24:05):
able for me to compete in it at the highest level.
How are you with your brother and with the team
you're building, building a culture to help support women, to
help support moms. What about your experiences with Nike and
in your competitions have you taken and what have you
changed to build a different, better, more affirmative culture. We
(24:29):
are just aligned in the vision that we exist for
women to see them, to know them, for them to
feel valued, and that is really at the core of
everyone who comes on board, that they really see that
clearly and that we are trying to serve and create
something that you know, women haven't had before. And that's
always at the center of everything and making sure that
(24:50):
whether it's our internal maternity policy or just even listening
to how we can support women on the team and
do things better. And I think because it comes from
the place of never wanting anyone to feel the way
that I did, it's always at the forefront of every
decision that we make in consideration and how we build
the brand. And I just have to belabor the point
(25:13):
of how much I love that it was your brother
who said you should do this, because we do need,
you know, male allies, and we do need men to
continue to create space to support women, to champion women,
and to follow women. And I just think it's really powerful.
(25:34):
It is, and he's been on the journey with me
from the very beginning. We get to work together and
the on the sports side of things as well, and
to have exactly to your point, to have that encouragement
and that confidence in me to push me and challenge
me to step out and to do things. And too,
he always reminded me, you know, when I was really
(25:54):
unsure and scared about speaking out about some of the issues,
he was like, you know, even if your voice shakes,
you can still use it great advice. And I just
held onto that because it was like, I am scared,
I am nervous. This is outside of my comfort zone.
But the fact that you believe in me and I
have you for support, it just meant a lot. We're
(26:17):
taking a quick break, stay with us. When we spoke
during COVID, I was so moved by kind of you
sharing how some of the kids in your neighborhood would
(26:38):
like make signs for you as you were out training
because you couldn't train on a track like you were
working from home. But you, unlike those of us who
can be on screens had to still go outside, you
go for your runs. And I just I found that
so incredibly moving, Alison, that you're community quite literally still
showed up for you even when there were so much
(26:59):
uncertain t in the world. It was such a beautiful thing.
And since I came home from the Olympics and my neighborhood,
like one night the door rung. It was like I
think it was like the day I got back from
Tokyo and a huge group of them were outside and
the kids had made cards and they had brought balloons,
and it was the sweetest thing, and I think they
(27:20):
really felt like they were there with me. They saw
me training and it was this very like bizarre thing
that happened where you know, I was training on the
streets in my neighborhood and they got to be a
part of it. But it was such a really cool
moment to see, you know, everybody really involved in supporting me.
Have you talked to your daughter about creating your own shoe,
(27:42):
creating your own company, and if so, what do you
tell her about the origin story of why this was
so important for you to do, including as her mom. Yeah,
obviously she doesn't understand everything yet, but I am so
excited to eventually break down on all of the stories
and that she has been literally the motivation and the
(28:04):
driving force behind it. I often tell her a different
things that I'm doing at work, or my husband will
bring her out to a training session, and I can't
wait until she can understand. And I think one of
the biggest things that I want her to get is
that you can never let someone put a limit on
you or tell you what you can do, what you're
(28:25):
not capable, what you're too old to do. And our
family is proof of that. You know that we were
able to overcome that, and so as she gets older,
I'm excited that she can learn and be inspired by
that and set her own path. What advice would you
give to any woman who recognized the injustice and discrimination
(28:46):
in their workplace? Because I don't want people to listen
to our conversation and think, oh, like, I haven't been
to four Olympics. Nobody would listen to me. Yeah, I
think it doesn't have to be this huge thing. It
doesn't have to You don't have to have a big platform.
You know, you can start to have impact within our
own circles. At work, and I think it's starting small.
Sometimes it's having conversation in the forefront gets power in
(29:10):
the collective. You know, if you're able to come together
with another person, I think your voice becomes even stronger,
and being able to call out an injustice, being able
to support somebody else as they come forward. So I
think it is wherever we are bringing things to light
and understanding that it's okay if it takes you some time.
It took me a long time to get to the
(29:31):
place of really speaking out. But I think we can
do little things and take these small steps before having
to do it on a very grand scale. And just
the last question I want to ask is one that
we're asking everyone on the podcast, given we are talking
during Women's History Month, which is just is there one
kind of statistic or fact around women in the workplace,
(29:54):
whether in sports or more broadly, that either really makes
you angry and then motivate you through the anchor or
that gives you hope. One that really fires me up
every time I hear it is the statistic about the
visibility of women in sports. Women received only four percent
of dedicated media coverage. Four Yes, we have to do
(30:18):
better and I think that there's so much material, there's
so many stories there women doing incredible things, and you know,
being able to shine a light on that. I think
that also encompasses tackling so many issues. So that's the
one that always fires me up to do more. And
so Alison, for those of us who have never been
(30:39):
to Olympics or one a medal, who maybe never even
made it onto you know, a j V or of
our city team, what can we do to try to
change that? Is that where we spend our consumer dollars
on supporting certain brands, is that ensuring we're watching our
kind of women athletes compete? Like, how do we for
those of us who you know are very far from
(31:01):
you and your achievements, how do how do we try
to be part of that positive change? Yeah? I think
it's showing up and supporting women in sports. And that
is watching women's sports, showing up in the stadiums, going
to a basketball game, taking your your kids, your sons,
and your daughters, to support women and to show them
that they're amazing role models. They are just as capable
(31:22):
as men, and they're exciting and exciting to watch and
and really support in that way. And so I think
that's how we begin to start to get greater coverage
and in return more resources to be able to support
you know, a few athletes. Well. Shortly before COVID Closer World,
I did take my older daughter and son to w
(31:43):
NBA game, and I see how much it matters, just
in our own family that sons don't think it's strange
that they look up to and are riveted by women
in sports, and I think that is as important as
my daughter no feeling like there are people who look
like who are visible and achieving extraordinary things that inspire
(32:05):
and invigorate her too. Absolutely, I think we're seeing it
more and more. I saw recently a young boy wearing
a woman's basketball jersey and I thought that was the
coolest thing, because yeah, it's I think we're starting to
change that at a very young age, and it's really
cool to see. Well, thank you so much, and it's
just such an honor and privilege to always be in
(32:26):
your company, and thank you for your time today and
all you're doing. Thank you so much for having me,
and yeah, it's always enjoy to speak with you. You
can find Alison Felix on social media at Alison Felix,
and you can learn more about Safe. That's s a
Y s h at safe dot com. In Fact is
(32:47):
brought to you by I Heart Radio. We are produced
by a mighty group of women and one amazing man,
Erica Goodmanson, Mart Harror, Sarah Horrowitz, Jesmin Molly, and Justin Wright,
with help from n. C. Hoffman, Barry Laurie, Joyce Kuban,
Julie Supran, Mike Taylor, and Emily Young. Original music is
by Justin Wright. If you like this episode of In Fact,
(33:10):
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If you really want to help us out, please leave
a review on Apple Podcasts.
Hi, I'm Chelsea Clinton and this season on in fact,
we're celebrating Women's History Month. I'll be talking with trailblazing
women at the top of their fields about their personal journeys,
the progress we've made, and how far we still have
to go. Today, I am thrilled to be joined by
(00:23):
Alison Felix, the most decorated US track and field athlete
of all time, to talk about the importance of advocating
for oneself and others in sports and in every workplace.
Born in Los Angeles, Allison started running in high school
and then when her first Olympic medal in two thousand
and four when she was just eighteen years old. From there,
she's been unstoppable, competing in every World Championship and Olympics since.
(00:47):
For the majority of her career, as you'll hear, Allison
thought of herself as a private person, separating her private
life from her public life as an athlete. But four
years ago, when Alison decided she wanted to have a
family and became pregny it, she made a gutsy choice
to take on an additional role as an advocate and
a voice for change. In Alison testified before Congress sharing
(01:09):
her own life threatening birthing experience, one that is painfully
not unique, to shine a light on the black maternal
mortality crisis in the United States. That same year, she
wrote an op ed for The New York Times bravely
detailing her fight for maternity protections from her then sponsored Nike,
leading the company to change its policy. And that was
(01:29):
only the start. I had the privilege of speaking with
Allison about the fight for fair maternal leaf policies in May.
A year later, she partnered with her current sponsor, Athleta
and the Women's Sports Foundation to create the Power of
She Fund, which provides grants to cover childcare costs so
mom athletes can compete and know their little ones are
well looked after. More recently, with her brother, she founded Safe,
(01:54):
a women sender lifestyle brand whose first product is a
sneaker designed just for women. In fact, Alison wore her
own specially created spikes when she competed last year at
the Tokyo Olympics. And at those Tokyo Olympics she won
two medals, bringing her Olympic total to eleven. That's an
addition to her nineteen World Championship medals, including the gold
(02:15):
she won just ten months after giving birth to her daughter, Alison.
Thank you for being here. Yeah, well, thank you so
much for having me. It's always so nice to talk
with you. You know, I think that most people know
you as well the most decorated dragon field athlete in
American history, and certainly know that you're that and so
(02:38):
much more. And I want to talk about this so
much more part in a moment, but I do want
to start with you as an athlete, and I wonder
if you could share just when you first started running
and when you first realized that this could be your career.
For me, I have a different story than a lot
of other Olympians. I actually kind of stumbled into the sport.
(02:58):
I found it in high school. I was a new
school and I didn't know anybody, and my family was like,
this is a great way to meet people and find friends,
and so that's why I came out for the team
and I did. I found like my best girlfriends like
to this day, but also fell in love with the sport.
And it was probably the middle of high school where
(03:18):
I realized I have a lot of potential. You know,
if I really dedicate myself, then I could really take
this somewhere, and it was pretty much a whirlwind because
I started my freshman year and then when I finished
high school the next year, I was in the Olympics.
So everything happened, I just got the chill. That's amazing.
It was very fast, but I found out, you know, quickly,
(03:41):
that was my passion. So when you were growing up,
even before you stepped onto a track, were there women
who inspired you, who you looked up to, either athletes
or not athletes. Since I didn't have any aspirations to
be an athlete, I really looked towards the people in
my family, so my mom, my grandma, like they were
(04:02):
the real life role models for me. You know, my
mom was an elementary school teacher, and so I wanted
to be just like her, and you know, really just
loved kids and all of that. And then eventually, when
I came into the sport, then I started to have
sporting heroes. I remember watching in nineties six the Olympics
and I saw Dominique Dawes, and I had no thoughts
(04:23):
of being an athlete or anything, but I was just
fascinated because here was this young girl who looked like
me doing something incredible. So I do remember being very
inspired by her. I was at the ninety six Olympics
and it was lucky enough to see Dominic Dawes and
are amazing American women gymnasts and other athletes as well,
and just was in awe of what like the human body, spirit,
(04:48):
and mind are capable of. And yet for all of
the amazing American women athletes who paved the way for you,
it wasn't always an easy journey, and you had, as
I understand it, a pretty painful realization of the discrimination
that you were confronting as a woman athlete who had
(05:11):
the temerity to also want to be a mom. Can
you share a little bit about when you realized that
there was discrimination in your life despite the fact that
you were already like multiple Olympic gold winner and had
already achieved more than most people could ever imagine. Yeah,
it was a really hard period for me. I became
a professional at seventeen years old, and you know, I
(05:32):
had seen women struggle through motherhood in the sport, but
I think being so young, it never affected me, and
so it's like I saw it in the distance, but
you know, I didn't really know the ins and outs
of it. And then you know, as I got older
and you know, more mature in the sport, I started
to understand what was actually happening. No one ever like
sat me down and was like, you shouldn't have kids
(05:52):
until you've accomplished this and this. But I feel like
I never saw a woman in my sports celeb rated
as a mother and competing. I saw struggle. I saw
a hardship. I saw women who hid pregnancies and tried
to secure new contracts and just all of this. So
when it came time for you know, I was really
(06:13):
excited to start a family, I was also terrified because
I was like, is this going to be my life
as well? And it was. It was crazy that in
and twenty nineteen that all of this was taking place,
the culture was really silenced regarding pregnancy in the sport,
and so I was really met with the reality that
(06:33):
I had to share my story in order to try
to push for some change, because I did feel like
if I didn't do it, you know, and at this point,
I had a daughter. I was going through this while
I was pregnant and eventually had my daughter, and I think,
you know, having a daughter really pushed me to speak
because I've been this really private person, but it was like, Okay,
(06:54):
I have to do this because if I don't, it's
gonna fall on her generation and this is just going
to be something that we never tackled. So Allison, I
know that while you were pregnant and then after you
had your daughter, you were in contract negotiations with Nike,
and it wasn't subtle or small. I mean, Nike wanted
(07:15):
to pay you, I think, seventy percent less than what
you've been paid before your daughter was born, and so
it wasn't like you were on the margins being told
you were somehow less then now that you were a mom.
I mean, it was substantial. Can you just share a
little bit about what happened my negotiations even before they
(07:36):
found out that I was pregnant, We're already at that
seventy less place after four Olympics. Yes, So, whether it
was me being too old or whatever it is, it
made me even more terrified to then share that I
was pregnant, because I knew it was just going to
keep becoming less and less and I wasn't sure if
there would be anything at all once I shared my pregnancy,
(07:58):
and so I wasn't shocked because it had been going
on for so long and I had seen other friends, teammates,
colleagues go through the same thing. But I thought, in
my position of having accomplished so many different things, that
it wouldn't happen to me. And so when I found
myself in that place, the money became whatever the money
(08:20):
was going to become. But what I could not stand
for was not having maternal protections. And so that essentially
was what I was asking for, was that, you know,
female athletes would be granted a certain amount of time
to be able to come back to top form to
not further be reduced in salary, because that's how these
contracts work, their performance based, and so even after you
(08:43):
have a baby, the way that things were in place
where that if Olympics or World Championships were three or
four months after you gave birth, if you don't show up,
make that team and get top three, then your salary
would be further reduced. And so so many mothers have
experiences that where they're barely making anything as a penalty
(09:04):
of having a child. They eventually told me that they
would give me a protection, but not tied to maternity.
It would be okay. For me. But the problem with
that was that it would not be okay for the
next person coming after me because there was no tie
to maternity. So that was the sticking point, and that
was really what I was fighting for. Your refusal to
(09:28):
accept that inequity really led to some pretty profound changes
and also led to a lot of other women coming forward. Yeah,
after the New York Times op ed, other colleagues came
out and spoke as well. I think there was just
power in that collective. I really start to understand that
I do have a platform and that it is okay
(09:48):
for me to speak on these issues that I'm facing.
It's like, once one story is shared, you know, you
realize you're not alone. You feel so isolated when you're
going through it. I felt before just so hyper focused
on performance and that maybe nobody would care if I
did speak up on something. But I was really met
with a lot of encouragement, and you know, I ended
(10:09):
up partying ways with Nike over this. But then after
I spoke up and colleagues and friends of mine did
as well. Then a couple of weeks later, you know,
the policy was changed, and now we're seeing women really
benefit from that clearly, equal pay for women, equal pay
for mothers is only part of the constellation of what
(10:30):
pregnant athletes and then new parent athletes deserve. Can you
talk a little bit about what you think really are
the necessary policies and procedures to ensure that pregnant athletes,
new parent athletes, especially new mom athletes, you really deserve
to be able to compete on an actual equal playing field. Yeah.
(10:52):
I think we just have to do a better job
of supporting mothers, but just women holistically. And I remember
when I came back to compete, my daughter was really young,
she was about eight months, and you know, I'm traveling
across the world with this newborn, and it was just
some of the just the practical things we're just not
in place. Whether it was because a woman had never
(11:14):
been at the table and people had not thought of
these things, but it was just such a struggle from
breastfeeding on the road, in in stadiums all around and
not having facilities to do that, and staying in hotels
with newborns, washing bottles, just some of the very basic things.
I remember going to World Championships and being given a
(11:35):
roommate and having you know, my daughter who was under
one with me and it just seemed wild to me
that you and your daughter had a roommate. Well, thankfully
we had the resources to rectify the situation, but I
always think about the people who don't, you know, the
athletes who would have to manage through a situation like that,
And so I think we can support in so many
(11:58):
better ways. We created a power she Fund to be
able to come alongside mom athletes and to be able
to financially support them with childcare when they're on the road.
So I think it's just thinking about things in a
different way and figuring out how can we better support
And what's the role of your male athlete colleagues here?
For the men who run track or for men who
(12:20):
want to be part of the solution, like what advice
do you have? And for men who may not think
this is relevant to them yet or at all, what
would you say? Yeah, I think we need men to
be good allies to amplify the story. There's so many
men in sports who have huge platforms, and I think
the shocking thing was a lot of people didn't know
(12:41):
that this was going on. And I think it only
would take you know, one strong man to stand alongside
and to shine a light on the situations and to
listen and to help. I think a lot of things
happen when we start to talk about things and have
these conversations and bring them to the forefront. And so
that that's what I always, you know, hope for is
(13:02):
is listening and supporting and really sharing the stories as well.
I completely agree that it's so important to drag conversations
out of the shadows, especially those that should never be
cloaked in in shame or embarrassment in the first place.
It's one of the reasons I've talked so much about
breastfeeding and pumping, even though I know it's made some
(13:24):
people uncomfortable, because I want people to then reflect on
why are they feeling uncomfortable, Like where do they think
they came from? What do they think their mothers did?
And I know that you've spoken so openly about breastfeeding
your daughter on the road, and I know you've also
spoken openly about your birthing experience and kind of what
happened when you were giving birth, and so I wonder
(13:47):
if you could share that with us. Two. Yeah, I
had a really traumatic birth experience. I gave birth at
thirty two weeks. And I felt great during my pregnancy.
You know, I was really healthy, I felt strong, I
was working out in very active. And then at thirty
two weeks, I went to the doctor for a normal appointment,
and my doctor had a lot of concerns and my
(14:09):
blood pressure was up and I was spilling protein and
so eventually I was sent to the hospital and diagnosed
with a severe case of preclampsia. And from their things
just kind of spiraled out of control, and it it
got very scary, and I ended up having an emergency
c section, and my daughter spent a month in the
NICK and it was just a really hard time period.
But I will say that my eyes were completely open
(14:32):
to a whole different world, and that was the maternal
mortality crisis that we're facing in America and that women
of color are facing. And I knew, I think somewhere
in my head I knew the statistics, but I just
never thought me, as a professional athlete with great health care,
would end up in this situation. And then the more
I educated myself and dove into this topic, I realized
(14:55):
that it has nothing to do with the healthcare necessarily,
but stories being believed pain being believed having to advocate
for your own health in the doctor's office, and I
just felt like if I could raise more awareness than
I wanted to do that because I know how hard
the situation was for myself. Also, one of the things
that I find really just hard to acknowledges that we
(15:21):
have a maternal mortality crisis in our country, that it
does disproportionately affect black and brown women, and also that
it's gotten worse over our lifetime. I think sometimes we
have this just visceral sense like things get better, like
things just naturally get better. This year is going to
be better than last year. And when we think about
maternal mortality in our country, women and especially black and
(15:42):
brown women are dying at higher rates today than when
you were born or when I was born, which is
so crazy, you know. And I think the thing to
me that is so shocking and heartbreaking but also hopeful,
is that so many of these issues complications death are preventable,
and it's just like we actually can do something about this,
(16:04):
but we do have to acknowledge that it is a
real issue and start to take those real steps to
fixing this very real problem. We'll be right back stay
with us. Was there ever a moment when you thought, Okay, thankfully,
(16:30):
my daughter is healthy, I'm healthy, I've done enough, or
did you quickly realize you did need to step in
as an advocate to use the platform that you have
to raise awareness both about the maternal mortality crisis in
our country and also about what you know can really
help make a difference to save moms and their babies lives. Yeah.
(16:51):
I definitely felt right away that it was important. I
think because I was also going through that whole contract issue,
you know, at the same time, and I had just
found my voice, you know, I realized the power of
using my voice, and so when I went through this experience,
I felt like, here's another area where you know, I
(17:12):
can really speak up and share and hopefully do something.
Or even if just one person is able to think
about this issue or educate themselves because they are at risk,
then I felt like it was necessary. So it was
kind of breaking outside of that box of being so
private and trying to be more vulnerable and and really
share some of the things that I've been through. And
(17:33):
do you have younger athletes now coming to you and
asking for advice on how to navigate their careers, I'm sure,
but also how to navigate their lives in which their
careers are a hugely important part, but not the totality
of their lives. Yeah, and it's something I never had
really thought about before, but it's been a really neat
(17:53):
position to be in. I feel like when I came
into the sport, there wasn't this sense of sisterhood necessarily.
It felt like there was a more competitive nature, where
like only one person could be successful, only one person
could cross over succeed, and so we didn't really talk
that much. And now I feel like the culture has shifted,
and it's been such a neat position to be able
(18:15):
to help younger athletes and to share and to celebrate
in their winds. And I have had a lot of
these conversations, even about maternal protections and talking to athletes
about what their contracts look like if they were to
have a child, and what should they ask for, what
should be standard, things that I never would have thought
of as a younger athlete. But being able to shed
some light on that and provide some advice has been
(18:38):
really great. Why do you think the culture has shifted? Like?
What what is different today that has enabled those conversations
to happen that wasn't there when you were starting out
at seventeen as a professional athlete. It's really interesting. I
don't know if there's one thing that happened, but I
think some of the walls are starting to break down.
(18:58):
I think I know for myself, I've tried to just
be more transparent with what goes on. I think we've
had this shift, and you know, we we're focusing more
on our mental health, and we have greater access to
each other and we know what's happening in our lives.
You know, people are sharing more. I hope from being
an older athlete in the sport and trying to model
(19:19):
that and trying to say, like, you know, we should
have these conversations, or let me help someone who's aside
of me and let me try to lift them up.
I have a foot in the door, let me try
to bring them along. And so I hope that you know,
as more athletes try to do that, that it has
shifted the culture more. Do you think it's also a
shift in in coaching, in in sponsorship, partly because athletes
(19:43):
like you, thankfully have demanded more for everyone. I think
we're starting to see that we can go a non
traditional route. I think earlier on you felt like there
was one way to do things, and that was it.
You get a big footwear sponsor and you run fast,
you have performances, and that's how you you make your thing.
But I think we're seeing that you can go to
a smaller company. They can support you as a whole
(20:06):
person and celebrate these different aspects of you and you
can be successful in that way. So I do think
as we take a different approach to sponsorship that has
helped as well. And you're talking about being more involved
in having more agency and authorship over not only your contracts,
but what you're doing and what your name and your
(20:26):
brand are attached to. And I do want to ask
you about the sneaker that you created. Did you always
want to design your own shoe? How did that happen?
It actually just happened very authentically and out of necessity.
So out of necessity meaning like you were like, I
need better shoes, I'll go create one. Essentially, I had
(20:48):
been to four Olympics, you know, and I had part
of ways with Nike, I had a new apparel sponsorship
with Athleta, and I was really inspired by the way
they did business, you know, percent female lead, and so
I was like, I want to find this in footwear.
I'm a runner, Like I'm preparing for the fifth Olympics.
How do I not have a footwear sponsor? And you know,
(21:09):
I think there's a lot of reasons to that. I
think there were definitely consequences of speaking out in regards
to Nike, and I had been a heavily branded athlete,
but I was just exhausted of trying to get companies
to see my value and my worth and all of that.
And so I'm sorry we paused here for something. You're
like trying to get companies to see your value after
four Olympics, I know, but it was my reality, like
(21:31):
it was. It was so frustrating. So I was talking
to my brother and I was just sharing with him,
like I feel defeated. How am I at this place
and I'm still begging begging for things? And he just
looked at me. He was like, well, what if we
did this ourselves? And what if we you know, And
I was like, create a shoe company like that seems massive.
But the more I sat with it, I was like, wow,
(21:52):
you know, here is an opportunity instead of asking for
change to be and to create that change, and so
we did it real. We created Sage, which is a
lifestyle brand for women, and our first product was a
lifestyle sneaker and you know, it's designed, engineered by women,
It's specifically made for the female foot. And my proudest
moment was going to the Tokyo Olympics and competing in
(22:15):
shoes that my brand made. And I felt like for
anybody who had been told like they were done too
old your mom, now you know I was able to
come up against that and really be that representation. And
so it was so much bigger than the performance, but
it was a really proud moment for me. Can you
just tell us a little bit more about designing the
shoe and how you found the designers to work with.
(22:38):
Was it a long process? Is short process? How many
laps or miles or whatever the right metric is? Did
you have to run in like different models to find
the right shoe? Just how did the process work? Yeah?
I started out obviously I was diving into a whole
different industry and so I was like, I know that
I want this engineered by a woman, and so I
(22:58):
literally just reached out to Tiffany Beers, who is a
legendary engineer who has made iconic sneakers, and I was like,
you know, she's the top of the top. Maybe she
can lead me in the right path. And I think, again,
it goes back to that sense of sisterhood, because she
was just so open and welcoming to me, and she
really educated me on an even bigger issue that we
(23:21):
were facing, and that's that shoes have historically been made
for men, so shoes made on a last, which is
essentially just a mold of a foot, and it's a
man's mold, a man's foot that we use to make
women shoes. And I was like, that's absurd. So right away,
you know, we were able to dive in and tackle
issues like that. But it was really creating the team,
(23:42):
and she really connected and led us in the right path,
and we started to build and to create, and it
was so much fun to be a part of the
process because I have always loved shoes and to really understand,
you know, how they're made and the specifics ins and outs.
And then obviously there was a ton of trials, you know,
to be able to make this shoot very technical and
(24:05):
able for me to compete in it at the highest level.
How are you with your brother and with the team
you're building, building a culture to help support women, to
help support moms. What about your experiences with Nike and
in your competitions have you taken and what have you
changed to build a different, better, more affirmative culture. We
(24:29):
are just aligned in the vision that we exist for
women to see them, to know them, for them to
feel valued, and that is really at the core of
everyone who comes on board, that they really see that
clearly and that we are trying to serve and create
something that you know, women haven't had before. And that's
always at the center of everything and making sure that
(24:50):
whether it's our internal maternity policy or just even listening
to how we can support women on the team and
do things better. And I think because it comes from
the place of never wanting anyone to feel the way
that I did, it's always at the forefront of every
decision that we make in consideration and how we build
the brand. And I just have to belabor the point
(25:13):
of how much I love that it was your brother
who said you should do this, because we do need,
you know, male allies, and we do need men to
continue to create space to support women, to champion women,
and to follow women. And I just think it's really powerful.
(25:34):
It is, and he's been on the journey with me
from the very beginning. We get to work together and
the on the sports side of things as well, and
to have exactly to your point, to have that encouragement
and that confidence in me to push me and challenge
me to step out and to do things. And too,
he always reminded me, you know, when I was really
(25:54):
unsure and scared about speaking out about some of the issues,
he was like, you know, even if your voice shakes,
you can still use it great advice. And I just
held onto that because it was like, I am scared,
I am nervous. This is outside of my comfort zone.
But the fact that you believe in me and I
have you for support, it just meant a lot. We're
(26:17):
taking a quick break, stay with us. When we spoke
during COVID, I was so moved by kind of you
sharing how some of the kids in your neighborhood would
(26:38):
like make signs for you as you were out training
because you couldn't train on a track like you were
working from home. But you, unlike those of us who
can be on screens had to still go outside, you
go for your runs. And I just I found that
so incredibly moving, Alison, that you're community quite literally still
showed up for you even when there were so much
(26:59):
uncertain t in the world. It was such a beautiful thing.
And since I came home from the Olympics and my neighborhood,
like one night the door rung. It was like I
think it was like the day I got back from
Tokyo and a huge group of them were outside and
the kids had made cards and they had brought balloons,
and it was the sweetest thing, and I think they
(27:20):
really felt like they were there with me. They saw
me training and it was this very like bizarre thing
that happened where you know, I was training on the
streets in my neighborhood and they got to be a
part of it. But it was such a really cool
moment to see, you know, everybody really involved in supporting me.
Have you talked to your daughter about creating your own shoe,
(27:42):
creating your own company, and if so, what do you
tell her about the origin story of why this was
so important for you to do, including as her mom. Yeah,
obviously she doesn't understand everything yet, but I am so
excited to eventually break down on all of the stories
and that she has been literally the motivation and the
(28:04):
driving force behind it. I often tell her a different
things that I'm doing at work, or my husband will
bring her out to a training session, and I can't
wait until she can understand. And I think one of
the biggest things that I want her to get is
that you can never let someone put a limit on
you or tell you what you can do, what you're
(28:25):
not capable, what you're too old to do. And our
family is proof of that. You know that we were
able to overcome that, and so as she gets older,
I'm excited that she can learn and be inspired by
that and set her own path. What advice would you
give to any woman who recognized the injustice and discrimination
(28:46):
in their workplace? Because I don't want people to listen
to our conversation and think, oh, like, I haven't been
to four Olympics. Nobody would listen to me. Yeah, I
think it doesn't have to be this huge thing. It
doesn't have to You don't have to have a big platform.
You know, you can start to have impact within our
own circles. At work, and I think it's starting small.
Sometimes it's having conversation in the forefront gets power in
(29:10):
the collective. You know, if you're able to come together
with another person, I think your voice becomes even stronger,
and being able to call out an injustice, being able
to support somebody else as they come forward. So I
think it is wherever we are bringing things to light
and understanding that it's okay if it takes you some time.
It took me a long time to get to the
(29:31):
place of really speaking out. But I think we can
do little things and take these small steps before having
to do it on a very grand scale. And just
the last question I want to ask is one that
we're asking everyone on the podcast, given we are talking
during Women's History Month, which is just is there one
kind of statistic or fact around women in the workplace,
(29:54):
whether in sports or more broadly, that either really makes
you angry and then motivate you through the anchor or
that gives you hope. One that really fires me up
every time I hear it is the statistic about the
visibility of women in sports. Women received only four percent
of dedicated media coverage. Four Yes, we have to do
(30:18):
better and I think that there's so much material, there's
so many stories there women doing incredible things, and you know,
being able to shine a light on that. I think
that also encompasses tackling so many issues. So that's the
one that always fires me up to do more. And
so Alison, for those of us who have never been
(30:39):
to Olympics or one a medal, who maybe never even
made it onto you know, a j V or of
our city team, what can we do to try to
change that? Is that where we spend our consumer dollars
on supporting certain brands, is that ensuring we're watching our
kind of women athletes compete? Like, how do we for
those of us who you know are very far from
(31:01):
you and your achievements, how do how do we try
to be part of that positive change? Yeah? I think
it's showing up and supporting women in sports. And that
is watching women's sports, showing up in the stadiums, going
to a basketball game, taking your your kids, your sons,
and your daughters, to support women and to show them
that they're amazing role models. They are just as capable
(31:22):
as men, and they're exciting and exciting to watch and
and really support in that way. And so I think
that's how we begin to start to get greater coverage
and in return more resources to be able to support
you know, a few athletes. Well. Shortly before COVID Closer World,
I did take my older daughter and son to w
(31:43):
NBA game, and I see how much it matters, just
in our own family that sons don't think it's strange
that they look up to and are riveted by women
in sports, and I think that is as important as
my daughter no feeling like there are people who look
like who are visible and achieving extraordinary things that inspire
(32:05):
and invigorate her too. Absolutely, I think we're seeing it
more and more. I saw recently a young boy wearing
a woman's basketball jersey and I thought that was the
coolest thing, because yeah, it's I think we're starting to
change that at a very young age, and it's really
cool to see. Well, thank you so much, and it's
just such an honor and privilege to always be in
(32:26):
your company, and thank you for your time today and
all you're doing. Thank you so much for having me,
and yeah, it's always enjoy to speak with you. You
can find Alison Felix on social media at Alison Felix,
and you can learn more about Safe. That's s a
Y s h at safe dot com. In Fact is
(32:47):
brought to you by I Heart Radio. We are produced
by a mighty group of women and one amazing man,
Erica Goodmanson, Mart Harror, Sarah Horrowitz, Jesmin Molly, and Justin Wright,
with help from n. C. Hoffman, Barry Laurie, Joyce Kuban,
Julie Supran, Mike Taylor, and Emily Young. Original music is
by Justin Wright. If you like this episode of In Fact,
(33:10):
please make sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode,
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