QLS Classic: Tariq "Black Thought" Trotter

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
As we gear up for the twenty twenty five Roots Picnic,
why not listen back to QLs with Tarik Trotter also
known as black Boy, And this may have been the
most roquestic West Love Supreme guests that we've ever had.
And I always planned to do it with the Roots album.
Instead we did it for Tarik's book, The Upcycle Self.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
Make sure you get that. Here we go.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
Suprema Suprema roll call, the Suprema Suprema roll call, Suprema Supremo,
roll call, Suprema su.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Supremo roll He is the best. Yeah, nothing to prove. Yeah,
we get the honor. Yeah, talking about Suprema.

Speaker 1 (01:09):
My name is Fante Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:11):
Back on the block with my man yap It Codo.

Speaker 5 (01:25):
My name is Sugar. Yeah, I shall proceed.

Speaker 6 (01:28):
Yeah to eat your shrooms and smoke your weeds.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
Supremo Supremorem.

Speaker 7 (01:41):
I'm hi Bill, I'm not better than you, Yeah, but
thanks to Fantee, I'm a better rapper than you.

Speaker 8 (01:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:58):
And my favorite MC. Yeah who else? Yeah, motherfuck whoa.

Speaker 4 (02:09):
X It's regis Yeah. I give all y'all that. Yeah,
but y'all gonna have to chill. Yeah, I know, I'm
gonna have to rap.

Speaker 3 (02:21):
Bring Roll, come bre so sound Soup, pre roll, come up,
Preemo something something up? Preemo roll care un South upreing roll?

Speaker 1 (02:38):
Whoa wait? You know like us dot X will stop
a bar like like he will stop the bar fourteen
bars before he finishes that I did. I did because.

Speaker 5 (02:55):
Like too many times and there's a really long pause.

Speaker 9 (02:58):
I'm celebrating.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, I can get used to this. This is another
in person yeah classic dust dustin.

Speaker 8 (03:07):
One of the most anticipated episodes of all Questlove Supreme times.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
Exactly the amount of times that has been in the
group chat when is this going to happen?

Speaker 1 (03:19):
When is this going to happen? I don't know for me.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
If you're old enough to know the reference, this will
feel like the anytime that Eddie Murphy comes on the
Arsenal Show, where it's like, how do you add professional
with someone that you've known for four decades of all
your life? Like you know, this is another episode of
Quest Love Supreme. Ladies and Gentlemen, Quest Love and Wait,

(03:42):
where the.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
Hell are we? Like go back in time?

Speaker 2 (03:47):
It's an old time streshold recording studio. Yes, I feel
like I'm in nineteen thirty six and also nineteen ninety six. Yo,
it's also to.

Speaker 4 (03:56):
Today is the I guess the thirteenth we anniversary of
an undone undone drop today December sixth.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
Wow, that's awesome. Twelfth twelve year twelve, right, I think
it's twelve. Yeah, I'm getting numb to roots album anniversaries.
I know, I got so many of them.

Speaker 8 (04:14):
I know.

Speaker 9 (04:15):
Man, what a beautiful privilege. That's beautiful.

Speaker 1 (04:17):
All right. So yeah, sugar Steve, how was life good?
That's night? Bill? You made it? What's up? I'm happy
to be here.

Speaker 5 (04:24):
You gave me like a half a second house, like
I was like house Like great?

Speaker 1 (04:28):
Great? I paid Bill. What's going on? Great?

Speaker 7 (04:31):
Everything's good. I'm happy to be here. I thought I
wasn't going to be here at the weather sort of
me here. Okay, that's awesome. Uh fron Tikeolo. This is
the first time we're talking to you after seeing the documentary.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
Man, yeah, that was a response.

Speaker 4 (04:45):
It's been amazing, man, kind of overwhelming, but uh no, man,
it's yeah. It's being received exactly how we want to
be received. We made it with a lot of love,
and we get a lot of love back, So check
it out a little bit.

Speaker 1 (04:58):
Go check it out, all right, And what's the the
next move after the documentary? I don't know. I mean,
I just we literally, so we finished this.

Speaker 4 (05:07):
We finished the doc November seventh, We had our first
screen in November knife and then we released it November
twenty fourth.

Speaker 1 (05:14):
So I ain't trying to do shit a little bit.
I'm just yeah, yeah, we don't know about that life.

Speaker 4 (05:22):
Not doing shit, Yeah, not doing shit. Hey, hey, I
hate man right back to rap, back to the lag.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, I mean I will say that, you know, it's
real good to see because it was also just like
unprecedented territory because not since maybe Metallica's Some kind of
Monster have us seen a documentary of a group really
do self analytical work. Because normally it's just like cutting
place and then nineteenth thirer and we did this and

(05:51):
no no no, no, no no no, and then happen
you know, that sort of undone unsung methods, and so yeah,
good to watch. And actually our guest today and myself
or at the very beginning of our process, so.

Speaker 4 (06:06):
We're finna bite jack. That whole concept really really break
off ship, Like yo, man, how come we you know
what I mean, like you down to the to the
very last compound and ship.

Speaker 8 (06:17):
That's what you do with the youth though, y'all, y'all
you've put themselves out there and then we you know,
how's it going. I'm good.

Speaker 9 (06:26):
I am so happy that we finally got this.

Speaker 2 (06:28):
Ladies and gentlemen, we have literally one of the best
wordsmiths that ever entered the realm of hip hop, which
sort of sounds like an empty intro, but it's it's
actually literally true. What actually makes this even more special
a propose that we're here kind of to celebrate a

(06:49):
new chapter in your life, which is kind of you
opening up to the world because you've been very mysterious
to the entire world.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
And yes, it is awkward at fuck giving introduction. No,
but I absolutely make no buns.

Speaker 5 (07:11):
Buns, you don't make buns.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
No, I don't about no, I absolutely make no bones
about our guest today being not only just one of
the greatest people of all time. But you know, it's like,
I don't know how to refer to Trek because he's
literally probably been the most consistent figure in my life period.
Like I've seen him on a regular basis for the

(07:38):
last thirty seven.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
Years of my life.

Speaker 2 (07:39):
Like I haven't done that with my mother, my father
and my sister, any girlfriend, Like it's kind of my
work spouse, which I don't even have shame in that. Man,
this is this is this is a commitment. The greatest
of all time. Tariq Black thought Trotter is on costloft supreme.

(08:01):
You so.

Speaker 1 (08:07):
Go, oh, God.

Speaker 2 (08:14):
See that our sineo ednything started already before every for
any ll moment, there's always here in the background.

Speaker 1 (08:21):
God is great. Yeah. Initially my plan was like to
lay back and let the four of you go at it, to.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
Ask whatever, but even I have questions. I'm mid read
of the book right now. But since you are bursting
at the seams, start.

Speaker 9 (08:37):
Okay, let's just start with this.

Speaker 8 (08:39):
The fact that this is one of the most anticipated projects,
at least in our circle of people. We've been waiting
to hear your story for probably the last couple decades.
So I want to know why now and why the
way that you decided to do and how you and
not not why the way you decided to do it,
but how you decided.

Speaker 1 (08:57):
To do it.

Speaker 4 (08:58):
You know, I think the the why now of it
all is I kind of feel like now or never,
you know what I mean, Like there's a certain urgency
that is very tangible that you know, is to I
don't know, I feel like there is like it's time
to do all all the things right we have to
you know, sort of do it or not, you know

(09:21):
what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
So for me, it was it was now or never.
It was you know, if not now, then when it was,
you know, why not now?

Speaker 4 (09:29):
And you know all the different ways that I could
you know, self sabotage in my mind and worst case
scenario without I was able to resolve, you know, And
and yeah, it just felt like, uh, you know, the
best move both you know, for me, for my sanity,
for my mental peace, and you know, just to give
people who have been long time supporters of the route

(09:50):
something new to latch on too, and you know, something
to identify with and you know, something that they're able
to you know, see representation of themselves in to some
extent hopefully.

Speaker 1 (10:01):
Yeah, it just felt very necessary.

Speaker 9 (10:03):
So and real quick, what's this process?

Speaker 8 (10:06):
Because I told Fante this morning, we've been talking about
your book a lot and between May the Lord watch
his documentary and the upcycle self. They're very special because
we are seeing not just our two of our favorite
artists to our favorite MC's, but we are seeing two
black men of certain ages reveal themselves in ways that
we may not be used to seeing film wise and

(10:27):
on paper. So when talking to Fonte and knowing that
he started his process years ago, because the onion has
to be peeled, how does that work for you? As
far as yet, I'm going to do this book. I'm
going to bring this, but I know you had to
go through the Okay, do I want to talk about
this or I don't want to talk about that, and
I ain't gonna do that, but somebody had to go

(10:47):
to you.

Speaker 1 (10:48):
No, you have to do that.

Speaker 9 (10:50):
You have to say these things.

Speaker 6 (10:51):
How do you do that?

Speaker 1 (10:52):
Far? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (10:52):
Yeah, Well this isn't my first attempt at a memoir,
you know what I'm saying. So I feel like maybe
I feel like this is a third time, So third.

Speaker 1 (11:02):
Times a charm, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (11:04):
I partnered up with a couple of different people, you know,
the collaborators in the past, and you know, great minds,
and we've got you know, hours of hours of of interview. Uh,
you know, audio and video stuff, and we took you know,
lots of notes and sort of.

Speaker 1 (11:20):
Did all of the all of the you know, like
the groundwork.

Speaker 4 (11:23):
But yeah, I wasn't able to get through the process
in either of those instances. And I think in this
dynamic like between me and Jasmine Martin, Jasmine is.

Speaker 1 (11:33):
From Philadelphia, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (11:35):
As I we've worked together on so many different things
over the past now five or six years or so.
We had just did a comparable sort of project for
Audible during Quarantine in seven years, so like the bones
were there, So it was just about, uh, you know,
how are we gonna approach it? And we wrote this
book the way that we would record an album or

(11:59):
work on a screenplay or do anything for musical theater.
It was sort of you know, from the inside out,
you know what I'm saying. On some Quentin Tarantino shit.
I think that's the beauty of you know, just being
it being my first time you know what I mean
doing the thing.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
There's a there's a.

Speaker 4 (12:15):
Blitz they you know, they don't say ignorance is bliss
for nothing, right, So there's something in the just the
abandon of not knowing better not knowing the right way
to do a thing, so you just do it, you know,
like the artistic or you know, most efficient or creative way.

Speaker 1 (12:29):
And that's what I'm experiencing right now. How many years
was this book in the making. It took about a
year and a half, two years, okay.

Speaker 4 (12:36):
And the first two attempts that you made at doing
the kind of this biography? What made those I guess
the wrong attempts? Like what didn't work about those? I
think it was just the relate like I was sort
of relinquishing my my story, you know what I mean.
And in both of those situations, it was almost as

(12:58):
if I was along for the ride because these were
too far more experienced authors and you know what I mean,
people that I had, you know, I still have a
great deal of respect for, but they just aren't familar. Like,
you know, no one could tell your story the way
you can tell it, you know. But I wasn't, you know, ready,
for whatever reason, to tell it myself. So I figured,
by you know, just association, I would receive, you know,

(13:20):
the same sort of validation as if I if I
just you know, jump jumped out there on my own.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
And that wasn't the case, and uh yeah, I just
it wasn't ready, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (13:29):
Things happened when they when as they should, you know,
And I don't think either of those you know, like respectfully,
it just wasn't you know, like the right situation or time.

Speaker 1 (13:38):
You know what I'm saying. I get it. When in
writing this book, did you have to have conversations?

Speaker 4 (13:42):
We had Will on the show and he was talking
about how you know, he had to have conversations with
family and people like, Yo, this is coming.

Speaker 1 (13:48):
Did you have to have those talks with your people
on how did they go? I had.

Speaker 4 (13:52):
I had some of those talks with you know, people
whose opinion you know what I mean, who it mattered
to me how they feel?

Speaker 1 (14:01):
And yeah, you know, like there was lots that we
had to omit, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (14:04):
Like my uncle, who is my father's brother, my oldest
year surviving relative. He you know, he likes to talk
and he has no filter, you know what I'm saying.
Once you get in your eighties, it's like yeah, so yeah,
there's very much that had to be omitted, and you know,
some names had to be changed within There was a
bunch of names that were left in there, and those
are the people you know, I had to holler at

(14:25):
like my auntie. Now you know what I'm saying, Like,
you know, like you go be good, that's it. And
and then you know some homies, like there were a
couple of people who I grew up with who just
some minor inconsistencies, Like there was one thing that I saw,
like in the book, it says that these two kids
that my boys started this organization of writers called T

(14:47):
E T. And they didn't start T E T. They
weren't even they weren't ain't even right. You know what
I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (14:51):
Now.

Speaker 4 (14:51):
When I was doing the audio book, I caught it
because I did my own audiobook, so I caught it
and I corrected it. But you know, I wasn't gonna
have to. You got to come out the posative is like, oh, yes,
one more thing I want to change. So it's like, yeah,
they just has to stay in there. But I hit
them up, like, yo, you know you read the book,
it's going to say X, Y and Z. I mean
not really, you know, to make sure it was good
with the dudes who were credited at starting the group,

(15:14):
but to make sure it was.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
Good with the dudes who were in it and they
had nothing to do it to you, you know what
I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (15:20):
But everybody's all good and folks that I grew up with,
like people from my block, like like who you know. Well,
in the in those scenarios, in those moments in time
that that that I reconjured in the book, have read
it and told me that it was a great read
and that it was you know, the transportive and in
the way that we intended it to be. In the book,

(15:46):
you talk about specifically a fight you and the Meer
had in London and how that changed the course of
you guys relationship in some way.

Speaker 1 (15:54):
How do you think it changed y'all? How did that
change y'all dynamic?

Speaker 4 (15:57):
Well, you know, I think, uh, if you if you
have a close friend, you and a close friend get in,
you're like come to you know, a fisticuffs like you're
come to blows something that's forever changed. Right, If it's
between two people who are used to fighting all the time,
then you know it's sometimes just far little like with

(16:19):
that change is you know, I mean, it's less significant
then if that's somebody's only fight, Like I'm going through
my mind I can't remember how many fights I've been
and I don't even stomped out.

Speaker 1 (16:27):
I mean I win, some lose, some bunch of fights. Shit.

Speaker 4 (16:30):
It said, if that's like your only fight, if you
had like one, two, three altercations, then yeah, I would
think it would be just more impactful.

Speaker 1 (16:38):
So that's just how I understood it, you know what
I mean.

Speaker 4 (16:40):
I think for me, it was something that like later
that day I moved on, like you know what I'm saying,
definitely again like something had been changed, but it was
such an insignificant change for me. But yeah, I just
feel like in our mirrors, you know, world, there was
something that, uh, you know, there was a line that

(17:01):
had been crossed that you know what I'm saying, we
could never sort of cross.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
You know, and look at my own funeral. That was
or like I was a quick fist couple of more
wrestling like wrestling. It was like a chokehold. It was
it was wrestling that.

Speaker 9 (17:25):
Or did you get it?

Speaker 1 (17:27):
I think I just sat on top.

Speaker 4 (17:28):
Of himinety pounds, like I never heard of this situation.

Speaker 2 (17:35):
But the thing is is like when you're my size,
like people just rightfully think like I'm never fucking with him,
so I never had to fight my life.

Speaker 1 (17:44):
That was the only fight I've ever had in my life.
You know, it's kind of weird.

Speaker 8 (17:50):
Do y'all understand that for the majority of the public,
they don't really get to see, like, you know, you
writing a whole chapter about a mirror and how you
guys man at how y'all connected In real life? People
watch y'all and they watch you on the stage, they
watch him from drums, but they really don't see y'all
ever connect. And I gotta say, as a fan and

(18:12):
I feel like family friends not so much. But I remember,
I said to Day this morning, I said, I remember
the one time and the first time that I saw
y'all like embrace, right. I remember how it felt to
see it. I remember where I was. I was at
the Black Lily, at the five Spot. I felt emotional
because it was just something that I hadn't seen.

Speaker 1 (18:35):
Y'all.

Speaker 8 (18:36):
Y'all was having a private conversation at the bar, was
having a private conversation at the bar. And it wasn't
like a let me hug you, bro, but it was
just like a show of affection that I had never
seen between the two of you and I'm just curious.

Speaker 9 (18:47):
Are y'all kind of.

Speaker 1 (18:48):
Like, oh, I'll see you tomorrow, But y'all don't do
I see.

Speaker 8 (18:52):
You tomorrow, hug bro, I'll see you tomorrow. Like that's
not something that people are used to seeing it.

Speaker 1 (18:55):
It's weird, Okay.

Speaker 2 (18:56):
So I have despite whatever, the the whatever, my like,
I don't know what people think they see me. Like
I've heard I'm super arrogant. I hear I'm happy, go lucky,
or yeah, I'm very aloof.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
I hear that a lot.

Speaker 2 (19:13):
But the one thing I had to work on the
pandemic was really letting go of old ideas and perceptions.
And the one thing that I was always taught that
my dad always taught me. And that's basically because he
went through a situation with the business that he started
with his brothers, and one of his big rules was
always like, you know, never start business with family.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
You can never ever mix business in your friendship. D
da da da.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
And I've seen the told that that business took on
my dad, like we we lost, he lost so much money.
We Yeah, I think I met it on the show,
Like we lived three years without gas in the house
and it was like either a private school for a
mere or a gas This is before Kappa. Oh yeah,

(20:00):
there is some crazy shit with me. So that said,
I always like, once I realize, oh, we're running a business,
then I wondered, like, well, I wonder how like, well
shit change? Like well, we still spend the night at
each other's house, Like can we be friends or am

(20:22):
run a business? So I was, and even when I
joke about the Grifven door Slytherin thing, in my mind
it was always like, now that we have a business,
I should keep a professional distance so.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
That the business can last long.

Speaker 2 (20:37):
But I also knew that I was sacrificing because I
do miss those times where like we just hang out
and you know, watch movies and all that stuff. But
in my mind, I think I was carrying a lot
of my father's beliefs I started carrying on my own.
And the one thing I thought about was like, oh, man,
I mean when Uncle Rosie and Dad and so now

(20:59):
that I'm starting business, what's on it's like a brother
than me.

Speaker 1 (21:02):
I could never do that.

Speaker 4 (21:03):
I mean there's something to that, right, you know what
I'm saying, Like that isn't like lots of OG's have
that philosophy. And it's not for you know, not for nothing,
and you know, like just to speak to that same
sort of you know thing.

Speaker 1 (21:19):
You know. I mean, Sean and I you showing who
manages the Roots. That is my cut.

Speaker 4 (21:22):
That's who I'm talking. That's who that nigga just left.
When I burned down the house, he would yeah the
fuck it. His spot on the on the floor was
still warm. But you know, we grew up only you know,
two years apart from one another, and just really close
as cousins in the same way that our mothers were.
They were like sisters, but they were aunt and niece.

(21:43):
And he and I were you know, great cousins, but
you know we were more like brothers about that too.
I mean, we went to you know, college together, that
whole thing. But once he became you know, the Roots
business manager, and once he partnered up with Rich, there
was something that I mean, it changed, Like there's something
that changed.

Speaker 1 (21:58):
And I always wondered if you.

Speaker 4 (22:00):
Know it's like, yeah, we used to kick it all
the time. We go get drinks, we go we at parties,
we you know what I mean. I talked to you
in the morning, We're on the phone, and there's something
that there is a you know, uh uh consciousness of
maintaining the business bar that I think. I mean, there's
a there's something admirable and being able to separate the professionalism,

(22:20):
you know what I mean in that way, You know
what I mean. It's like he and I have brothers
showing our cousins. I don't think that's ever gonna change,
but for the brand's sake, for the sake of the business. Yeah,
you know what I'm saying. Sometimes you gotta do what
you gotta do. So I mean, I completely understand, you know,
I know, like there are lots of other examples that
have been set, you know what I mean, other cats,
other you know, artists that have been collaborative in a

(22:42):
comparable way, but none of them have stood the test
of time that we have.

Speaker 1 (22:45):
So it must be something to that shit. You know
what I'm saying. It is weird. The once, uh once,
during the bionic period of Bionics.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
Sorry, this is two thousand and three, I think two
thousand and two, two thousand and three, I caught in
a twenty minute candid moment. I forget where we were,
either like a photo shoot or something like that, and
I was far away, but I was keeping my eye
on him, and.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
I was like, wait a minute, they actually like each other. Yeah,
like yo friends. Because it's also a thing where you
got to understand that to.

Speaker 2 (23:21):
Endure, and we can't stress enough the amount of stress
and turmoil. Those first like four years were where daily
every day like my one dream of why this has
to work is I can never I will never ever
go back to fifty two.

Speaker 1 (23:41):
Twelve O Sage Avenue.

Speaker 2 (23:42):
I don't know if you remember Jungle Fever, when that
moment where Annabella Sior had to like in a moment
of defeat, have to come back home to her dad.
And my worst nightmare was this one because even before
things fall apart, like every day I had to deal
with here, my dad sort of say like you gotta
get a real job, and or you're doing a video,

(24:04):
but was a cable bill and what about the electric bill?

Speaker 1 (24:06):
And so my mind like it's like I can never.

Speaker 2 (24:11):
But the thing is is that we have to be
in tight the way that you describe being on that tour,
in like tight circles, Like I've never spent that much
amount of time with any human that long. So it's
like you gotta maintain a professional relationship and your brothers

(24:32):
and you know, and again I'm just I'm going you
you're gonna live out the examples of what was getting
with you.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
You know, like there were some people who were in
the Roots who did that to the extreme. Like it's
a delicate balance, you know what I mean. You have
cats who I mean on more than one occasion, more
than one member of the Roots who we we travel,
they act like they ain't even they don't know it.

Speaker 1 (24:54):
Yeah, Like like dude, like we in't fuck it.

Speaker 4 (24:57):
You gotta be Calicutta right now, like we always Yeah, really,
I like, you know what I'm saying, like we didn't
come together, but you know, and I think it was
you know, in that I think people did that for
some of the same reasons.

Speaker 1 (25:10):
But it's just extreme, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (25:12):
It's weird you mentioned the hook thing because there's one
moment I remember, which was at Dyla's funeral, and I
believe either John or my Duke's sorter said like, shot me,
not shot me. Look because everyone was sitting in the

(25:34):
front row and of course, you know, me carries a
flag for Dilla like I should be, but I wanted
to sit in the back and it seemed kind of
odd because it was a large church, but it wasn't
that many people. It was like maybe forty fifty people
in a place that could hold like three hundred, Like
Dyla's buried in the same cemetery that Michael Jackson and
Elizabeth Taylor are, So it's like a large, sprawling estate,

(25:58):
but there's only like fifty people there. And I purposely
sat like in the last row, like with seventeen roads
like ahead of me, of emptiness. And at the time
my girlfriend was like, well, why are we sitting back here?
And I was just like, it's so foolish now. But
my whole thing was like, oh man, I can't let

(26:21):
Tarik see me in a vulnerable, weak moment, which is
again I was whatever it is you can never hold
pre twenty twenty meters.

Speaker 8 (26:32):
Now look at it, like, now that we've read the
book and we have had these conversations in the last
seven years, is about you know, I had moments reading
that book, even when Tarik was describing your home situation
like with the past inside.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
Now you know what I remember, no one ever broke
into my crib.

Speaker 4 (26:50):
What I remember about Dyla's funeral was, yeah, definitely you know,
like just how you know, gargantuan, the sort of the
space was. We were only in the first few rows
and stuff. But yeah, I remember being like, yo, where
where the fuck is I'm here at you know what
I'm saying. And then I just remember like when it
was over. I think at one point like I connected

(27:12):
Dave New York. When it was over, I hugged. I
fucking cried, like that was the first time I was
able to, Like I hadn't cried the whole time of hearing,
you know what I mean, throughout the whole shit.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
I saw a mire after the funeral and I just
started balling.

Speaker 2 (27:23):
Started right and it was such So it felt weird
to me because like I maintained such a professional distance thing,
but this is like, oh shit, now I gotta switch
the light on and go back to nineteen ninety one
when we were born, you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (27:41):
After that?

Speaker 8 (27:41):
Do you go back after the hug and the embrace?
Does it slowly open up things?

Speaker 2 (27:46):
Or do you go back to So here's the funny thing,
all right, So I'm in, you know, and I'm sure
my my psychological journey and all that stuff. So I
did a session once and I kind of slipped, and
she said, well, you know, what was Tarik's opinion on that?
And I was like, well, it's cool, you know whatever.

(28:06):
He said, no, no, what do you say for Batim?
I said, well, he ain't say it, but it'll be
cool that. She's like, wait, how how long do you
talk to Treik? And she's the kind of person. So
she's the kind of person that if she sees a scab,
she'll just start scratching it scratching, and it's like, yo,
I got other issues.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
I got you know, mother issues.

Speaker 2 (28:29):
Yeah, right, And she kept wanting to go there and
I'm trying to like matrix bullet dodge, and she clearly
saw my discomfort, and she was just asking basic questions.

Speaker 1 (28:38):
Like well, how long do you talk?

Speaker 2 (28:39):
Does dark know that like you're in therapy and da
da da da, and that you're turning new leaf? And
I was like, cool, man, you feel you know the
thing like where you like you don't say like, oh
I love you man, and you know, and I had
a hard time just come to grips with myself, like
looking in the mirror and all that stuff. And so well,

(29:00):
she the way that she sort of gets me the
part that I never reveal. It's her method's a little
bit different. Let's just say there's a certain amount of
cash money in escrow in which I have to in
this December, so I'm gonna have to start write a
contract of what my goals are for twenty twenty four.

(29:22):
And if I don't stick to that, then she will
present my worst nightmare, which is, Okay, I'm gonna take
this money and donate it all to the GOP.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
No no, no, no, okay, okay, I'll stop eating sugar.
I'll stop eating sugar.

Speaker 2 (29:34):
And it's almost like she has to she has to
mind trick and force me to do cause I'll just
say like, yeah, I'll talk to him next week, next week,
next month, next week.

Speaker 1 (29:43):
So here's the thing.

Speaker 2 (29:45):
So it's it's it's almost akin to that of like
you know when you get a girl's number in high
school and you're in the mirror, Like I'm in the
mirror my dressing room, like all right, so you know,
I'm in therapy and like I'm rehearsing my lines like
a week ahead of time and shit, and she's like
calling me, all right, so what did Duik say about
your thing?

Speaker 1 (30:03):
And I was like all right, all right, all right,
I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna do it. She's like,
I'm gonna take this money. And the relationship is a
hostage negotiations.

Speaker 2 (30:11):
I'm hearing right like I'm the person that has to
be threatened to do the right thing, like I'll expose
you if you don't, you know, take care of yourself.

Speaker 1 (30:19):
So I was like all right, I said, so uh
and there's like doing the pandemic.

Speaker 2 (30:24):
So I was like, all right, reek, yeah, so you know,
I'm kind of doing self work and stuff and you know,
microdoc and.

Speaker 5 (30:37):
Here we go, right, so I got my life together.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
I'm micro.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
So I did like so I did like this whole
ship and I mentioned one of the people and I
was like, yeah, so you know, I'm reading this book
by this guy named doctor Joe Despenza and he talks
about how like communications.

Speaker 1 (30:55):
Like oh yeah, doctor Joe, Yeah, I'm done with that.
And in my head, I'm like, holy shit, wait what
does he know about that? I said, you know about
that joke?

Speaker 2 (31:04):
It's like, yeah, you know years ago when you know,
when I first started therapy and the like holy shit,
you're in therapy, like ya I was, And when I
got back. I was like, yo, I didn't know. I
thought I was the only one like doing the self
improvement thing, and treeks like.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
Beat me by like years really years?

Speaker 9 (31:26):
Really?

Speaker 2 (31:26):
Yeah, yeah, little bit he was like four years ago.
I started in twenty twenty.

Speaker 1 (31:30):
He was like, what was fifteen?

Speaker 4 (31:33):
Well, you know, I am man. I've become close friends
with a fellow named Kyle Vaines. And Kyle he worked
with me and Mark Jenkins and Ray Angry. He was
like a supplement dude. Well you know that worked at
this you know, this gym that we were training that
whenever Mark would come to work with D'Angelo, we would all,
you know, I mean be working down in the financial

(31:55):
district at this spot. So at one point Kyle disclosed
to Ray and I about how his girlfriend at the time,
his fiance, was a huge Roots fan. You know, she
was terminally ill and really the only thing that was
getting her through was our song Tomorrow, the one with
you know, me and Ron Rahiem and yeah, so you

(32:15):
know she wound up, you know, transitioning. We all kept
in touch and as luck would have it, we were
out in La I think like her funeral, her memorial
was like a few days before we would have been
out there for Grammys or whatever. So me and Ray
went out there early, performed at her memorial and became,
you know, closer friends with Kyle. So Kyle and I,
that's like he's my hiking buddy, you know what I'm saying.

(32:37):
We meet up at different places around the country and
you know, just go on walks, and you know, he
was always heavy into meditation, and when he started rocking
with Joe Dispenser, he started sending me his meditations early on,
and I couldn't get with it, you know what I'm saying,
because the dudes he talks with, you know what I'm saying.
But he just kept bombarding with the ship until you know,

(32:58):
like I got one meditation that was it was you know,
short enough for me to get into. And it was
also it wasn't so long that you know, it started
to because I tried to do it with my family
and everything, and they was like, yo, I can't do this,
Like why is dude talking that way? But once you
get over how he's saying this shit, you start to
see results and you start to feel, you know what
I'm saying different. So yeah, I've been rocking with it

(33:19):
for a minute. But that's how I got turned onto it,
you know what I mean? And uh, I think Kyle
was the first person that gave me that book Becoming Supernatural?

Speaker 1 (33:27):
Is that is meditation? Is that still a practice today
that you still do?

Speaker 8 (33:30):
It is?

Speaker 1 (33:31):
But you know what really you know tripped me out
was I forgot.

Speaker 4 (33:35):
I didn't even realize when I discovered uh Joe Dispenser's
meditations that he was the same dude from that documentary.

Speaker 1 (33:41):
What the bleep do we know that did that? He
did the water experiment?

Speaker 4 (33:45):
You know what I'm saying, that doc that that Japanese
dude does, who wrote you know, the hidden messages in water?
Where you know, if I take a glass of water,
if I take three glasses of water, say I take
two glasses of water from the same source, and I
you know, you know, for a certain amount of time,
a week or two weeks, just curse and talk down
to this glass of water, and you know, I praised
this container water and then we freeze them and then

(34:05):
look at it under the microscope. You'll see that the
water that I focused all the negative energy on is
going to you know what I mean, produce just all
these ugly sort of like you're gonna be able to
visibly see the ugliness that I projected.

Speaker 1 (34:18):
Yeah, it's like I projected toxicity onto you.

Speaker 4 (34:21):
Know what I mean, this water and the water that
you you know, praise and that you hit, you know,
and focus your positive energy on, like the images of
like you know, beautiful you know, one of one, like snowflakes,
you know what I mean when you look at it
at the microscope.

Speaker 1 (34:33):
Because we're water, right, human being. So this dude who's meditations,
he and I do.

Speaker 4 (34:38):
I was already a fan of his from the water shit,
you know, I mean really years probably ten twelve years ago,
and then I didn't realize, oh shit, this is that
same dude.

Speaker 1 (34:47):
Then, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (34:48):
I started listening to really his podcast interviews and stuff
because he was he was he was like paralyzed from
the neck down from an accident and you know, just
through my control, he was able to you know, focus
on different parts of his body and bring it all back,
you know what I mean. So he's he's the real
deal in that. You know, he's still he talks with
weird though.

Speaker 1 (35:05):
So yes, he talks weird.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
But that was the thing, like I didn't realize that
Treek was actually more advancing this ship than I was. Like,
I think I'm like bringing some like shit where man,
motherfucker's going to start clowning me and you all like
he was waiting on you to get here, right exactly,
That's what happened. So yeah, I'm yah, man doing white

(35:28):
people's shit.

Speaker 1 (35:29):
Right exactly.

Speaker 2 (35:33):
Yeah, because just doing doing the work and doing you know,
as with most of us discovered for a lot of us,
doing the work is it's it's a vulnerable thing to
put yourself through and oftentimes we're looking at ourselves through
the eyes of what others will think about me and
all that stuff. And it really wasn't until mid twenty

(35:55):
twenty in which a lot of us were like, okay,
mental health and you know, not just church hand, no choice.

Speaker 9 (36:01):
But and I gotta just say, at least for your
story read like you.

Speaker 8 (36:04):
You would hope, just based on the surface of what
we knew before you presented this book to us, that
you were in therapy, because it always just felt like
your life it was heavy.

Speaker 4 (36:15):
Yeah, you know, I've definitely you know, I've done different
sorts of therapy, and you know, I think this book
just the process has been. You know, it was like
it was a therapeutic, cathartic sort of thing for me
to work through. I knew I didn't want to write
a tell all. You know what I'm saying, Like there
is I'm still super private, and there was much that

(36:37):
you know what I mean, I just still hold close
to the chest a lot of the shit. It's embarrassing,
it's fucking it's you know what I mean, it's it's.

Speaker 9 (36:44):
What was the hardest thing for you to in that realm?
What was one of the hardest things it was for
you to express.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
In that book?

Speaker 4 (36:50):
The hardest thing I talk about in the book is,
you know, firing the pistol into a building that I
knew my mother was inside of. You know what I'm saying,
that was you know, very ready it was hard, super hard.
I mean, in that moment, you know, it felt it
made perfect sense.

Speaker 8 (37:05):
It was so brave of you, and I appreciated you
for introducing us to your mom. Yeah, she was like,
I mean I've never even met a high ranking woman.

Speaker 4 (37:18):
Like yeah, I was going to ask you another part
in the book you mentioned, you know, just relationships that
your behavior, you know, you knew you kind of like
kind of ruined in some ways.

Speaker 1 (37:32):
How did you go about fixing those relationships? And what
did that look like?

Speaker 4 (37:36):
You know, some some of those relationships I haven't been able.
You know, they've been irreparable, you know what I mean.
And sometimes it's a hard pill to swallow, but you know,
you gotta swallow it, right one of the relation you know,
I really, I mean, we would all hope that you
be able to make it all good with like your

(37:56):
nuclear family.

Speaker 1 (37:57):
At some point. Right.

Speaker 4 (37:59):
So I was, you know, I did have hopes that
I don't know, even though I refer to him as
my half brother in this book, you know, I mean,
it's I only have one brother. So I was, you know,
it was my hopes that he was going to read
the book and I don't know, like that would be
a springboard for some self revelation, some discovery within hisself

(38:20):
that would lead to I don't know, some sort of
you know, peace. But yeah, just as luck would have it,
like the crazy shit was, I found out that they
found his body, Like what I'm saying, my brother was, Yeah,
he I don't think there was any foul play, but
he passed away. And I found out when I was
in Philly to do a book event, like the first
book event with Mark Leamon.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
So this is recent. This is this is recent. Yeah,
but you know they yeah yoa.

Speaker 4 (38:47):
So So during this whole for the past two weeks,
while I've been on this run, like promoting this book,
I've been having to you know, shoot back and forth
to Philly and figure out the funeral arrangement. I mean,
you know he did he never wanted the funeral or
anything like that, but you know, just to get his remains,
you know, cremated and that whole process. It's been a lot.
And I didn't take any time off from you know,
tonight show or any of that either, because I just

(39:10):
been you know, just trying to choose my battle.

Speaker 1 (39:11):
So I just made it happen.

Speaker 9 (39:12):
But communicated.

Speaker 4 (39:14):
The last time he and I communicated was, man, maybe
it was it's been about two years or so, you
know what I mean. He reached out, I know, like
within the past like two months, he reached out, but
he wasn't able to get in contact with me.

Speaker 1 (39:30):
Oh man.

Speaker 4 (39:31):
So one question I had, how do you I mean
a mirror talkt about it as well. But like when
you are the one in your family that makes it right.
How do you go about setting up boundaries with your
family in terms of, Okay, this is what I can do,
this is what I'm not going to do.

Speaker 1 (39:48):
How did y'all figure that out?

Speaker 4 (39:49):
I think over time, you know, those boundaries just sort
of reveal themselves, right in situations where it's extended family.
But with your parents, with your I mean I would
have imagine with your parents, you know what I'm saying,
but like with your siblings, with your uh, you know,
with anyone in your family who was close enough to
feel that level of entitlement, it's crazy, like it could,

(40:11):
you know, like it could. It's for for for many
of us, it's a deal breaker, you know what I'm saying.
I have my brother on the salary for a long time,
you know where he was, you know, he never had
to do anything and you just get a check every week,
you know, And it was like, I mean, but I
tried all different sorts of configurations of you know, trying
to set him up for self care and to be

(40:31):
able to, you know, best take care of my grandmother
too at the time before she passed away, and uh,
you know, to Novail, you know what I'm saying, have your.

Speaker 8 (40:40):
How have your your kids, because you talked about briefly
your older kids. Of course you're younger too, but how
have they received the book or and are they aware
of everything that you have put in that My.

Speaker 4 (40:52):
Daughter Celia, uh, she's she read a couple of drafts
and she's read the book.

Speaker 1 (40:56):
So she how she some weird Yeah Saliah's seventh team. Yeah,
showing that my family will never read he can't do.

Speaker 4 (41:05):
She's read a couple of drafts and she's read the book,
and you know, she loves it. She you know, she
was brought to tears on a couple of different instances.
But my other kids, I know, a mayor hasn't read it.

Speaker 9 (41:18):
I wanted to say that too, that was a mayor has.

Speaker 1 (41:20):
Not read it, and you know, I don't know what
somethingor a mayor this year mayor is a This.

Speaker 8 (41:25):
Is the way you just dropped that, Like everybody knows
that Black Thought has a son named Mirror talking about it.

Speaker 4 (41:30):
But no, Yeah, he's about to be twenty four and
he was just always so you know, idyllic.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
You know that.

Speaker 4 (41:38):
I feel like now I'm just it's so shocking, like
he'd be forgetting. Yeah, he's forgot my birthday this year
days late, which is it's not huge, but it's like, wow,
like this, who is who is this?

Speaker 1 (41:49):
You know what I'm saying? He like, oh, my bad, pops,
I've just been mushrooms.

Speaker 4 (41:53):
Right, But uh, I'm sure he hasn't read the book
yet because he's just you know, he's uh, he'll have
to probably up here for the holidays and in my
presence and then he'll.

Speaker 1 (42:03):
You know, crack it.

Speaker 8 (42:04):
You've had conversations with like a mirror and stuff about
this evolution in these stories of your family and like.

Speaker 9 (42:11):
How you up cycle?

Speaker 1 (42:12):
Yeah, yeah, you know, I try.

Speaker 4 (42:14):
I've always tried to, you know, just be be transparent
with my kids about that from which we sort of
you know, came. But yeah, it's hard to get them interested,
you know what I mean. I drive around like, you know,
this is why I went to school. I used to
live like in this tiny structure, you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (42:32):
This is how far. Let me show you how far
I walked to first grade, you know what I mean?

Speaker 4 (42:36):
And I say, okay, we started here and then I'm
driving drive and driving. They're like, we ain't get there yet,
like nah, and we drive. Yeah, I'm not making this up. Yes,
I was walking and maybe there was a path shovel
through the snow, but maybe there wasn't, you know what
I mean. And they just you know, they lose interest.
So I try not to impress it upon them. But
I think it's because you know, they're just so they

(42:57):
come up in a bubble. So there's that disc connect,
you know what I mean, And it's it's part of
what we do. This is this is part of the
you know, proverbial having overcome, you know what I mean.
So the way that privilege, the way that entitlement plays out,
it plays out in different ways, and it depends on
you know, I think it boils down to you know,

(43:18):
I mean, we all spare the rods now, but you know,
I think it boils down to how much time has passed,
maybe how many generations have passed, you know, since the
rod has been has been spared, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
But yeah, you know, it's wild. I try not to
force it on him.

Speaker 4 (43:34):
But just a couple of weeks ago, when we were
leaving a book event in Philly, I went to Philly
to do something. Uh oh, no, what the one I
was talking about with Mark and it was in my
old neighborhood. So we were on our way home and
just as we were on our way home, my son, Tarik,
who's eight, was like, he said, jail, Then when next
time we come to Philly, could we see you know
one of the places used to live, like maybe the
house that you burned down. And we were like two

(43:56):
blocks away from there. So I got to now because
he had expressed interest, I took him to the block.
I showed him, you know, where I went to preschool,
showed him the house that I, you know, set on fire,
and where I used to go to the corner store
and that whole thing.

Speaker 1 (44:09):
And you know, not that he you know, cared, but
I showed him with Chubby Chucker used to live.

Speaker 4 (44:14):
And uh yeah, but you know now it's you know,
he has a you know, there was because he expressed interest.
I think that memory but it'll sit with him in
a different way. But yeah, my other kids, they don't
really they don't be caring.

Speaker 2 (44:31):
Okay, I kind of want to car jack this interview.
I know we're talking about the book, but also a
big part of Tariq's existence is that in roots world,
everyone knows a mirror, but no one knows, Tarik. Kind
of the ways where we're opposite is, uh, last night,

(44:51):
I went to bed at four twenty am. I'm certain
you were probably up at three am. What is your
morning routine?

Speaker 1 (45:00):
I usually go to bed around nine or nine thirty.
Who does that? Well when you're not in third grade?

Speaker 4 (45:06):
But I got a son who's in second grade, and
he'd be ware out, so you know, so it's all
of your kids first and foremost. I have to be
awake for as many consistent hours as possible just to
police his sugar and take If Eriq wakes up at
six am and we don't wake up till eight, there's

(45:26):
been two hours where he could just roll through the crib,
grabbing snacks, stashing shit, eating you know, candy for breakfast,
and then I wake up at eight, and then that's
a real shit, that's super real. Yeah yeah, yeah, So
you know, So there's that. There's also if there's anything
you talked about me wanting to watch Thegither, if there's
anything that I that I like to watch or that

(45:47):
I want to read or work on or listen to,
it has to happen before the house is up. So
it works out that I'm in bed right after when
Tarita goes to sleep at nine nine thirty, I go
to bed. But then I wake up at like four
thirty five, and then I'm good and everybody else is asleep,
and I have an hour and a half to two hours,
you know, to do whatever. Right, what time do they

(46:08):
wake up that they wake up at seven? They wake
up at seven, And it's wild because that gives me anxiety.
Celia has a seven to twenty train to make it
to school in New York City, and she gets up
at seven o'clock and she still she has to walk
the dog and be at the train, and I'm like, yo,
how are you doing this? But she makes it happen.
She makes a happen happen. She makes it happen. Michelle

(46:29):
gets up at seven and you know, to get to
school every day at the absolute latest that he can arrive.

Speaker 1 (46:35):
You know, I know you're big on food. Are you
the food person in the house? I am, Yeah. I cook.

Speaker 4 (46:41):
I do all the grocery shopping, and I cook almost well,
eighty ninety percent of the grocery shopping, and I cook
eighty ninety percent of the meals. But yeah, also in
the morning, I do that. Joe de spends the twenty
five minute morning meditation. I knocked that out, work out
with you know physical Sometimes I.

Speaker 1 (46:57):
Work out, you know what I mean. Like when I'm
in a workout period, I work out. But if that's
the vibe, then then then I worked out nothing.

Speaker 4 (47:09):
When I was fresh off the LL tour, you know
what I mean, and I found out that our mayor's
trainer happened to live ten minutes from my crib, and
you know, we had gotten close on the road. They
were like, yeah, cool, let's work out, you know what
I mean. I did it for a solid month after
we got off the road, and then you know, we
trickled off. You know it's Thanksgiving, but yeah, I'll be
back you know January, Yeah, January, no doubt. You know

(47:31):
when in terms of your writing, like writing songs, writing rhymes,
how often do you write and what does writers block
look like? Well, I get home from work at night,
I eat dinner, and then I go into my office
and I write. I either try to read full Leased
an hour or write full Leased an hour before I
come back to you know, because my office is over

(47:52):
the garage, so it's like it's almost like I come
in the crib, I have dinner, and then they say, oh,
you're leaving us, you know, ended out. It's like I
go across the drive way and then I work you
know some more, and I do the same thing in
the morning.

Speaker 1 (48:03):
So your office is outside the house. Yeah.

Speaker 8 (48:05):
On a writing note, I just want to I want
to ask about this, this one hundred three thousand quote
that he recently said. I was just talking about this
with Ponte too, where he said that at this age
he's not doing hip hop because what does he have
to talk about, like going is to get a colonoscopy.

Speaker 9 (48:18):
What do you feel about that?

Speaker 8 (48:19):
Because when I heard that in my friend we were like, yeah,
we actually would like to hear about things.

Speaker 1 (48:23):
I think. I think that's it. I think there are
I don't really get writers block like that.

Speaker 4 (48:27):
I'm always able to come up with something just because
of the amount of you know, constant like information like
the intake. You know what I mean, It's content being
projected at me. You know, at every turn, you know
what I'm saying. I drive in, I'm listening to PRX,
which is all twenty minute chunks of storytelling, which is
dope because it just it gets me into just being

(48:47):
a more efficient storyteller. I listen to NPR. If I
want to hear something a long form, I listen to
you know, Urban View for you know what I mean,
you know, black people politics, and that's it. Like if
vol get o'bar like that, right, I mean the black ego,
you know what I mean. But that's the type ship.
You know, that's where the bars come from. Whether I

(49:09):
agree with it or not, you know what I mean.
It's always a springboard, you know, like into a thing.

Speaker 1 (49:14):
Are you writing like to beats or you're just writing.

Speaker 4 (49:17):
Just sometimes I'm writing not to beats, but it's more
exciting for me to write to beats. I got a
batch of joints from mad Lib for example, like you know,
maybe two three weeks ago he hit me. He was like, Yo, Monday,
I'm gonna start bombarding with joints. Boom, Monday rolled around.
He sent me like a hundred beats, you know what
I'm saying. And then I got the beats and it
was like I narrowed it down to like eighteen and

(49:38):
I started, you know, vibing to those joints. But yeah,
you know it's exciting now for me, like to come
home and like dig through that sort of that that
that collection.

Speaker 1 (49:48):
I went to La. We were in this We had a.

Speaker 4 (49:49):
Couple of sessions in La over the weekend. I came back.
So that's sort of what I've been like chipping away at.

Speaker 9 (49:56):
But yeah, say we had is that Like.

Speaker 1 (49:59):
No, no, I went.

Speaker 4 (50:03):
I went to La to do a book event at
USC But I'm gonna always you know, the studio is
my church, Like that's why I feel most at home.
So if there's any possibility for me to go and
sit in the studio someplace and hear music and chill
and smoke and be social, whether I'm actually actively working
on a thing or not, then that's what I'm going
to opt for, you know what I mean. So yeah,

(50:23):
I went out there, I did my book thing, and
then I went into the studio. I was in studio
with madod Rich Richard Nichols. We talk about undone today.
Was is the Anniversity of Undone. That was the second
time that I got called to be on the record,
and we did one time, and that was the first
time with that one, and also how I got over

(50:43):
That was the first time I really got to see
how integral Rich was to the recording process because I
had never been like in the studio with y'all. So
I wanted to just hear from you like what he
was kind of to you as you know, as a
mentor manager? Like what role did he play kind of?
And you know for me, yeah, Rich was a mentor.
I've always been big on mentorship, you know. Yeah, I

(51:07):
don't know where I would be, you know without it.
He lived by example, you know what I'm saying, in
many ways, and was you know, he was the roots,
I mean, above and beyond an executive producer.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
I always talk about he was the.

Speaker 4 (51:18):
Sort of the brains of this operation, you know when
he really, you know, laid down the groundwork for us
to be able to you know, I don't think I,
mayor and I would be as self sufficient as we are,
you know what I mean, had he not you know,
been focused on that, you know, ten twenty years before
it mattered to us, you know. So you know what
he was was he was that, he was the he

(51:41):
was on both of us. She was you know what
I mean, and influencer. Yeah yeah, and you know, just
working with him, like having him in on the process. Uh,
you know, I knew the ball I was gonna always
be at my best, you know what I'm saying. Always, always,
He was gonna always push us, even when you know
you might it might be something that you you really

(52:01):
feel like you you killed it and you you have
taken it as far as you could take it. Yeah, No,
he's gonna you know what I mean. He was the
voice of reason and he would bring you back down
to reality in that way. Talk about uh that you
working with us in the roots. I was I felt
threatened by you when you worked with this, you know
what I mean, just because I was like, how was this?

Speaker 1 (52:22):
You know?

Speaker 4 (52:22):
Rich sent you back to the drawing board, but not
as much as he was sending us, you know what
I mean. And I know it wasn't and I know
I know, I know it wasn't because like we were
you know what I mean, his family. It was because
he was just more content with what you were doing.
So I was like, what the fuck is I to
take doing that?

Speaker 1 (52:37):
You know what I mean? He only had to rewrite
his ship like ten times.

Speaker 8 (52:42):
You know, so this is the first time most of
us are hearing that somebody could make either money y'all
read write.

Speaker 4 (52:48):
Was like, well we cameme when I when I did
the verse for one time, because the thing was it
was one time. It was it was now or never
first it was now or never, and I came to
do that one and I just wrote a verse because
he would.

Speaker 1 (53:01):
I would.

Speaker 4 (53:02):
I'm like, okay, so what's the song about? Rich and
rich would send me like a gip chat.

Speaker 1 (53:09):
For real, I'd be like, okay, nigg i'ma what none
of this ship mean? All right?

Speaker 4 (53:12):
Fuck it, I'm gonna And so I did my verse
and I just did it, and what none of y'all.
Y'all wasn't dead. It was just me and spawned in
the studio.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
So I think even Richard left and so I did
my joint and I'm like, all right, I think I
don't know. I guess this works.

Speaker 4 (53:27):
And so I went to the crib, went to the
hotel and the next morning he called me, and I
didn't hear nothing because normally rich you know, he would
text or I would get something to say I ain't
here ship, and I'm like okay.

Speaker 1 (53:38):
So he called me.

Speaker 4 (53:38):
He was like yeah, man, uh yeah, just I mean yeah,
just I'm gonna need you to go at it again.
I'm like, all right, cool, and so I went again,
and I remember the note he gave me was he
was like, I wanted to make sense. It can't just
be dope as a rap. It has to make sense
on the page, like if you're just.

Speaker 1 (53:57):
Reading it it's poetry, you know, or it's literature. It
hasn't made sense in that way.

Speaker 4 (54:01):
And I was like, shit, okay, got it. And so
then I did the second draft. And then that was
when he called me back for the day with Blue.
And when he called me back for that, I was like,
hell yeah, cause that was one, Like I loved it.
It's like one of my favorite even without me on,
that's just one of my favorite songs. I gotalog and
so he did that one. But through all of those times, man,
he was really because I understood, like I'm walking into

(54:25):
a studio, nigga.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
It's you truck porn. He was from poem was.

Speaker 4 (54:30):
Getting his ship and ship I would I would show up,
like you know, and I was living in LA at
the time, of course, big up the dice. I would
show up and they would, you know, because it was
so competitive, they would all you know, clamor to get
their ideas on the beat before I heard it. So
that I was, you know, just more married to you know,
that's how why I first experience the the you know,

(54:51):
the composition, right, I would hear they were like, yo,
you got to hear this beat.

Speaker 1 (54:54):
And the first time they playing it for me, I
heard poorn verst what I'm saying. So it was competitive
in that way. But by the way, Greg porn, uh,
you know Rag porn.

Speaker 4 (55:07):
But yeah, you know, Fonte for Rich to even you
know what I mean, be concerned enough to send you
back to the drawing board, man, I appreciate it means
it means that you were brilliant because he would, you know,
just as quickly like nah, I mean, he couldn't give
us what we needed and we would just you know,
me move on because it was so many other people
sort of waiting for that slot. But he was concerned

(55:30):
with elevating you know, hip hop lyricism to literature and
elevating you know, hip hop culture to fine art. And
he was, you know, he was so disgusted, always disgusted
with the state of black lyricism, like R and B lyrics,
like you know what I mean, the ship that you know,
he fucked right, Rich fuck up the whole family cookout,

(55:51):
just dissecting, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (55:53):
Yeah, we did. I remember we did one time for undone,
and I remember the note he gave me.

Speaker 4 (56:02):
He was like, you know, you have to be a character.
He said, I don't want you to just rap this,
like you can't just be rapping, you know what I mean.
And he played me when I first when I first
got there, it was before you got in the studio,
he played me sleep and he played me sleep.

Speaker 1 (56:16):
I was like, oh, this shit hard and he was like, man,
re did that like thirty times like I had him doing.
I'm like, damn.

Speaker 4 (56:22):
So I went in to do I did mine, and
I mean it was in that particular case. The lyrics
I got right because he was pretty much by that time,
I kind of knew the science. So I'm like, okay,
I see what he's going for now. But the performance, yeah,
he dripped me on that shit. He's like, nah, I
want you to do this word say it like that.
I'm like, a you know now, you know I hate

(56:43):
doing the lyrics. And you know what rich Rich would
do with me sometimes he would, you know, just get
me to do it that many times and then he
do a composite that's when you do a composite of
you know, the best syllables from you know, thirty different
takes and then you know, get this composite and it'll
be That was the chat gpt of it all, because
that was like, okay, now this is AI. But then

(57:06):
he said, okay, so we can either use this composite,
which you know, nine times out of ten I wouldn't
want him to use just because it's a different sort
of you know, feeling like there's nuance that is different.
But you know, the composite will become the example and
then it's like, you know, if you can't do it,
it's dope, Like give me a take like this or
better or the composite is what we're.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
Using now and that yeah, one hundred percent.

Speaker 4 (57:27):
Because with that, that kind of was something that changed
my mind because for me, I know, as MC's we
pride ourselves on getting it in one tape.

Speaker 1 (57:33):
Yes, like yeah, this is one tape, Yeah, which ever? Take?
Which ever? Take? His right, that's the first one, that's
the one.

Speaker 4 (57:38):
But like for him, I kind of start to see
it more and looking at making records almost as like
making a film in the sense of that you're really
just trying to capture the best performance. You know what
I'm saying it because you want that down. That's it,
Like it's like that forever, you know what I mean.

Speaker 9 (57:58):
Was Rich just integrated in the live perform as he
was in the studio.

Speaker 1 (58:01):
He was our sound guy.

Speaker 8 (58:02):
I mean even in the way that you presented just
not just the sound of it all, but even the
way that you y'all presented yourselves on stage.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
I mean, Rich built the myth of the roots because
before us, you know, your average band was maybe ninety
six dbs, which is like a normal listening spirits. Rich
was trying to create some Pink Floyd shit where we
were one hundred all the sound, Yeah, we were like

(58:29):
one hundred and forty DB's. He would like, I mean
the whole idea of like echoes and all that stuff.
Because also the thing is that we weren't hit space,
so we had to make the show fall sight right.

Speaker 8 (58:43):
So it was he like like, I'm rika gonna need
you to work the stage more like I'm gonna need
you to He.

Speaker 4 (58:46):
Would give he would give notes like that, and he
would give yeah, notes like that, I mean, but you
would be able to tell, you know what I mean like,
if we get done the performance and we get back
to the dressing room, I'm like, yeah, how was that ship?

Speaker 1 (58:55):
That ship? You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (59:00):
He wasn't going to uh you know, he wasn't very
generous in that way. So you know, even if he
said that ship was cool, it meant it was cool.

Speaker 8 (59:11):
Y'all right, because I'm like, I remember the first, the first,
the only time I got a compliment from Rich and
it changed my life.

Speaker 7 (59:16):
Like I got a question along those lines trigger. I
caught the four tour like a month ago. It was
last it was in Boston. It was the last one.
And my favorite thing is not just you as the
leader of the roots, but you was hype man. It
was one of my favorite things to watch, like l
L and all of it was. I didn't know you
were such a great hype man, and it was what

(59:36):
I just don't know if you could speak to that
and just but what it's like to be with some
of your heroes are you know, people you really respect
and and and hype and hype in front of them.

Speaker 1 (59:42):
It was it was far out.

Speaker 4 (59:43):
It was you know, for me, that's that's one of
my favorite things to do. Is to be supportive, like
you know what I mean, I just enjoy sparring back
and forth with those legends.

Speaker 1 (59:53):
Like but people who you know, are the reason that
I do what it is that I do, and many
of whom.

Speaker 4 (59:59):
I just feel unsung or you know, underappreciated. It blows
in mind, you know what I'm saying, to realize that
something they wrote when they were fourteen or fifteen or
sixteen that impacted me when I was fourteen or fifteen
or sixteen. Now these thirty or forty years ago, it's
still you know, has a life, you know what I mean. So,

(01:00:19):
and you know a lot of these cats, I think
the role that the Roots serves is we're connective tissue
between a generation bridge, right, you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (01:00:27):
So, yeah, we've been that bridge.

Speaker 4 (01:00:28):
And there's a lot of cats who you know, maybe
at one point of their career were at a certain
level and then they don't perform for a long while,
and then when they have the opportunity to perform again,
it's like, I, you know what I mean, is my
music going to be right?

Speaker 1 (01:00:42):
Do they know my lyrics?

Speaker 4 (01:00:43):
All these people familiar with what it is that I do,
and you know, the fact that they may be coming
back with the roots puts them at ease because of
the way that you know, like musically and from a
just a hypeman's standpoint, we're able to support them, you know.
So that's something that I've always you know, just a
pre shade it and enjoyed it. I'm not about on
stage trying to I don't want any attention on stage, like,

(01:01:05):
don't even look at me, look at due just you know,
I'm about the sound, you know. So it works out
for me in that way. But the Fourths tour was
a dream come true and that man, we got to
do that every day, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:01:18):
All right, So let me ask probably one of the
biggest myths of black thought is your relationship with freestyling.
There's three particular stories I want you to talk about,
all right.

Speaker 5 (01:01:37):
I don't need you to do a forty five minute freestyle.

Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
Okay, So of course I know that shout out to
ESPO from Philly for catching uh that clip of us
in the alleyway or whatever, like doing the freestyle thing
which is which basically set your legend.

Speaker 1 (01:01:56):
Can you talk about do you remember the.

Speaker 2 (01:01:58):
Time Scott Scott, No, no, no, no, do you remember
that moment when we were at the Trocadero with Hansoul
and we drove home and he freestyled that entire time
in the backseat.

Speaker 1 (01:02:12):
I do did that have an impact on you?

Speaker 2 (01:02:15):
Because the next day you said it once You're like,
that's the level that I have to supermate, Like, can
you talk about like how if that had an impact
on you as far as like rhyming on the spot
because I've seen you do it in high school.

Speaker 1 (01:02:30):
Yeah, but kind of in a funny way like battling.

Speaker 4 (01:02:33):
But there was yes. To answer your question. I remember
that night come home from the truck. I remember Hansoul freestyling,
and I remember the way it made me feel, not
necessarily threatened, but just you know competitive, you know what
I'm saying, the same way that I felt when I
came up and the first time I saw Rozelle and

(01:02:55):
Supernatural and Muhammad performing.

Speaker 1 (01:02:56):
At that boom poetic thing. Right. I came back to
Philly like it, what are y'all doing? You know what
I mean?

Speaker 4 (01:03:01):
Like, fucking dude, you're awake and you're not rapping, like
like niggas in New Yorkers, They're like, Yo, they fucking
rapping right now? Dog like you know what I mean,
you got to be able to go like off the top,
but some one you can't.

Speaker 1 (01:03:13):
That's how I was. So yeah, I think, uh, you know,
it was more of that, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:03:19):
I wasn't necessarily it wasn't like I didn't feel threatened,
but I was just super competitive, you know, and I
knew you know, people who went to college with me,
people went to high school with me. They'll always tell
you about, oh this one time, you know, to regrab
for three hours and we walked from here to here
or drove from here to there, and he never started rapping,
but there was something, Uh, there was a gravitas. There

(01:03:41):
was a seriousness in it that night, and what Hans
was doing that made me like, okay, like this is
a thing. There was a level of mastery to it,
you know what I'm saying. So yeah, I definitely, yeah,
that was the takeaway.

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
So can you give your version, like I know, richest
version of the Kindanye a bathroom situation?

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
Yeah? Do you remember?

Speaker 2 (01:04:02):
And we were backstage at Universal Amphitheater, right. I didn't
know who Kanye West was then, so I think like
he just did get by, like he was hanging with
quality or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:04:14):
And again because of the legend of Threeeks is the
best freestylist ever.

Speaker 2 (01:04:21):
You know, motherfuckers would just come up and think, you
know the rappers that want to rap just like and
I hate that too with musicians, Like musicians want to like, hey,
let's have a jam session, or you know, start drumming
and talking, and I'm like, I don't do that shit
on my off hours or whatever. So Rich told me
a story once about like you were changing for show whatever,
and then Kanye decided this is my moment and just

(01:04:43):
starts freestyle in front of you.

Speaker 1 (01:04:44):
Can you tell that story because I never heard you.

Speaker 4 (01:04:47):
I mean, you know, like what like back in the day,
we would show up for our sessions. Kanye would be
in there sometimes, you know what I mean. Eighty eight
Keys would be in there. Sometimes they wore down with
Kenny Douro. They were down with you know what I mean.
You know people who worked in studios who would give
him a heads up, you know on who had sessions,
and they would be in there and trying to place
their beats and and rap for niggas ambushes, right, And

(01:05:11):
you know my thing with Kanye was I would I
would run into him more while we were shopping. So
I would be in Atlanta or Chicago or LA at
the place where you knowever everybody goes to get clothes. Yeah, right, yeah,
so whatever the popping you know what I mean store
is at the Barneys or you know fred Sieger whatever
back in the day, and Kanye would always be in there,

(01:05:32):
and he would always see me.

Speaker 1 (01:05:34):
And now Kanye would be like, Yo, what you got?
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (01:05:37):
So he would be the type of person that he
wants to see everything you putting on the counter, you
know what I mean, and he want to go back
and see if you want to get that or if
you want to switch out. So I would, you know,
beat sometimes in a store or in like a mall
and Kanye is there and now I'm grabbing ship to
try and throw him off the center of the trail,
make him think I'm gonna get this stuff and that's
not what I'm gonna get. The night that you're talking about,

(01:05:58):
we showed up to our gig. It was a in
the Roots in Erica. If I'm not mistaken, and Kanye
was dead, I forgot. Yeah, that was the first time
I met a kon he was over enough with it,
and Kanye was in there, and he immediately goes into
his ship.

Speaker 1 (01:06:14):
Oh shit, what's that? Oh you got them y threes?
And oh what's that?

Speaker 4 (01:06:16):
And he started like picking apart everything that I had on.
So now I'm trying to get dressed and my whole ship.
Like the reason why I was annoyed, It wasn't even
that he started rapping or that he was talking about music.
I was used to him doing that, but he was
trying to, you know what I mean, like sort of
tag picked my shit apart and be like, Oh you
got to this, you got to that, you got to that?
Oh oh yeah, oh I'm up on that, you know
what I mean. And it was like that was what

(01:06:38):
I'm like, you just get the fuck out of here,
like I'm getting dressed, nigga, Like I'm trying to you
know what I'm saying. And I think that was you
know that, That's what happened at Universal that night.

Speaker 1 (01:06:51):
I have a theory about the flex freestyle.

Speaker 2 (01:06:54):
Yeah I knew how hard you and Malik paired in
ninety three, like the mentality of like, yo, motherfucker's in
New York.

Speaker 1 (01:07:05):
Are you know we got to come with it.

Speaker 2 (01:07:07):
And I remember once like we were driving to New
York and we were listening to like a best of
Barbido and Stretch Armstrong thing and we were like, wait
a minute, that's a B side. We've heard that rhyme
before and it was kind of a there's no Santa
Claus ye realization, but you to still kept that. And
I remember once you guys did a session which you

(01:07:28):
did so many freestyles for all these name brand DJs
that never wound up, like there's there's volumes of freestyles
that you've done that are probably still Yeah, it was
like one of the MCA like we're going to promote
you know what I mean, like you know for all
the radio mixed show DP, right, Yeah, I remember.

Speaker 1 (01:07:47):
So for you.

Speaker 2 (01:07:49):
Knowing that was your first time after thirty two years
of never being invited on Flex's show, were you in
kill Bill. I'm gonna show you not to ever deny
me again, because that wasn't regular. That wasn't just like
oh by a minute seven, I was like, oh, this

(01:08:10):
is a revenge mission.

Speaker 1 (01:08:11):
No, No, I wasn't.

Speaker 4 (01:08:12):
I wasn't really on kill Bill mode, you know, I
was for me. I don't know if you recall, that
was a Thursday that I did that joint. It was
weird taped to tonight's shows.

Speaker 1 (01:08:23):
So I was tired.

Speaker 4 (01:08:24):
It was like twenty below zero, freezing cold, you know
what I'm saying. I couldn't find parking. I had my
assistem at the time, like outside waiting in my car
like double parked. So it was just like the urgency
of trying to you know, get in and out out.
And I knew, you know, Flex and I have been
texting back and forth for maybe six months at that point,
just trying to figure out a window that made sense.

Speaker 2 (01:08:47):
And what was that first text like when finally like
he acknowledges that were not me five nothing?

Speaker 4 (01:08:55):
Yeah, yoh no, No, I was, you know, sorry, I
was like, wow, you know what I mean, I think, yeah,
it was definitely I was surprised.

Speaker 1 (01:09:01):
I was surprised.

Speaker 4 (01:09:02):
I was surprised, And you know, I don't know if
I think leading up to that, you know what I mean,
Flex's olive branch. Flex His way to show that it
was coming from an authentic place was he just started
offering to spend for us, Like yo, any booskigs y'all
got I'll pull up. I'll just rock for y'all, know
what I mean. I don't know if you remember this
is the moment that changed his mind.

Speaker 2 (01:09:21):
I don't know, but you know what I'm saying, We
didn't you do another oh the method maybe the Method
Man thing, because even j hit me about the method.

Speaker 4 (01:09:27):
But by the time I did the Metha Man freestyle flexing,
I had already been talking for like, you know, damn
near a year about me coming up to flex. The
metha Man freestyle just took place because we were promoting
that HBO show and you know, there's no way we
could go somewhere and it's me and metha Man and
they not ask us to rap, you know what I'm saying.
But yeah, you know, when I did that flex freestyle,

(01:09:48):
it was like, you know, I mean, roming off the
top rapping period. It only matters to it's so niche,
you know what I'm saying. So I just wanted to
represent for those people who sort of gave a fuck,
you know, and I wanted to It had to be
one take because I had to get out of there,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:10:06):
I was ready to go home, and.

Speaker 2 (01:10:09):
My fear was that he was just going to interrupt
you and not let you finish. Yeah, yeah, that's enough
And I was like no, no, no, and okay he
let him go on, right, But you know, for me,
can you talk about did that finally feel like a
redempt dimptive moment for you which.

Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
You finally got your flowers? Didn't It felt? Yes, that moment,
you know what I mean, like the moment that you
know that followed, like would you do that night when
you got home, Oh, Jill, probably you know what I
mean little bit and went to bed. Yeah, I went
to Yeah. Yeah, it was I hate to say, I mean,
I hate to say I actually cried. No, it wasn't.

Speaker 4 (01:10:48):
No, it wasn't until yeah, it started to go viral
and I you know, I saw folks re retweeting it
and you know what I mean, like reposting the joint.
That's when it started to feel like, oh wow, you know,
because I never like I was still new, I guess
the social media, you know what I'm saying, Like, I
just really started rocking, you know, with the Instagrams and
twitters of the world, you know, relatively recently at that

(01:11:10):
at that point.

Speaker 1 (01:11:12):
So, yeah, it was it was just dope. You know
what I mean. It's it's it's dope to be acknowledged.

Speaker 4 (01:11:15):
To that point about social media, for you know, you're saying,
you know what, I'm on stage like, I don't want
you to really see me at all. So how do
you deal with now in the era of you know
of music just entertainment period where you have to have
that presence of some sort you know, some sort of
presence online.

Speaker 1 (01:11:34):
Or I mean, it's it's it's just it's a delicate balance,

Speaker 8 (01:11:37):
I do.

Speaker 1 (01:11:38):
It's just gonna sound crazy. It's like I basically do
the bare minimum. You know what I said.

Speaker 4 (01:11:43):
I do the bare minimum, and I'm able to still
somehow feed my family. But you know there's a bunch
of a lot of what I do is also in
exercise in overcoming you know, the anxiety associated with you know,
doing shit, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:11:59):
So when I do, like if I forced myself to
go and.

Speaker 4 (01:12:01):
Do a hot five type five of stand up, like
that's a you know, an exercise in me, you know,
just becoming more comfortable to my own skin in front of.

Speaker 1 (01:12:11):
An audience without having any safety net. You know, the
same talk.

Speaker 2 (01:12:14):
About that because I feel like a lot of people
don't know that you're heavy into stand up.

Speaker 4 (01:12:19):
Yeah, yeah, you know I got I got heavy into
stand up. I got heavy into you know, musical theater
when I was you know, when I'm working on Black
No More.

Speaker 1 (01:12:27):
That's what I'm doing.

Speaker 4 (01:12:29):
Basically right right it is it's still you know, still
a thing, and I'm now, you know, heavy into I mean,
I mean, I think the medium with which we tell
the story is ever evolving, but the story sort of
remains the same.

Speaker 1 (01:12:46):

Speaker 4 (01:12:47):
How do you I was gonna ask you about just
your memory in terms of memorizing. Yeah, Like how do
you go about just memorizing all of those Like when
you're doing on the Roots Picnic.

Speaker 1 (01:13:01):
And you're something once, Yeah, you just do just a
a verse, Like you just come up and just do
a verse or something. How do you just I guess
log all that stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:13:10):
I don't know, man, It's like you I think I'm
using a part of my brain that is, I don't know.
I'll just tapped into, you know, something that probably would
otherwise have laid dormant if I didn't sort of force
myself to you know what I mean, work with something
outside of my muscle memory.

Speaker 8 (01:13:25):
Wait, so to that point the book, I found myself
reading this and being like, fuck, I know Reek smokes, but.

Speaker 2 (01:13:33):
The details well not as much anymore though, right, not
as much a little bit.

Speaker 4 (01:13:41):
But you know, I think that's attributable to Rich Rich's
genius too, and that, you know, just in the storytelling
as a writer.

Speaker 1 (01:13:49):
You know, he would challenge you to be as visual.

Speaker 4 (01:13:51):
As possible and the conjure up that that imagery, you
know what I'm saying, to make you see and feel
and smell a thing, but to.

Speaker 8 (01:13:59):
Smell some thing like you're a six year old, six
year old self. That's deep and to be able to
describe that on paper.

Speaker 1 (01:14:06):
Yeah, yeah, I guess it is. So I have a question.

Speaker 6 (01:14:10):
So I'm writing a tell all book right now actually
about about the two of you. Do you have any
advice for somebody who wants to know I'm just kidding,
but and when's the rematch?

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
The fight? Rematch? I think the audience wants to know that.

Speaker 5 (01:14:26):
It's all been, it's going to be, but we want
to know when the when the rematch is whatever?

Speaker 2 (01:14:33):
No, No, I mean, what are you allowed to talk
about as far as black No, more is concerned because
we can talk about it's so weird. Like when you
started black No More, Obama was president, so sort of
in that House of cards way, like you clearly knew
it was going to be a satire because you know,
it's never going to get that crazy, right, And then

(01:14:56):
suddenly once Trump was president, then it was like, oh,
this is relevant to times now. So at one point
it was an extreme satire and then became reality.

Speaker 4 (01:15:06):
Yeah, that's the thing, you know, I mean, at this
point it's it's not as far fetched as it was
or as it felt, you know, you know before the
Trump and Biden administrations, you know what I mean. This
was originally slated to you know, to open off Broadway
during the Trump elections, you know what I mean. So yeah,

(01:15:29):
I mean I think there's some you know, rejiggering that
you know, I mean, it needs to take place. There's
you know, very much that you know, we need to
sort of be revisited. But just you know, for for
the fact that you know, what felt so dynamically sensational,
you know, six years ago, eight years ago no longer
feels that way. It's like that has been our reality

(01:15:49):
and worse, you know what I mean, so much off
the wall shit has happened.

Speaker 1 (01:15:52):
Yeah, for those don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:15:53):
The Black Memoirs a book written by George Skyler yep,
I thinking like it was like one of the first
that her futurist books nineteen thirty two. Oh wow, yeah,
and he basically, uh, it's just it's a satire about
a black man who changes his skin color, falls in
love with a white woman and now she's pregnant, right,

(01:16:17):
and she will eventually find out that which.

Speaker 1 (01:16:20):
This that that's that's a show that was on Bravo
last night, right, you know what I mean.

Speaker 8 (01:16:24):
It's like, you know, how do we how does he
know because he watches Bravo.

Speaker 1 (01:16:30):
We got it?

Speaker 4 (01:16:30):
So yeah, yea, we gotta we gotta sort of punch
it up a little bit, I think, just to make
it more you know, as far fetched said as it felt.

Speaker 1 (01:16:37):
Uh, you know at its own set.

Speaker 2 (01:16:39):
Actually, you are one of the most random TV watching people.
I know, Like, what are you watching?

Speaker 1 (01:16:47):
And how do you pick?

Speaker 2 (01:16:48):
Because you and Jimmy will talk about the most random
You'll discover shit on QB or whatever like Tubby.

Speaker 1 (01:16:56):
To me, Toby, I was like, who QB? Well?

Speaker 2 (01:16:59):
QB was a that was Quibbi. Yeah, that was that
lasted like ten minutes. Yeah, like what mindless ship do
you watch?

Speaker 4 (01:17:07):
Or like, what's what shows right right right now I'm watching,
I'm watching you know, bass Lorman bass Reads.

Speaker 1 (01:17:16):
You know what I'm saying, Lorman bass.

Speaker 4 (01:17:18):
Reeves is, uh, is about the US Marshall first, the
first black U S Marshall.

Speaker 1 (01:17:22):
Really it's the character.

Speaker 4 (01:17:24):
It's the real life person that the Lone Ranger character
was based on, you know what I mean, which is
based on a black person. Yeah, the Lone Ranger was
based on a black person. But you know they weren't
gonna have it. I mean they're like, yo, let's make
it a black a white man and put a mask on.

Speaker 1 (01:17:37):
The mass.

Speaker 4 (01:17:40):
But yeah, so bass Reeves, Uh, it's this dope show
that I've been watching recently, Yellow Yeah, it's in the
Yellowstone family.

Speaker 1 (01:17:48):
And a Yellowstone worth it. Yes, it is.

Speaker 4 (01:17:50):
This was what else I was gonna say anything Yellowstone
eighteen eighty three. That's level like I must watch a different, different, different,
you know what I mean. I think I'm always excited
when somebody could get period right, you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (01:18:06):
And they got period right, you know what I mean?
Every time.

Speaker 8 (01:18:08):
So and also the inclusion of the indigenous culture and
just giving us more context.

Speaker 1 (01:18:14):
Yeah, that's they got it. Run. So I'll go on
Apple TV and you see, Yo, I'm watching that.

Speaker 4 (01:18:23):
I'm watching that now, Bass Reds, I mean, Loman Bass Reeves.
I'm also watching well, yeah, the Gilded Age.

Speaker 1 (01:18:29):
You know what I'm saying. Have you seen Killers of
the Flower Moon yet?

Speaker 2 (01:18:33):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:18:34):
I hear it.

Speaker 4 (01:18:34):
Yeah yeah, I haven't watched that yet. But Fargo, the
new season of Fargo, Yeah yeah, yeah, four episodes in. Yeah,
but you know what I'm saying. And I've been, uh,
I keep coming back to just because it's like I
can never even though it's only three episodes.

Speaker 1 (01:18:49):
I think they're like an hour and a half long each.

Speaker 4 (01:18:53):
The American Buffalo documentary Ken Burns, which is you know,
it's not just about the Buffalo, you know what I mean,
It's really about out America and you talk about indigenous
people and I'm just a history buffing that way. So
I've been rocking with dad. I found out that it
was out because Celia came home. She was like, they
made us watch this documentary today in school. I'm sure

(01:19:13):
you would be into it.

Speaker 1 (01:19:14):
I was like, what is it?

Speaker 4 (01:19:18):
She was like about the American Buffalo. I was like,
do tell it was Kim Burns And I was like, ship, like,
you know, hell yah. So I've been watching that only
because I have to watch a Kim Burns documentary maybe
like five six times to you know, take in all
the information.

Speaker 1 (01:19:35):
You fuck with rap shit on HBO. I watched the
first season. Second season is better. I mean, the first
season is good, but the second season is it's good.
I have, I have.

Speaker 7 (01:19:43):
I haven't seen every father's impression of their teenage daughter
is exactly the same, because I.

Speaker 1 (01:19:47):
Thought, right, yeah, right, exactly do your kids like are
they aware? Are you dad? Are you? Or are they
like do you catch them listening to your music? Or yeah,
you know, aren't you worry for them?

Speaker 2 (01:20:07):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:20:07):
No, I catch a mirror listening to my music. You know.

Speaker 4 (01:20:10):
He does his little playlist and stuff, and sometimes even
his playlist of other music that he's listening to in
the shower and all that.

Speaker 1 (01:20:18):
You know, it's dope to see.

Speaker 4 (01:20:20):
That he's somehow found music that I was listening to
when I was in my twenties two without me having
to say, let me.

Speaker 1 (01:20:26):
Put you onto it.

Speaker 4 (01:20:28):
So there's that it's Sealia, you know, does the same thing,
you know what I mean. She listens to my music.
She has a little bit, you know what I mean. Yeah,
she's becoming a hip hop here. But Tariq, he's never
been into any of my me The only root song,
roots thing that Tariq has really that has resonated with him,
not our Disney Junior stuff as what you would think.
It's the Blackish thing, the June Team Blackiest thing that's

(01:20:52):
you know, uh, And that put him on to the
whole Schoolhouse Rock world and he started listening to the
original I'm Just a Bill and all the original Schoolhouse
Rock shit, and then the new Schoolhouse Rocks You and
then the new New Schoolhouse Rock shit, all just from
ours yeah, from our Blackish segment. So this is that,
you know what I'm saying, But what he's up on

(01:21:13):
and what I'm still trying to dissect because it played
out the same way with Kamala's kids, who were like,
you know, two and six or two and eight, No,
Tarika's eight, maybe Kamala's. Because the youngest kids are two
and six, they all know every word the mama said,
knock you out, and they've owned they saw l L
perform it a couple of times that they came to
the shows with us, But for some reason, this is

(01:21:34):
the first rap song Treek's known. All the lyrics to
Kamal's Little Baby, you know what I mean, cash Like
they all listen, they know all of the from don't
call it a And I'm like, that's what I need to.

Speaker 1 (01:21:44):
Tap into, you know what I mean. It's like, Yo,
they don't be my son. But we talked.

Speaker 4 (01:21:49):
I've never heard none of my children have ever sang
one of my joints the way Treek sing.

Speaker 1 (01:21:54):
Don't call it a comeback. I'm like, yo, like out
of a movements.

Speaker 4 (01:21:59):
Right, Oh yeah, there's definitely something in that that h
channel and that's what Yeah, And that's why I told you.
I was like, Yo, we need to use that joint
that we didn't want to yo, because it might be
something in that and I don't know if it's the
music or the lyrics or the marriage.

Speaker 1 (01:22:14):
Well return yeah yeah, my okay.

Speaker 2 (01:22:17):
So you know, we redid Mama for the NBA mid
season the mid season tournament, and my initial idea I
knew they wanted Mama said knock you out. But also
LL's kind of this place where it's like, yo, man,
I'm not a legacy act like that sort of thing.
But you know, the people that write the text are like, nah, man,

(01:22:39):
we just just do your song from nineteen ninety please
and take this check.

Speaker 1 (01:22:42):
So I was like, all right, let me find a
happy meeting.

Speaker 2 (01:22:44):
So I actually did something dope where I reversed because
I'm also working on the Slide movie.

Speaker 1 (01:22:51):
I have access to the masters, so I was like,
all right, let me reverse the song.

Speaker 2 (01:22:54):
And you know, like what terminator Actually a ja panic
was to rebel without a pause, like the sirens going backwards.
So I did a backwards version that ship and it
sounds dope as ship, and Even was like, uh, let's
let's not give this to them.

Speaker 4 (01:23:11):
Like Even was like, God, it's great, I mean because
I mean, we see you working, you know what I mean,
you you know, been dropping projects left right in terms
of you know, a roots record. Now that Rich is
no longer here in that role, who is in that
role for y'all? Yeah there is you know, I don't

(01:23:33):
know that there's anyone in that role. Yeah, I think,
and I have to be yeah, yeah, we've we've had
to extend ourselves not necessarily over extended. We've had to
extend ourselves in order to fill in that gap, you know,
because Sean, though he is he's he's an innovative, he's
not necessarily a creative, you.

Speaker 1 (01:23:53):
Know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:23:54):
He's a business mind. He's an innovative mind. He's not
a creative. And that was the beauty of the balance
between him and Rich was like, you know what I mean,
hot and cold?

Speaker 2 (01:24:02):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:24:04):
So yeah, so there's that.

Speaker 4 (01:24:05):
But I think in terms of an album being done,
I think we got plenty of material. I think it's
just gonna boil down to you know, I may or
not being excited enough in any moment to do the
mix is necessary to say all right, this is the
ten songs or twelve songs, however many that are gonna
be album. But we got enough joints, you know, we
have more than enough.

Speaker 2 (01:24:25):
I just for me, once a week, I get excited
about something else, and then I'll.

Speaker 1 (01:24:32):
Replace it and replace it and replace it.

Speaker 9 (01:24:34):
That's the problem, because really wouldn't Rich be the want
to come in and be like mother.

Speaker 2 (01:24:38):
Yeah, it's just like in your dreams thing, then in
your dreams thing got shelved because it's just like, look,
we gotta wrap up.

Speaker 1 (01:24:45):
Do you want more?

Speaker 2 (01:24:46):
We're not gonna get this shit done in time. So
that's the one thing I don't have, which is like,
all right, no more new songs.

Speaker 4 (01:24:54):
There's there's value in our procrastination in that, you know,
once we put out any thing, then it's out right
right now. The bar is where the bar is. What
the Roots brand means to people is what it means.
So yeah, I think there's something in that. I think
the whole what makes the Roots the Roots is the

(01:25:14):
fact that we've always you know, thought and then overthought
right in the process.

Speaker 1 (01:25:19):
So I think now the idea is to pull it
back a little bit.

Speaker 4 (01:25:23):
We don't need to overthink, but I think we still
need to be as considerate in the process as we
you know, have in the past. Because that's that's the
difference when people say, Yo, what's the difference in me
in the Roots? In me on somebody else's shit, is like,
I'm just gonna pull up and I'm gonna almost go
with the first thing that comes to my mind. That's
why streams of thought is called streams of thought because
it's like it's as close to a freestyle as you

(01:25:44):
know what I mean, I'm just letting the it's the
first thing that I think of, which you know and
many times is dope, and you know it's witty and funny,
but it's not what we do in the roots. It's
not rich challenging me to you know, be something that's
gonna fucking you know, resonate just reading it off the page.
That's not what I have to do if I'm in
the studio with Ninth or Salime or Sean c. And
that's part of you know, that's what informs it and

(01:26:06):
makes it. It's a dope exercise because it's not as
it's not something that I won't say. I don't take
it as serious. But it's just a different process, I understand,
you know.

Speaker 2 (01:26:15):
What I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:26:15):
It's a different process, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:26:16):
So I mean I think in that like, you know,
the roots album, especially based on what dictates enough material
to be an album in this day and time, we've
got multiple new roots albums done. What do you feel
like y'all or do you feel like y'all have anything
to prove on the album front?

Speaker 2 (01:26:34):
Like what would be the so the one thing that
has occurred to me and then you shoot Your Cousin
came out in twenty fourteen, so we're going on the
tenth year and I probably have done twenty thousand hours
of DJing. Now, the DJing that I've done post twenty
fourteen is different than the dj and I've done pre
twenty fourteen, in which, you know, jams.

Speaker 1 (01:26:59):
Are foreign between And I'm the kind of guy that,
unless like I'm doing a gold.

Speaker 2 (01:27:06):
Party or like it's a high pressure situation where it's like,
all right, well Drake syah, so let me play some
trap like the shit he knows, I'm always the guy that,
like I now know how to read my audience in
a way that I didn't before, Whereas before I was
obsessed with letting you know, yeah I got that Japanese
prints that you don't got, and you know, I'm not

(01:27:27):
looking at the floor clearing and none of that shit.
I'm so I'm so hyper aware of what works and
what doesn't work as a DJ that now as a creator,
I can't divorce myself from it. So now I'm thinking
of like, is this the right bpms? Where's the melody at?

(01:27:48):
What should we talk about? Like things I never thought
about before, like well this resonate with the audience.

Speaker 1 (01:27:52):
In recent years.

Speaker 4 (01:27:54):
You know, like when a mayor gives me a beat
or like an idea for a composition, he does a
whole separate track now of just like a guide track
of him saying okay, like you know, okay, the first
can start here, you talk about this here, and then okay,
like here you can do something like what was like
now I'm like Nigga just right around. But yeah, he's
definitely uh you know, uh, just paying attention to a

(01:28:17):
lot more of the detail with anything that I think.

Speaker 1 (01:28:21):
That's a good thing. I mean, it's a beautiful thing. Yeah,
because you have new information. Yes, I'll be calling you joy. Oh,
I mean okay, but as soon as I concentrate.

Speaker 2 (01:28:31):
But also, like the movie was unexpected, Like you know,
the movie was a thing that, oh, let me just
pass the time in the pandemic, and now it's like,
oh god, now I got two careers.

Speaker 8 (01:28:42):
So both of y'all, y'all schedules are crazy between the
both of you.

Speaker 2 (01:28:45):
Okay, So I'm trying to think of things that like
the Internet always wanted to know. I'm not asking any
masterpiece theater questions because it's like.

Speaker 1 (01:28:52):
Dude, he's done like swimming records.

Speaker 2 (01:28:54):
But what I will ask is what five m sees
that are least expected for us to know?

Speaker 1 (01:29:04):
You dig?

Speaker 2 (01:29:04):
Because the second time we talked about rap shit, he
sold me on turn this mother Out. And I'm like
Hammer and I joked, I joked once on what had
happened was that I'm almost certain that our love of
Apache or rhyming over Apache had more to do with
Turn this Mother Out than it did men at work.

(01:29:26):
But Tarik is like, instantly, Tarik sold me on it. Yo,
you know about n w A And I'm like, dude,
they got Jerry Curls. I ain't listening to shit, and
he's like, but listen to this. And then he played
me turn this Mother Out, and I'm like you like
MC hammer, I didn't. I thought like, great, nice was
corny and he's like.

Speaker 1 (01:29:44):
No, man.

Speaker 2 (01:29:45):
But that's the thing, Like Tarik has a way of
listening to anything, Like I go on the tour of
b US and listen to A Paul and MJG. Yeah.
I was like, I'll never listened to Pastor Choy in
this lifetime, and then suddenly like I'm Pastor Joy's number
one fan. So it's like Tarik's put me on to
so much unorthodox things that normally my snobby East Coast

(01:30:08):
era ass like what what MC's are like, you're under championed,
non obvious ones, non king non.

Speaker 1 (01:30:19):
Like of from back in the day or period.

Speaker 4 (01:30:23):
Karen, You know, I think Special Led is an unsung
you know hero in that you know his album The
Youngest in Charge, you just talk about just the power
of youthful expression, and he was specially that was fourteen
years old.

Speaker 1 (01:30:38):
I look at my kids at fourteen.

Speaker 4 (01:30:39):
It's like, you know, I when it's like, if I'm
in a moment where I have to just rap a rap,
I'm gonna pull from you know, anywhere I rapped from
anybody's catalog, shit that you.

Speaker 1 (01:30:49):
Don't even remember you wrote.

Speaker 4 (01:30:51):
But one of the you know rhymes that I often
do is, you know, I was proven effective by a
clinical test because some couldn't come to believe I'm the best,
so they to me and now they're in the clinic.
They almost arrested me because I did it, but I
didn't mean to do it. You had to mess with
me and then you blew it. Now you gotta chew it,
swallow it all. I guess that's the way that you
bounce the ball like this is a fourteen year old

(01:31:12):
wrote that, and that's a that's timeless, Like I can
you know depend no matter what the the soundbit is,
the music that I put it over like those bars
will forever like rain poetic and you know what I mean,
like bring something up and folks that hear it was
my one. You wish you could that was my That
was another I mean, especial levels, just super dope. So

(01:31:33):
I think he's he's one of those ones. I think,
you know, cool Keith, you know what I mean for
the whole I think cool Keith Man shit. I mean,
he was like, you know, the thelonious monk of this
shit in that you know, I mean, his shit didn't
even have to rhyme, you know what I'm saying. And
they were him and said like ultra magneticum seeds were
ahead of their time in so many ways. So yeah,

(01:31:53):
I think, you know, cool Keith is another one, Greg Nice,
you know what I mean? I think just geniuses that
I was able to recognize and latch onto, and that
it's something from their body of work that I've extracted
that you know, I mean, I still these are I
kicked all it all, all of the above.

Speaker 1 (01:32:08):
I kicked their bars every day, like the ship just
came out.

Speaker 9 (01:32:11):
Is there anybody currently?

Speaker 1 (01:32:14):
Yeah? Absolutely?

Speaker 4 (01:32:15):
I mean, you know, we saw you in the roots
forced to use rocking ma comedy and yeah, yeah Mack, Yeah,
that's that's my ace, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (01:32:22):
He was in the studio with It's just the other
night Mark, you know. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:32:26):
I think he's one of those ones, you know, someone
who again understands just a sensibility of you know, a
person who's been around since the nineties, but who's also
in just some ways just feels you know, still cutting edge, right,
and I think his association with the whole Griselda family

(01:32:47):
in that movement, but the way that he's distinctly you know, different,
is huge too.

Speaker 1 (01:32:52):
You know what I mean? I saw you did. We
were on the same album Your Drew.

Speaker 4 (01:32:56):
That's that's the second person I was about the name man, Yeah,
and you Rold Drug is Actually he's my connection to
my comedy.

Speaker 1 (01:33:03):
But he's another one. You know.

Speaker 4 (01:33:04):
When Your Old Drew came out, I didn't rock with
it because I felt like, yeah, I thought his voice,
I thought he sounded too much like nads and I'm
not you know, I'm.

Speaker 1 (01:33:13):
Huge on you know, just you know, being being originally,

Speaker 4 (01:33:18):
And I was like, nah, you know, I'm not rocking
with this shit, like you know, I think it was
Hoodie season or one of those first joints, you know.
But I met him on the road opening up for
Royson and Premiere when they were doing their prime tour
and we sort of hit it off. And you know
what I mean, I've been you know, I talk about
mentorship and you know, just artists that we shared demos
with one another, and I'm able to just you know,

(01:33:39):
offer sage wisdom and they're not gonna catch feelings if
I say I don't like this one and I like
that one. He's been one of those artists and over time,
you know, I was trying to get at Mock and
he was non responsive until Drew put us on the
same song and then you know, like sort of connected us,
you know what I mean. Then now yeah, you know
he and I, me and Mak be rocking. But yeah,
your old Drew. He's another the one man. He's just

(01:34:01):
super dope, and uh, you know, I had to I
had to give it up. You know what I'm saying,
because he proved that he was a real deal.

Speaker 8 (01:34:07):
I need everybody to realize, who hasn't read this book
that we probably only covered about.

Speaker 9 (01:34:11):
Two to three of his talents.

Speaker 8 (01:34:13):
Now in this book, there is history that gives you
history on his gourmet cooking talents because yes, he's a
gourmet chef. There's history to his visual arts talents because
that's what he went to school for.

Speaker 9 (01:34:25):
There's also history sing just about to stay that the
man sank in the choiet and.

Speaker 1 (01:34:30):
I was shocked. I was like, but I I can
sing fine, taking sad.

Speaker 8 (01:34:36):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, But I just I just
wanted to throw that out there as we are, you know,
wrapping this up, and I just feel like it's just what.

Speaker 1 (01:34:43):
Most people say, read the book, read that.

Speaker 4 (01:34:46):
But no, man, I just want to say, man, before
we go, dude, you have really been you know what
I'm saying. I mean, first is even say that you
felt threatened. I mean, that's just the crazy shit. Ever,
because when I got that call, I I was jumping
off the damn wall. I was like, what, like, hell yeah, so,
but nah, man, you've been one of the people that
I watch just and has been an example of how

(01:35:07):
to age in hip hop, like how and how.

Speaker 1 (01:35:11):
To do it gracefully and tastefully, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:35:14):
So my question for you was who or did you
have anyone as an example to say, Okay, this is
what hip hop looks like at forty or fifty, like
this is a model.

Speaker 1 (01:35:26):
Did you have that? I mean, you know, not that
I didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:35:30):
I mean, yes, I did have that, but I don't
know that I was as aware of it or just
tapped into the example as it was being set.

Speaker 1 (01:35:37):
But you know, I look at people like you know,
the ll who J's of the world, and even.

Speaker 4 (01:35:41):
Though it's been a long time, you know what I mean,
since he's done a tour, right, you know what I mean,
just the example of being one of the earliest like
multi hyphenates, right, you know what I mean, just the
whole polymath of it all, Like with the example of
him in iced Tea, you know, like set as far
as like reinvent. I think it was dope and I think,

(01:36:01):
you know, just you know, the example of being a
class act, you know what I mean, is what resonated
with me, like the most with artists like you know,
the reason LLL is around and still matters and you know, like.

Speaker 1 (01:36:12):
People care, you know about all these other endeavors.

Speaker 4 (01:36:15):
What it is that he's doing is because he's personable
and he's you know, he's nice to folks, and you
know he you know, is conscious about leaving a place
or a personal thing better than he sort of found it.
And I learned that the first time I inducted, like
we inducted maybe I've inducted ll into like three you
know what I mean, National Archives at this at this time.

Speaker 1 (01:36:34):
But the first time I.

Speaker 4 (01:36:36):
Did it, it was me and Eminem and Jazzy Jeff
and it was like the hip Hop Honors thing and
he called me the next day. I'm like, he found
my number, you know what I mean? Boom, you know
they call me yo to reach my on the phone
for you Yo, cool Jay. I'm like, yeah, yeah, I
just wanted to thank you for you know what I'm saying, Yo,
the wave represented be last night's huge, huge.

Speaker 1 (01:36:58):
Like yo, But it's those those.

Speaker 4 (01:37:01):
You know, Elverson call you ll Ella is going to
send you a handwritten thank you new you know what
I'm saying, you know, sent L L A D M.
Jokingly like Yo, I see everybody you know, doing these
boombox I'm boxing they you know, uh uh rock the
bells jackets with my joint at like you know ship
seventy two hours later, this is from Mellow Cool J.

Speaker 1 (01:37:20):
You know what I mean, I got my jacket. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
it's just like you know, I think, I think you
know that.

Speaker 4 (01:37:33):
Is is an example of how to you know, to age,
to grow, to evolve gracefully in this game. I think
another dope example has been set by Danna, like Queen Latifa,
you know what I'm saying, just you know, and these
are people.

Speaker 1 (01:37:45):
Who like what they do.

Speaker 4 (01:37:46):
The challenges that they're able to continue to rise to
is what gives me reassurance.

Speaker 1 (01:37:50):
Like yo, I probably could do all the ship.

Speaker 4 (01:37:52):
You know, out of all the people that I know, right,
I've never known anyone in my circle or even remotely
you know, distantly connected to my circle that has never
given up on a thing and didn't you know, make it.

Speaker 1 (01:38:05):

Speaker 4 (01:38:06):
It's like everybody that I know who shit didn't work,
who you know what I mean, fell off the rails,
they gave they gave up, quit, they quit niggas who
I know I know a bunch of people who didn't
quit and they've all gone on to greatness, you know,
so I think there's something in that. And did I
try to, uh, you know, just be more cognizant of
those examples again, like when they're being set, because you know,
a lot of the ship is a blur.

Speaker 2 (01:38:27):
Nah man, look, I will say, without being as mushy
as possible, and this is this this and this is
real maturity right here.

Speaker 1 (01:38:37):
Well, Toreq, you know, no one ever gets that reference
and no, no, no, no, here's the deal. In my
first book when they.

Speaker 2 (01:38:47):
Were like, all right, do a dedication, moidment right right,
and there was like do a dedication, and I was like,
I just want to say, well, Torique, and that's it.
And you know the publicshers like, well, lips this after it,
I said, he's going to get he's going to understand it. No, Like, well,
Toriq was always And the way that manifesting works is

(01:39:10):
whenever we would like to take the trains back from
like busking or whatever, like we would have a ritual
of like getting famous aime as cookies in orange Juice
and either watching do the Right Thing or Cape Fear,
and as we're walking home like two in the morning.

Speaker 1 (01:39:26):
Very related films as one does on the other. I'm
with it.

Speaker 2 (01:39:33):
I just did streaming, but we have options now, we have,
you know. And the thing was, I do some sillies
with like well Toeriq. Man.

Speaker 1 (01:39:42):
We just did like two months in Europe straight that.

Speaker 2 (01:39:46):
But I'm saying shit as if it were never going
to happen to in lifeline, like damn Treiq. We just
playing in front of like twelve thousand people at the
Philadelphia Spectrum, man, and we're only home for like three
hours before we got to get up at four morning
and catch this flight to like Colorado. We be laughing
like a man like this whatever, and not knowing that

(01:40:06):
we're literally manifest. So I would always start some ship
with well to reek Uh, and I'll just simply say
thank you, And that's a very loaded thank you without
being super mussy about it.

Speaker 1 (01:40:24):
And I'm a mussy person.

Speaker 5 (01:40:26):
Good just fight again, Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:40:34):
And fan.

Speaker 2 (01:40:37):
Mama here, thank you. Thank you for having me the
great to reach out to or in quest love Supreme.
You guys can stop asking me a week's episode. See
you the next go around, y'all.

Speaker 1 (01:40:48):
Thank you.

Speaker 6 (01:40:50):
This is Sugar Steve. Thank you for listening to Quest
Love Supreme. This podcast is hosted by a mere Quest
Love Thompsona Saint Clair, Fonte Coleman Sugar, Steve Mandel, and
paid Bill Sherman. Executive producers are a mere Quest of Thompson,
Sean g and Brian Calhoun. Produced by Britty Benjamin, Jake.

Speaker 5 (01:41:08):
Payne and Liah Saint Clair.

Speaker 6 (01:41:11):
Edited by Alex Conroy. Produced for iHeart by Noel Brown
and Mike Johns.

Speaker 1 (01:41:21):
Bost Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. For more
podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

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Laiya St. Clair

Questlove

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