Prosecutors must soon respond to Bryan Kohberger’s request to name an alternate suspect in the Idaho student murders, Sean “Diddy” Combs faces explosive racketeering charges after week three of testimony, and the defense begins laying out it's case in the Karen Read re-trial. Tune in for all the details.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,
and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,
it's affiliates, or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio, where we talk
true crime all the time. Tonight is Sunday, June first,
and it's our first official live show and we have
a stacked night of headlines. Another former employee of Ditty
turns against him. Week four of the trial lies ahead,
New claims and the Idaho College murders. Could the killer
still be out there? And the prosecution rests in the
(00:42):
Karen Reid retrial. I'm Stephanie Leidecker and I head U
KAT Studios where we make true crime podcasts and documentaries
and I get to do that with Courtney Armstrong, hour
producer and crime analyst.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Body move in. So Ladies night one.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
So there is so much to unpack and Body, let's
start with you.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Where should we begin? First case of the first show? Wow?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Okay, So let's just die right in now if you
haven't been following along, and what's happening with Diddy or
what he's being accused of by basically the United States
of America, the federal government is prosecuting him. So if
you haven't been paying attention, I'm just going to bring
you up to speed very very quickly, so that moving
forward you can just kind of like follow along where
you left off. So Sean Ditty Combs is being charged
(01:29):
with sex trafficking and racketeering, and a lot of times
when you're thinking about racketeering, you're thinking about the mafia
and whatnot, and we're going to get into that a
little bit later, but just kind of keeping the back
of your mind about what he's being charged with and
what the federal government is saying is that he used
his influence and money and power to perform all these
(01:50):
illegal acts, and he used a criminal enterprise to do so.
He additionally is being charged with sex trafficking, which we
all kind of know what that means without getting into
like the nitty gritty, because we are on the radio,
we have to be careful. So where we are right
now is last week on Friday, a woman that went
by the name of Mia. She is a former assistant
(02:12):
to Ditty and she worked for him for like eight years,
for like a really long time. She was his assistant
and she was hired to like anticipate all of Ditty's
needs and probably not realizing how you know, insane he
would turn out to be. She was really happy to
be taking this job, and you know she's in the
music industry. Well, she said the highs were really high
(02:33):
and the lows are really low. She testified that sometimes
she didn't sleep for days while working for Ditty. She
testified that sometimes she went five days and she would
live on adderall just to make it through the week.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
And they would basically allegedly pump her and others.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Full of drugs.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Right, so this was a bubble that allegedly and Diddy controlled.
And if you don't know who Diddy is, I was
explaining this to my mom and just for her. Really,
he's a clarity, you know. Sean Combs is also known
as Diddy. He's also known as Puff Daddy. He's gone
by love back in the day, and look, he was
a very huge deal.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
He's a mogul and entrepreneur, assive.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah, he ran or runs Bad Boy Records, right, he
was the founder. And this is really a fall from grace,
if ever there was one.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Right, I mean, how humiliating, especially the details of these stories,
like it's got to be humiliating, but you know what,
if any of it is true, shame on him. He
deserves the humiliation. So Mia testified about several ways in
which Combes was violent with her as well. He would
throw things at me. He's thrown me against the wall,
he's thrown me into a pool, and he's thrown ice
(03:43):
buckets on my head. She also testified that he has
sexually assaulted her on more than one occasion.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Like, so think about this.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
This is an employee and that's I think a big
piece of this case in terms of the racketeering versus
him being discharged for domestic violence, right for sexual assault,
which would be I think a state charge.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
This is federal.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
So this is the big dogs coming in. They raided
his house both in Miami and in bel Air, and
it is not looking very promising because person after person
after person keeps, you know, corroborating a very similar story
of violence and this controlling environment that was really hard
to escape.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
Yeah, and they felt really kind of emboldened to stay
there too, because this is her big break, Like she's
you know, in the music industry. Now you know, he's
got money and power and he could root her. Mia
is only one of four assistants who have testified against
Diti so far. I mean, wow, four assistants have testified
against him. In fact, the next one or the one
(04:44):
that testified prior to Mia, her name was Capricorn Clark,
and she testified on May twenty seventh, and she said
that she witnessed a lot of violence and threats and
while working for him, and that he told her he
would throw her into the East River if she failed
a five day light detector test.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Can you imagine.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
Well, he locked her in a room with a bodyguard.
So here's the thing with this, and this is why
it's so important. It's kidnapping. That's kidnapping, and that is
a predicate for Rico in order to prove this racketeering,
which is you know, Rico, you have to have two
predicate acts and kidnapping is one of them. So that's
a check mark for the federal government. Okay, there's one.
(05:28):
So he's being charged with this, Rico. This is a
really big deal. So she also said that she was
forced to force to accompany Colmbs to confront rivaling musician
Kid Cutty. And we know that kid Cutty testified as well,
so she's cooperating things that Kid Cutty said, so that
she was a very important once you guys like and
(05:49):
super important, and.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Kid Cutty just too.
Speaker 5 (05:52):
Because there are a lot of players and there have
been a lot of people testifying over these weeks. Kid
Cutty comes into play because he was seeing Ditty's ex girlfriend,
Cassie Ventura for a while and Cassie Ventura was the
first woman who came to testify and kind of got
this whole ball rolling.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Absolutely she did, right, And here's the other this is
another reason why Capricorn is so important. She also testified
that she was forced to procure legal and prescription drugs
for homes. That's drug trafficking. Another predicate.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
That's two. That's all they need.
Speaker 4 (06:27):
That's all they need is too predicate acts to charge
in convict him of rico and then he's in big trouble.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
And then he's in big trouble looking at potentially a
life sentence. Right, And you know, Courtney, you brought up
Cassie Ventura, his ex that he was with for ten years.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
They didn't have any children together. She took the stand.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
If you missed any of it, it was harrowing and heartbreaking,
and she had to recount a lot of what they
call freak offs.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Right, we're all now getting a.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Lot getting a lot of information about what that really means.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
But what it means is there were.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
These choreographed sexual encounters with escorts, etc. That Cassie and
male escorts participated in, and then Diddy would sort of
sit off to the side and kind of direct a
little bit as if he was making a music video
of sorts, you know, being an executive producer and a mogul.
But the tricky thing here is that he was allegedly
(07:18):
recording these encounters. So if he's recording these encounters and
using that as some sort of reveverage exactly, and he
has bodyguards and assistant, it's a whole operation around.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
Him that makes, you know, silence the name of the game.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
We're talking about the p Diddy case, and we want
you to weigh in. Give us a call eight eight
eight to three one crime or hit us on the
talkbacks on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
So body.
Speaker 5 (07:45):
Another kind of big thing that hit the news was
that President Donald Trump is considering a pardon. He was
asked the question by a reporter and he kind of
equivocated and said maybe maybe that what do you what
do you guys think of that?
Speaker 3 (08:02):
So it's crazy.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
You know, we just learned of the chrislies who just
got a pardon, and we're going to be talking about
that later.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Little tease for you.
Speaker 4 (08:10):
But you know, now we have the possibility that President
Donald Trump may pardon Diddy if he is convicted. So
it was during a press conference and he was asked
and Trump emphasized that no formal pardon request has been
made by the defense team, like there's there's been no
official We want to make that very clear. There's been
no official ask from the Diddy camp, you know, team
(08:33):
to get a pardon. But he did acknowledge. President Trump
did acknowledge that discussions about a potential pardon are taking place.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Or that he was considering that they would happen sometime soon.
He wouldn't be surprised, right, So this is not a
huge surprise in my personal opinion.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Either.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
He's the president. He has the ability to do a
pardon should he choose to.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
But here's the thing.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Person after person after person has shared harrowing details about
violence and revenge, have had family members threatened. Cassie Ventura's
family was threatened. Her mom and dad were threatened. What
happens if he gets off That is so dangerous for
anybody who spoke out against him. Now that we're mentioning
the Donald Trump pardon thing, do you guys remember this was.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
Back in maybe twenty eighteen.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
There was a gentleman named Jonathan Odie and he apparently
just like rolled into one of the Trump hotels in
South Florida and he basically wrapped himself in an American
flag and was shooting at the at the ceiling and
was ultimately shot down by police.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
He was not killed, he was shot in the leg.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
But he goes on to tell this crazy story about
how he was a former sex slave of Diddy and
of his then extant friend Cassie Ventura, And it sounded nuts, right.
I remember real time when this happened, and it sounded
so outlandish, like a person who had slipped and hit
their head and is having a psychotic break.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Now cut two years later, not so far fetched.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
This guy was really telling the tale that we've now
heard other people say on the stand that he was
a male escort. He was being used regularly as an
air quote sex slave and it's.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Not that far fetched.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
I bring that up only because that's an interesting connection.
It has nothing to do with Trump, it is I
don't know that.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
I kind of wonder if that maybe is what bustled
the doors open to this investigation.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
You know, this this.
Speaker 4 (10:26):
Accusation that he made and then Cassie of course it's time.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Yeah, funny enough, So twenty eighteen, that's when Cassie Ventura
and Diddy broke up. So this encounter with Jonathan Odie,
we should dig into this a little bit more because
again it sounded insane. Now his hearing, if I remember correctly,
had been pushed a few times, and there's an online
chatter of maybe he was an informant now or he's
in productive custody. Who knows that is, you know, will
(10:54):
remain to be seen. But it's interesting as this landscape
opens that there are so many players. And also remember
Diddy's always at the center of you know, the nineteen nineties,
the you know, the hip hop battle and the East
Coast West Coast with Biggie and Tupac. You know, Diddy
was right at the center of that Bad Boy Records.
And this has been a long steeped legacy of violence.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
And by the way, I was.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Always a ditty fan, So I'm embarrassed to say that
now that I've seen this, or I've seen the footage
of him beating up a girl his love. It's of
Cassie Ventura getting beaten by him in an elevator. She's
trying to escape and you cannot unsee it. And granted
he's not being tried for being a bad boyfriend guilty
(11:40):
as charged, it really paints a picture that's so different
than his public appearance.
Speaker 5 (11:45):
Well, you know, you say you're embarrassed about being a
fan in the nineties, but everyone was. He was the nineties,
the white parties who didn't want to go to a
white party. Everybody wanted to live in that opulence where
it seemed like it was chandeliers and pain and sure
famous people.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
What a facade? Huh, what a facade?
Speaker 2 (12:04):
And I guess both things can be true, right, Isn't
that What we now know just by working in true
crime is Listen, somebody can be a really great person
on the outside and a real monster behind closed doors.
And I think we're all finding it so confusing but
also just really scary that this underworld exists.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
You're listening to True Crime tonight on iHeartRadio, where we
talk true crime all the time. We've been talking about
p Diddy. If you want to weigh in, we want
to hear from you. Call us eight at eighty three
one crime or hit us on the talkbacks on the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
We have a lot of updates on the Karen Reid retrial.
Oh my goodness, the prosecution has finally rested and this
week is guaranteed to be explosive. And right now we're
also going to jump into the Brian Cooberger college trial.
If you haven't been following that in Idaho new developments.
Apparently he claims there may have been another assailant. So
(13:09):
is that possible, Courtney, what do you think? I know
this is a place of real expertise for you.
Speaker 5 (13:14):
Well, Brian Coberger's defense absolutely stipulates that there is someone
else involved. So next week the prosecutors must respond to
Brian Coberger's request to name this different possible suspect, to
catch anyone up who's not super conversant, because this is
going to be a huge trial starting August eleventh. Brian
(13:35):
Coberger is a former PhD student in criminology and he's
accused of fatally stabbing four University of Idaho students. This
happened in November twenty two in Moscow, Idaho.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Also pretty major because this guy, the accused, Brian Coberger,
was studying criminology. He was getting his PhD in the
actual science that he was studying and is now accused of.
Speaker 5 (13:58):
That's right, So you know, does that make him potentially
the perfect mastermind of a murderer or is some of
is he being sort of framed in the public eye
because he has some quote, weird searches on his Internet
and he's looking up different serial killers.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
Well, you know, my friend Cheryl McColl him fame forensic
Emmy Award winning forensic analysis. She told me because I
said the same thing, like this criminology thing, this, this
has got to be something. And she said, body in
her little Southern accent that we all love Body, just
because you have a cookbook and you can read a
cookbook doesn't mean you know how to cook.
Speaker 6 (14:33):
oOoOO.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
That's a really good quote.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Because look, that's what's so confusing about this particular case,
and maybe that's why we're all so enthralled with it
is because first off, first and foremost for incredible young
people who have lost their lives. Their families are an agony.
They're grieving, and it was really incredibly senseless, but really
an overkill. You know, the walls in this house in
(14:56):
Idaho were literally bleeding. You could see the blood coming
down the walls. It was that violent. So here is
one regular PhD student. Some say he was shy or awkward,
like it's a lot of press and a lot of
conversations around him being odd.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
He just goes to class one.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Day, murders four people and then rolls back to class
after that. Seems impossible to me. I want that to
be impossible. And at the same time, it's not looking great.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
It's not looking great. That is very true.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
However, Anne Taylor, his defense attorney, she brought up this
was weeks ago. She said that absolutely buried. Going through
troves and troves of tips collected by police. She is
saying that they found an alternate suspect and a lead.
Now the duzz has kept this sealed. In other words,
they haven't said who the person or persons are, which
(15:51):
is great because what kind of man hunt, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Yeah, the tan hunts. What manhuntter do you speak of?
Is there a killer at large? Is that the insinuation
at this point that trials in August. He's been waiting
trial for a long time, by the way, a death
sentenced trial, so the stakes are very high. Is it
possible that there is a person at large as we
speak and that it's dangerous?
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Like where has this person been the whole time? Listen?
Speaker 5 (16:13):
Defense suggests there is. I mean, we'll find out more
of the details as it moves forward. But the defense
attorney also previously she said that she plans to argue
that Coburger was actually framed by someone, and that someone
planted his DNA at the crime scene. She also has
thrown out maybe two people committed the crime using two
(16:35):
different weapons.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Okay, you can't see me, but I'm totally eye rolling
right now. I'm like, I can see the biggest eye
roller ever at the moment, like, yeah, come on, come on,
but wait, getting old.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
He could also be a target. You know, remember this,
you know again, my heart is really we on behalf
of all of us, you know, for the victims and
for Madison Mogen and Xana Kernodle and Kaylee Gonzalvez and
Ethan Chapin, Like, let that not get left out of
this story. But Brian Coberger, the accused, listen, he claims
his innocence. He comes from a really loving family, people
(17:08):
really love him. He has no reason to just go
and thrill kill. But at the same time, this evidence
is not looking so ideal, specifically where you're just you know,
speaking about body, which is this touch of DNA left
behind on a knife sheath. You know, there's been so
much conversations about knives and sheaths.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Is that damning? I guess we'll have to wait and see.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
So a couple of weeks ago, there was a bombshell
dateline that was released. It was a two hour special
and it has gotten both a lot of press and
it also is impacting the trial.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Potentially potentially, and yeah, in.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
A big way because in this dateline, what they released
was information that was could only be known by law
enforcement or someone on the prosecution side.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
Right, Like these were selfies taken from his cell phone
in the moments after the murder. These are telephone calls,
These are things that only somebody on the inside would
have And you know, the defense is arguing that this
is like highly prejudicial and quite frankly, if any of
them are true, which I believe they are some of them,
(18:18):
then I kind of agree with the defense, and I
think it's possible that this could force a continuance.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
And by the way, the family has been waiting for
so long for this trial to begin.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
You know, Courtney and.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
I made the podcast with iHeart the Idaho Massacre, so
we did a really, you know, a pretty big deep dive,
and really this focus of it was, there's no way
this one person can go and kill four people and
then go to school. And while they test this in yeah,
we can't. This is alleged, right. It seemed far fetched,
and we really did go down the rabbit hole trying
(18:49):
to find alternate theories or making the assertion that maybe
he struck prior or maybe there was somebody else involved,
and it really came up as a goose egg. So
we're all playing along real time as these things unfold.
But why now suddenly this is a big ticket item,
literally a quote smoking gun, if there was another person involved,
(19:10):
why would we only be hearing about that just weeks
before the trial?
Speaker 5 (19:14):
Well, Ann Taylor and I don't know the details of
how she's going to present this but again it was
indicated that this suspect that she quote, you know, just
found was hidden, so it could be officers not meaning
poor intentions can get myopically focused on one thing.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
Tunnel vision.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
Tunnel vision, that's exactly right. But Judge Hippler, who honestly
seems like a really measure judge, and we're.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Very no nonsense, right, Yeah, I like him.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
I do too, I quite like him. He's very no nonsense,
very to the point yep. He kind of doesn't take
any crap from either the state or the defense. He's
just very kind of this is what's.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Happened to books. Yeah, right, I do like him.
Speaker 5 (19:53):
He's considering appointing a special prosecutor to investigate this dateline leak.
Speaker 4 (19:59):
I think they should, absolutely they should, Yeah, because what
was put out there, I mean it really is very incendiary.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
It has from Brian Coburger's cell phone. It has dozens
of screenshots of female students who went both to his college,
WSU and the University of Idaho, some of whom were
friends of three of the murdered students.
Speaker 4 (20:21):
And it has the Amazon click history, and the Amazon
click history shows according to the dateline Leaks again, this
is all alleged because it hasn't been you know, in
the trial yet. It is alleging that Brian Coberger searched
for a sheath on Amazon after the murders. Why would
you look for only a sheath after the murders because
you knew you've left yours behind. I mean, this is
(20:43):
so prejudicial. And we again, we don't know if it's
any of it's true. These are all alleged, and you know,
some of the things we know are true, like the
selfies and you know, things like that, but the searches
and click history, we really don't know if.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
It's true yet or not. We're assuming it is because
Dateline is a very reputable organization.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
Of And just in case you're not familiar with this
case as closely as we are, just for the play along,
there isn't really a great known connection between the four
victims who were students who all lived together in the
same house. There were two surviving roommates, thankfully, and there
doesn't seem to be an obvious dot to connect the why.
(21:20):
So in this case, if in fact these Dateline leaks
are accurate, some of these photographs that were found on
the accused Brian Coberger's phone were photographs of young women
in bathing suits who are friends, allegedly on social media
with several of the female victims.
Speaker 6 (21:37):
Right.
Speaker 3 (21:38):
Additionally, and this seems more damning.
Speaker 5 (21:40):
And to underline what you said, Boddy, we do not
know if it's true, but Dateline said that sell records
revealed that Brian Colberger, who apparently has no direct connection
with these women, was within one hundred meters of their
home twenty three times in just the short months leading
up to the murders.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Yeah, and that like particular house where it's located is
sort of on a culture sack, so you have to
really drive to go out of your house with intention. Yeah,
it was a house that was, you know, a party house.
They were in college, right they were. They were living
it up and there was friends in and out. It
was a very odd It was kind of an odd
house the lad I think it was.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
A house that was built and then they kept doing additions.
It's great, So like the kind of like John Bonnet's house, Right,
that's very true. Every How, every it just didn't it
didn't slow, that's right. You know, you could tell they
were auditions. So like the layout of the house is
very confusing, which is another kind of strange thing, like
how did Brian Coberger know where to go?
Speaker 3 (22:33):
But I dougress we'll talk about that. We have a
lot to talk about with Idaho. We're gonna talking about.
Speaker 4 (22:37):
The start a long time, right, There's so much to
talk about. But I think I think he's guilty, you guys,
I think he's guilty. And the dateline stuff nailed it
for me. So the prejudicial thing could be an argument
that Ann Taylor can make and win.
Speaker 5 (22:51):
Absolutely tainted jury. I mean, this information is spread out wide.
There's a book well we'll talk about this another time,
but there's a book from James Atterson coming out where
he claims that Brian Colberger was quote and apparent in
cell another just incendiary. We have no knowledge it's based
in fact, but things are being put out before the trial.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
Netbook is coming out how many days before the trial,
like eleven days.
Speaker 5 (23:16):
It's sixteen days before the trial. And that's also something
that the defense brought up.
Speaker 4 (23:21):
Well, we're going to be talking about key updates and
the Karen re retrial. Are you new to the case.
We're going to get you right at the speed. But
first we actually have our very first caller. We have
Indie calling right now, so let's let's go with it.
Speaker 7 (23:35):
Hi, Indeed, Hello, how you guys doing Hello?
Speaker 2 (23:37):
And how are you?
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Thanks for Colin problem.
Speaker 7 (23:40):
I just want to ask about the Diddy case in
kim Porter so we all know that, you know, kim
Porter tragically passed away, and being that, I'll be sure
who is Quincy's dad stated that he feels like he
was poisoned. Do you think that they will open or
(24:00):
reopen Kim's Porter's case or go into Albi Shore's alleged poisoning.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Such a great question, Such a great question. So all
of this is alleged, and I'll be Shore. Who you're
referring to is basically kim Porter's X, with whom she
has a child that now lives with Ditty, And kim
Porter was with Ditty for many, many years. They have
several children together. You've seen those children in court many times,
(24:29):
standing by their dad. But then she died, to your point,
very mysteriously, very healthy woman.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
Suddenly.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
I think the cause of death was pneumonia, and it
felt sort of unexpected tragic. Diddy often publicly spoke about
how much he missed her and loves her and may
she rest in peace. But now many people are saying
that maybe her death was suspicious and that maybe she
had new information again allegedly, allegedly allegedly that perha, perhaps
(25:00):
kim Porter had some details or was going to go
to the public or to the press, and in therefore
she was you know, poisoned or something. These again are
all rumored, but it's it's something that gets spoken about
online on a daily basis, and many are asking for
kim Porter's body and her death to be really reevaluated.
Speaker 3 (25:22):
Oh yeah, it is.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
Big online, but I will say so far as of today,
there has been no official action to reopen the case,
but who knows if, you know, chatter continues or more
details emerge, because thirteen years is a long time.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Thirteen years is a long time.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Yeah, And like some of the family members on Ditty
side and Kim's children, several of them have spoken out
and said this is untrue, There is no way true,
this isn't true. So these are really difficult things to
even have speculated about your parents, obviously, but again those
are the same kids that are forced to sit in
the courtroom and listen to the these hideous recounts of
(26:02):
stories involving their father. I mean, that's like the optics
of that alone. I'm like, why would you have your
eighteen year old twins in the courtroom when they're talking
about freak offs all day, all night. But again, you know,
it's optics. The courtroom is a circus, right, So you
want you want the image of a father who has
a family that loves him. It looks good for the jury,
(26:23):
it does. So that's a great question, and I think
the truth is we don't know, and.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
We're going to be following it all week, so we're
gonna we're gonna keep talking about this.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
So thank you very much for are Colin Dy, thank
you for your colleagues.
Speaker 5 (26:34):
So, as mentioned, we are now going to get into
the Karen Reid retrial, the saga. So it just wrapped
up at sixth week, excuse me, and the prosecution finally
rested their case and the defense began their own. So
we're going on to finally hear what's on the other
side of the coin. For anyone who maybe doesn't remember,
(26:55):
Karen Reid is accused of hitting her boyfriend, a Boston
police officer named John O'Keefe, with her suv and this
was after a night of drinking. The allegation is that
she backed up into him and left him for dead
in the snow and peeled away. What the defense is
claiming is that Karen indeed did stop her suv at
(27:15):
the bottom of the driveway where John o'keep's body was found,
and she left, but that he then went up the
driveway to the home of fellow police officers who he
was really friendly with, and potentially that something in there happened.
There was some kind of fight, or a lot has
been thrown out. Maybe he was bitten by a dog.
It's kind of I feel like a little bit everything.
(27:36):
Maybe a sex party, I cannot maybe, But the allegation,
the defense is saying, no, no, Karen Reid did not
back up and hit her boyfriend and leave him for dead. Instead,
he died with his fellow police officers, who then brought
John o'keef's body out to the bottom of the driveway
and framed Karen Reid and very specifically, she has pleaded
(28:00):
not guilty to the charges of its second degree murder.
It's manslaughter while operating under the influence of alcohol, as
well as leaving the scene of a personal injury death.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Also to set the stage too, that particular night in
Boston was terrible snow so it's a.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
Super snowy knive. It was like a blizzard. It was
a blizzard.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
Nobody should have been driving, let alone drug driving, which
is it's kind of a real tell that this was
a night gone wrong. You know, Karen is dating a
guy who was a veteran of the police force and
his buddy, so she was kind of the outsider of
their cop crew, you know, and their wives and their friends.
That was the group, right, so she was sort of
(28:40):
the tag along.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Here we are.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
But Karen Reads already survived one trial, so now this
is the second.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
And it's very confusing in my opinion. What is the
major allegation that the defense is making. Are they saying
that the police did like a terrible investigation. Are they
saying they're corrupt?
Speaker 2 (28:58):
Like?
Speaker 3 (28:58):
What are they saying?
Speaker 5 (28:59):
Well, well, I think objectively, the police did a terrible investigation.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
And that's a hard thing for me to say, as
excuse me.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Yes, I'm a very pro police officers exactly regard. It's
a very difficult job.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
But the investigation, and there is evidence of this, they
were physically taking from the scene of the crime of
the death of their fellow officer evidence in solo cups,
those red cups that you would see at a party.
They were putting evidence into shopping bags like you would
get it anything. So the investigation in saying that, oh,
(29:32):
it was hard because it was snowing and that's why
things went awry. Listen, this was in Massachusetts, and.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
This is like a major city, right, Like it's not
you know the sticks, right, this is like a major
metropolitan area.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Let's be real, red solo cups. Who goes to an
investigation where a person has been killed and this is
a police officer, Karen Reid, Yeah, a police officer, no
less has been killed and his girlfriend is now looking
at a life sentence.
Speaker 3 (29:57):
This is a big deal.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Either she goes away for life or she so who
would actually be gathering evidence with red solo cups or
putting blood swabs in a paper bag?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
That alone seems banannas to me.
Speaker 5 (30:12):
Well, and that's what absolutely puts the alarm bells off
in my head. And that's why the defense is alleging
and ps. There has at different times during this first
trial and second trial, there has been a lot of
support to free Karen Read, A lot of support on
our side because she is alleging that there is a
cover up within the police department, and that John O'Keefe,
(30:33):
this poor victim, you know, at the center of it all,
there is a man who lost his life. But that
again he went inside to the house, there was a
confrontation and you know that.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
Again the dog.
Speaker 5 (30:45):
I don't know, I get a little if when the
dog's thrown out there that he was attacked or it
was a person like that just seems.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
It's life and death.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
How do you not have it should be black and white. Fact,
This is a person who was out with a group.
They were all they were all driving, they were all
boozy mcboozy, and again somebody lost their life in courtney.
To your point, our hearts are also going out to
his mother and family who have to witness this in
the courtroom. But there was like the lead investigator was
(31:14):
sending tech texts internally basically I wish I could say
it online because it's foul language and my mom would
kill me. But essentially basically saying that Karen Reid is
a see you next Tuesday, and also that she has
a flat butt and that she should kill herself.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
So this is the lead investigator.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
So if it's possible that there was something nefarious that
maybe happened in that house, you know, she was waiting
in the car. He runs in to talk to her friends,
who hasn't been in this situation where you're like, really
with your knucklehead friends, it's late, I want to go home.
We've been out drinking all night. It's time to call
it a night. He goes in, apparently never comes back.
She dips and goes home, and.
Speaker 3 (31:55):
Then starts calling him time after time after time, yelling at.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
Him, screaming at him, you're pervert, screaming all time with
other women exactly. So that's where the whole like little
sex party thing comes from.
Speaker 3 (32:07):
Rumored, rumored, rumored.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
Allegedly, allegedly, allegedly. So there just seems like there's more
to this story other than, Hey, a woman just backed
over her boyfriend and now she should go to prison
for the rest of her life.
Speaker 5 (32:18):
Though I will say the prosecution has put up a
pretty convincing case so far. I mean, with the backing up,
there has been John Keith's DNA tied to the tail
light that was busted.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
There are details about.
Speaker 5 (32:33):
When John O'Keefe's phone stopped moving, which is the same
time that Karen Reid, the accused, was allegedly backing up,
and that can't.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
Be underlined anymore.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
I mean that is think has changed. Though there's no
information on this. I have stopping here. I think that's
actually inaccurate. That's right, So what is the accurate information?
So that's what the prosecution alleges.
Speaker 5 (32:55):
Okay, the defense again, they're day one, prosecution's day six,
so we should be convinced we have heard one side
of the story, right, But in the defense is opening
their expert stipulates that no, no, there was a timing.
There was like a lag between John O'Keefe's cell phone
time and the time in the suv, and that he
(33:16):
actually could have been moving after it, which would mean
he was not hit by the car. So that's day
one though, and there's a lot. I'm gonna have to
wait to listen to.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
That, don't we think? Though?
Speaker 2 (33:26):
Karen Reid is so divisive because again, according to the
CNN polls, everybody thinks she's guilty. I must be the
only wonderful I don't know if she's guilty or innocent.
I'm just saying they have to prove it, and we
shouldn't be proving it in the media, right. But she
has sort of an affect about her. I actually don't
notice this as much because I'm back from the East
as well. It doesn't seem as though she's such a
(33:47):
tough guy. But people online just think her personality stinks.
They think she's cold and icy and she's smilingly behaving
inappropriately in the courtroom, and I personally don't really see that.
I just think she's putting on a tough exterior and
maybe she's in trouble because she's unlikable.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Well, maybe we'll have to see. Well, we want to
hear what you have to say about all snein stories.
Give us a call at one eight thirty one Crime
to talk about Diddy, Prian Coberger or Karen Reid.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
We just kind of wanted to introduce ourselves and each other.
As I've mentioned now, I'm Stephanie Leidecker and I head
up a production company that makes true crime documentaries and podcasts.
And Courtney and I go way back. We've been working
together for well over ten years or so by now.
We used to work in you know, reality shows. We
(34:43):
call it unscripted now it sounds so fancy, and we
sort of parlayed from that into true crime together.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
What was your what's your big takeaway? Oh man, my
big takeaway?
Speaker 5 (34:54):
Well, first of all, my big takeaway is what a
great pleasure it has been working with for the past
ten years. Yeah, and honestly, Stephanie is just as a
human to brag on you for a hot second. She
helms an amazing ship at Katie's Studios. She produced multiple
documentaries and justice with Nancy Grace Murdered and Missing in
(35:15):
Montana one of my favorites. Yeah, worth, I mean highly worth,
the watch and the Queen Nancy Grace.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
Come on now, come on, I can't get any more
true crime royalty.
Speaker 5 (35:25):
Yes, and Stephanie, you know it's been It's been quite
a ride. And then also tons of podcasts that we've
done for iHeart, including the piked In Massacre and the
Idaho Massacreeah.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
Courtney's the voice of all of these. So if you
recognize that sultry voice, it is Courtney Armstrong herself, the
voice of the piked In Massacre and the Idaho Massacre
and many more so yeah, the show goes on.
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Kid, Stephanie's so too much.
Speaker 5 (35:51):
But all of this crime brought us Stephanie and I
to Crime Colm on a panel, and it is at
that point where are stars aligned with Body move In,
who we met in the green room because she was
also at crime Con right on a panel.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
You guys know what crime con is.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
It's like that huge event where enthusiasts for crime shows
and things come to listen to detectives and you know,
Dan Abrams and Nancy Grace and Body move In, who
was making a big appearance there.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Right, That was a that was a fun day. I
was giving a talk about how animal abuse leads to
bigger crimes, and I was also of course talking about
don't f with cats, and you guys ran up to
me and like it felt very natural, and you know,
here we are, like two years later, we've worked on
a couple things together and now we're doing this and
I couldn't be happier to be here.
Speaker 5 (36:47):
Yeah, I was gonna say it was kind of a scene.
Stephanie and I were a little fan girling. Definitely not
the smoothest moment, but instant.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
I never made an ego boost.
Speaker 4 (36:57):
I'll go to crime con because everybody comes up to
the everybody fangirls and it makes me.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
Feel really Yeah, we were alone, we were like, there
she is.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
It's body moving because if you haven't seen her work
on the documentary don f with Kats, which you can
see on Netflix, it's astounding and it really personally changed
my DNA.
Speaker 3 (37:13):
I watched it.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
I've said this many times during COVID and I really
think it's shaped a lot of the things and decisions
we made as a company thereafter. So in my opinion,
you hold the keys to greatness. So when Courtney and
I were in the same green room with you, you know,
we're eating the donuts and having their free coffee, and
they were like, there's body and we literally tackled her
(37:35):
and it was love at first sight and it's been
it's been a real joy ride ever since. So yeah, yeah,
the best thing. I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 3 (37:42):
I'm so excited. I just love talking true crime.
Speaker 4 (37:45):
I love talking with girls, and I feel like we're
sitting around the kitchen table with a cup of coffee
and that's what you know, and that's what I think
the vibe of the show is right exactly.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Chatting with your girlfriends, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
And that's why you guys, you know, have to call us,
you know, call us at eight eight eight three to
one crime.
Speaker 8 (38:02):
Can you hear me?
Speaker 3 (38:03):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Welcome, Welcome, Heather, you have me, Stephanie, you, Courtney and Body.
Speaker 8 (38:09):
Hi ladies.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
Hello.
Speaker 8 (38:11):
I was calling to ask there's a lot of discussion
online on whether Karen is guilty or innocent, but I
was more curious about your opinions on whether or not
the prosecution has actually proven the keyse because they have
skipped over a lot of key witnesses in the in
the case this time, Albert, Yes.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Great question. Who wants that question?
Speaker 4 (38:38):
You know, it's such a hard one to answer in Heather,
You're right, this is like a super divisive case online,
and I feel like, no matter which what you say
about it, you're going to get lambassad from the other side.
These these sides hate each other, Okay, the free Karen
repeople hate the guilty Karen repeople.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
So I feel like either way we answered this, we're
going to get in trouble.
Speaker 4 (38:59):
However, I think it's too early to say whether the
prosecution has proved their case. I think by now we
should have an answer to that. But because this case
is so god, it's so divisive, it's hard to say
I would say they have not. Here's my thing. I
think Karen Reid is guilty, but I think guilt and
(39:22):
provable guilt are two different things, right, Like, it's just
not the same thing. And I don't because the defense
basically is going to show and we're going to hear
all about it coming up. How terrible this investigation was
and how terrible police you know, crime scene I was
processed from start to finish was just terrible. I think
(39:45):
that there's going to be at least one juror that's
going to have reasonable doubt on whether or not she's
guilty or not. And I just don't think the state
proved it.
Speaker 3 (39:54):
I agree, Heather. What do you think? Heather? Where are
you calling us from? We're so excited to know.
Speaker 8 (40:01):
Oh I'm calling from Florida.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
Nice. So what do you think, Heather? What's your what's your.
Speaker 8 (40:08):
I I don't know where I stand on whether some
days I think she's guilty, some days I think she's innocent.
But either way, I don't think that there's any way
that any jury could find her guilty because of the
investigation personally, I think they grossly mishandled it from don't
you think Heether that.
Speaker 4 (40:29):
Don't you think Heather that it's a gross injustice to
John O'Keeffe, like their fellow police officer, that this was handled.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
Absolutely, I hopefull. We need to keep that up.
Speaker 4 (40:39):
Front, like there's a victim here and you know, and
often he gets lost in the sauce.
Speaker 7 (40:45):
He does.
Speaker 8 (40:46):
And I feel like, as a brother in blue, you
would have expected them to cross all their tees and
dot every eye and for them to just be no,
like so nonchalant about it is absolutely wild to me.
And he deserved better, They owed him better, And yes,
I just the whole thing is super sad because whether
(41:09):
she's found guilty or innocent, there's never going to be
justice for him in my opinions, because of the way
that the police conducted themselves in the investigation, and they
can't go back and get a redo.
Speaker 4 (41:20):
Well, Hart, thank you so much for calling. Welcome to
the True Crime Tonight. Family, Thank you so much for calling.
We again, if you want to give us a call,
call us at one eight eight eight thirty one Crime.
But we're going to jump right into another case and
we're going to be talking about a kidnapping in New
York City, and I'm telling the story. And this is
I swear I'm going to get all the crazy stories. Okay,
(41:41):
So if you want to know what's happening in the
crazy town, just follow a body moving. Okay, this is
this is pretty crazy. There's a guy in New York
that basically is running down the street in like pajamas
and a polo shirt and he's barefoot, he's bloody. This
is all captured on video. And he runs up to
(42:02):
a New York City police officer. This isn't like beautiful, soho.
You know, Manhattan in New York City very posh, very
beautiful in the city.
Speaker 3 (42:12):
Yeah, very say, it's literally sucks in the city. Okay.
Speaker 4 (42:15):
And he's running down the street and he runs up
to a police officer and you know, he's bruised and bloodied.
And this is the surveillance video that's been released, and
what we find out behind it, behind the scenes, is
that he's been kidnapped by the King of Crypto in Kentucky.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
Quite a mouthful.
Speaker 5 (42:36):
It's quite him name himself or is that like a
pals call him that?
Speaker 3 (42:41):
Right?
Speaker 4 (42:42):
No, that's like his self proclaimed name. Well hit the
victim's name he well, the victim is from Italy, Okay,
name is Michael Cadaran, and he's also a crypto king
basically of Italy. He's got millions of dollars in cryptocurrency.
And they the people that napped him or trying to
get basically his seed, his password, his his bitcoin password
(43:06):
to steal from him. And here's what they did, you guys.
I mean, it's absolutely insane. They took his passport and
all of his electronics devices. They beat him with the pistol,
held a gun to his head, used a chainsaw on
his leg. They urinated on him, they peed on him,
you guys. They tied him up, They dangle him off
(43:27):
the building. It's very shug Night, right, it's very you know,
dangling from the building, like we learned he did to
like Vanilla Ice, right, Like, it's very super villain what
they did to this man. And eventually he was like, okay,
I'm going to give you my passwords, but it's on
my computer at my hotel room. So they're like going
to basically get his computer, and that's when he is
(43:48):
able to escape. But he was held for three weeks.
You guys, three weeks he was held.
Speaker 2 (43:53):
He was held hostage, and exactly, it's right out of
the scariest movie. And by the way, these were like young,
successful men with big lives ahead. So how is it
possible that this is your version of something going correctly?
You know, they knew this guy, so they lured this
man from Italy under the pretense that they were going to,
(44:14):
you know, get some negotiations going. They had some sort
of a partnership that was longstanding. Can you imagine you
come to New York City and you go meet your
buds and suddenly you're now being locked up and frankly
nature for all intensive purposes. They were being waterboarded. It's nuts.
Speaker 5 (44:34):
And it seems like this was not their first negative interaction.
This one escalated really high, but this was not the
first time they had been in bad contact. So there's
also in addition to the two men who have been
arrested for this kidnapping, there is also a third. It's
(44:55):
a young woman. She's twenty four years old, and I
believe she was an assist, didn't right, Beatrice, Beatrice, That's right.
Speaker 4 (45:03):
Beatrice Fulci. She was the owner of the Soho apartment
John Waltz. She was his assistant to him. But here's
the thing. She's been released with prosecution deferred, which is interesting. Well,
I kind of wonder if it means that she's like
basically going to be cooperating and getting some kind of
immunity deal where she'll be able to testify against the
(45:27):
two that are accused. Now, the two that are accused,
one is William Duplessi. Now he here's this kind of
like grinds on my gears. You guys, he was able
to negotiate a surrenderer, okay, and he after he negotiated
the surrender, he went and partied in the Hamptons for
a couple of days and then just kind of waltzed
(45:47):
in and turned himself in, Like how do you get
to do that for torturing somebody?
Speaker 6 (45:51):
For it's so.
Speaker 5 (45:52):
Gross just to party in the Hamptons and to make
that arrangement and coming like it's disgusting.
Speaker 4 (45:59):
It's not that, but you just tortured a guy for
three weeks and now you're just like, oh, gonna go party,
Like how depraved you have to be? And listen, these
guys are already mega rich, right, how much more money
do they need that they're going to torture this guy
for there has to be more to this story. There
has to be more to this. In my humble opinion,
(46:19):
it seems impossible that it's just over money when they're
obviously so wealthy to begin with.
Speaker 3 (46:24):
Well, Crypto King of Kentucky is allegedly worth almost one
hundred million dollars? Is how much more does he need?
How give me a break?
Speaker 5 (46:33):
But this is so deviant. It goes to some different psychology.
It's like, I mean, it's like some American psycho stuff,
a little.
Speaker 3 (46:41):
Bit, a little bit well, you know.
Speaker 4 (46:42):
Sources with knowledge of the situation told reporters that two
of the two men that have been accused have been
violent with the victim in the past, but not to
this level.
Speaker 3 (46:53):
Not to this level. There was a chainsaw involved. They
took a chainsaw to his leg. Oh isn't it yeah? Crazy?
It's like, yes, but.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
They didn't like chop off his leg or anything. I mean,
you can see him walking down the street. His leg
is perfectly intact. I want to make that clear. But
there there's definitely some kind of deviant behavior. They peed
on him, you guys, they peed on this guy. They
electrocuted him.
Speaker 5 (47:15):
There has also there has been a spate of crypto
kidnappings going on in Paris, for example, there has been
multiple kidnappings out on the street and broad daylight to
get money from people who hold crypto and body, am
I correct that right where you are in Vegas?
Speaker 3 (47:34):
Yeah? What happened just happened.
Speaker 4 (47:36):
So there was a big convention here in Vegas and
one of the guys was giving like a keynote speech
on it and he's finished, and he's going home. And
as he's going home, these three kids, literal kids, they're
sixteen years old from Florida. They drove to Vegas to
kidnap this guy. They successfully kidnapped him and drove him
to the Arizona desert and they successfully stole four million
(47:59):
dollars from.
Speaker 3 (48:00):
What Yeah, did they get away with it?
Speaker 4 (48:03):
They well know they were caught because you know, he
was able to he survived. He walked five miles through
the desert to get to a phone to call for help.
Speaker 3 (48:13):
This poor guy.
Speaker 4 (48:16):
Yeah, so this is going to be like, I think,
a new wave of of robbery because you know, crypto
is you know, I guess it's kind of you know, untraceable,
because you're sending him to anonymous blockchain wallet addresses, which
you really can't really trace because there's no name attached
to it. So this is going to be the wave
of the future, and I think we're going to be
hearing about this a lot more.
Speaker 5 (48:36):
You're listening to True Crime tonight on iHeartRadio, where we
talk true crime all the time. I'm Courtney Armstrong here
with Stephanie Leidecker and body move in. If you want
to weigh in, we want to hear from you. Call
us eighty eight three one Crime or hit us on
the talkbacks on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
Have you guys heard of the Gone Girl? The real
life Gone Girl, Sherry Peppini. She's the girl who said
that she was kidnapped and abducted by an ex who
branded her and her husband and children were not only
looking for her, the whole country, the whole world was
looking for her. And it turns out that she was
(49:23):
being dishonest and is recently been released from prison and
is speaking out for the first time.
Speaker 5 (49:30):
Yeah, I mean you call her gone girl, I call
her liar, liar, pants on fire And she for a
while was America's what was it?
Speaker 3 (49:38):
Super Mom? Oh gosh, she's another woman of many names.
Speaker 5 (49:42):
But last week Shary Pepinie is back big in the
news because Investigation Discovery they just put out Cherry Peppini
Caught in a Lie. Caught in the Lie. It's a
four part documentary series and it features Sherry Peppini and
it seemed it's like she is changing her story yet again.
(50:03):
This will be the third iteration. So Steph, like you said,
it was back in twenty sixteen when she went for
a run in where she lives in Redding, California, and
then simply vanished.
Speaker 3 (50:17):
Her husband.
Speaker 5 (50:18):
At the time he came home, her car was in
the driveway where it shouldn't have been, and their two
young children were in daycare. Her husband immediately calls the police,
and this search goes on twenty two really long days.
And do you guys remember how big.
Speaker 3 (50:36):
Yeah, I was concerned looking for Sherry.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
All eyes were out and I think she came back
on Thanksgiving or something.
Speaker 3 (50:43):
Right it was, it was right around there. There was
a hero return, a hero return. Absolutely, she came home.
It was Thanksgiving day.
Speaker 5 (50:51):
She's weighing eighty seven pounds and she had lost all
of this weight in that twenty two days, her hair
has been cut off off, the branding, like you said,
and the beating and the bruises, and so at the time, oh,
thank god, America's mom supermom is back, and.
Speaker 4 (51:11):
Everybody's fawning over her, right like they're taking care of her,
like look at the bruises, like, oh my god, it's
like a you know, she's getting all this sympathy in her,
you know, like a husband's.
Speaker 3 (51:21):
Like excited that she's home. Like just that's right. And
so we're just trying to set the story right, like
remember this time, and you know, she was just getting
all this attention that everybody was fawning all over her,
that's right.
Speaker 5 (51:34):
And not only was she getting attention, she got three
hundred thousand dollars or actually more than because for this
six years while Sherry Peppini the hoax was not proven otherwise,
so it was just horay, she's home, supermom.
Speaker 3 (51:51):
Thank god.
Speaker 5 (51:53):
She collected all this money from victim compensations funds, donations
from public people were donating to her out of their
own pocket, as well as disability payments. But guess what
that cut up to her because when the investigators started
unfolding and saying something is not right. One of her
(52:13):
main charges was mail fraud, and that was because that
had to do with while she was lying, she used
the mail to obtain these funds from, for example, the
California Victim Compensation Board.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
So taking from real victims. Yeah, three hundred thousand dollars.
That disgusted money, that's right. Wow.
Speaker 5 (52:35):
And then so she ended up she was sent to
she pled guilty, so there was no trial. She went
to federal prison for eighteen months. And then now again
she's kind of she's back on the scene. And what
she had said was it was two Hispanic women in
masks who kidnapped her and did all of the beating. Ultimately,
(52:58):
it was revealed that no, she was hiding out at
her boyfriend's house. Remember she's married, so it's a little
inconvenient to have a husband.
Speaker 3 (53:07):
And a boyfriend.
Speaker 5 (53:09):
Things got dicey with the husband, and so she went
to chill out with this boyfriend and that was the story,
and that he had no he was aware she was
sort of harming herself, but that she was the one
who precipitated this whole event.
Speaker 4 (53:23):
He didn't notice that she was like cutting her hair
off and got down to eighty seven pounds and was
branding herself like.
Speaker 3 (53:29):
What the heck?
Speaker 2 (53:30):
Well, according to her, he was branding her. So yes,
a little bit of more backstory. Sherry Peppini had a husband, Keith,
and Keith did this documentary. It's very good and it's
basically his side of the story, which was everything you
could imagine, where's my wife? My kids miss their mom.
This is devastating, and she comes from a really loving family,
(53:52):
so everybody was looking for her, myself included. So now
that she's out of prison, you know, look and she
tells a different tale. Her take on it is that
she married Keith. They were very young. It was her
first kiss in seventh grade. They go way back. He
kind of held the purse strings in their relationship. She
(54:13):
had a job, lost that job, had kids, became a
stay at home mom, and little by Little tells a
story of how she was just unhappy and felt as
though she didn't really have any outside sources and she
couldn't make her own money, and that her husband was
a bit controlling, and she started kind of texting with
(54:34):
this ex boyfriend of hers.
Speaker 3 (54:36):
By the way, they seemed very immature.
Speaker 2 (54:38):
She even said that too it seemed like they married
young and were a little you know, immature generally speaking.
And she started texting with an ex and I guess
like there was a funeral and she was reaching out
because of the funeral, and so it escalates, and she
also realized that she couldn't exactly leave her husband for
(54:59):
this ex boyfriend because she had no money. He actually
made her sign a post up, and in that post up,
a post up is sort of like a prenup, but
after marriage.
Speaker 3 (55:12):
He made her sign.
Speaker 2 (55:13):
That because if she was unfaithful or looked at another guy,
she would be left with nothing. And that was a
way for in her opinion, allegedly, that was a way
for her husband to control, control the narrative and control her.
And in a very desperate, bad scenario right now, add
(55:33):
two kids and you know whatever, she has this big
kakamimi idea that she's going to go visit her her
lovely ex. And and so the branding begins.
Speaker 3 (55:45):
Wow. But speaking of documentary, have you guys seen it yet?
Speaker 6 (55:48):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (55:48):
Yeah, oh you want so you did?
Speaker 7 (55:50):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (55:51):
So, my friend Michelle saw it and she said she
wanted to punch her through the TV.
Speaker 3 (55:55):
How did you feel? Oh, my God, I felt a
little bit more compassion for her. You I did.
Speaker 2 (56:01):
Listen, I'm a bit of a sucker too. I am
three of us, let's be honest, I'm the gullible one.
I was very confused by her. And again those branding
and the bruises, it was all very intense. She kind
of just feels like somebody who got very in over
their head and definitely made a really bad judgment call.
(56:22):
And I mean, this is as I'm saying this, I
want to throw up in my own mouth.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
So thanks, regardless, can I take that record?
Speaker 3 (56:31):
Agree with you?
Speaker 4 (56:31):
But she took three hundred thousand dollars from victims basically,
and from me also.
Speaker 2 (56:36):
The bigger I was going to say, the investigation, all
those police resources that could have been used to actually
solve crimes that were really happening at that time, How
very very dangerous and how very targeted to say it
was two Hispanic women.
Speaker 3 (56:51):
That's like, you know, a real problem, very very serious.
Speaker 4 (56:55):
And the other real problem too, is now other victims
who actually might have issues are going to be not
It's kind of like the boy who cried Wolf's like,
is she is she really missing or is she just shock?
Speaker 6 (57:06):
It?
Speaker 3 (57:06):
Up with her boyfriend, Like, the disservice you're doing to
future victims is unforgivable in my book, absolutely unforgivable. And
by the way that.
Speaker 5 (57:15):
They to involve literally the nation to get in on
what's doing in your marriage, which is I mean, that's
how it started and that's what it escalated to. It's
really hard to be sympathetic to her. So I have
not seen the documentary yet. I will be in the
coming days, but it's I don't know. Maybe I'll be Swede,
(57:39):
and like I said, maybe they'll be compassion but they're still.
Speaker 3 (57:42):
Going into it very prejudiced.
Speaker 2 (57:44):
I'm not really actually just say I'm not pro Peppini
in either scenario.
Speaker 3 (57:48):
I have no real skin in the game.
Speaker 2 (57:50):
I just felt like they both have these opposing documentaries
which tell very different tales, and look, at the end
of the day, who cares. She has been forced to
pay restitution. I think the police said that she she
roughly spent about one hundred and fifty thousand dollars in
law enforcement. You know, just that's a pretty big deployment
of funding. So of course she has to pay that back,
(58:13):
and you know, she has trouble seeing her kids and
and allegedly she has a new boyfriend that's very wealthy,
and know, it just seems like a mess.
Speaker 4 (58:22):
So what is she saying She's saying that in this documentary.
Is she saying that, you know, she was a victim
really and that he was responsible for this?
Speaker 2 (58:30):
Yeah, there's a little bit of you know, she seems
a little like unhinged, no question, But again, is that
a crime to be?
Speaker 3 (58:36):
On hand? She's hinge. She seems like a.
Speaker 2 (58:38):
Little bit out there and a little less you know,
a little less apologetic than perhaps we would want her
to be. You know, her parents were also on the documentary.
Her former sister in law also appears on the documentary.
And look, she just seems like this very young girl
who's now an adult woman who did serve her time.
And again it sounds like I'm justifying Sherry Pippini's behavior.
Speaker 3 (59:01):
I am not. I'm just saying and seeing it.
Speaker 2 (59:04):
I felt a little compassion for her, just as a
woman who really felt like she was a bit trapped
financially and you know, wanted to have a little excitement
in her life.
Speaker 3 (59:14):
And man that ever backfire.
Speaker 4 (59:16):
I mean I would feel the same way if she
didn't blame two Hispanic women and they can torture herself.
Speaker 2 (59:22):
Oh what she said about that was that she because
she felt like she was afraid. Because now her story is,
as I say this, I'm changing my vote. Okay, because
now her story is the boyfriend that she was, you know,
hanging with for that you know, little stint that she's
saying that he was actually abusive and he did the
branding and it was against her will, and she was
(59:43):
too afraid to tell anybody when she came back, and
that her way of telling people was that in the
sketch of the Hispanic woman, apparently that sketch looks just
like the ex boyfriend's mother, and that was a way
for her to signal to a thought.
Speaker 3 (01:00:00):
Wink wink.
Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
You know, I know I'm saying to Hispanic women, but
here's a picture of my ex boyfriend who branded me
against my own wills.
Speaker 3 (01:00:10):
Mother.
Speaker 4 (01:00:11):
Okay, Well, I'm rolling my eyes again. I am rolling
my again. We'll stick around because we've got a lot
more to dig into. A lot more. We're gonna be
talking about Todd and Julie Chrisly's pardon from prison, and
later we're going to be hearing from you stick around
true crime tonight will we talk true crime all the time.
Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
So, guys, the Chrislies have been pardoned. You know America's
reality TV star gems. If you haven't seen their show before,
it's called Chrisly Knows Best. It was on for many
many years. And then the parents, Todd Krisly, Julie Chrisly,
they were they were basically imprisoned for tax evasion and
(01:00:58):
now we're pardoned by is it in Trump't.
Speaker 4 (01:01:02):
Think it's making all the news and like, listen, if
you work like two jobs like me, I didn't. I
didn't even know about this. I had to learn all
about this. So if you're anything like me and you're
just too busy, I'm going to bring up to speed
because it's everywhere right now, it's all over social media.
Savannah his daughter, I should say their daughter, because right
now it feels like Todd's getting all the attention, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (01:01:23):
Poor Julie.
Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
By the way, Julie deserves a high five because Todd
does steal her spotlight.
Speaker 3 (01:01:32):
I mean at the press.
Speaker 4 (01:01:33):
So there was a press conference and it was it
was Todd and Savannah his daughter, their daughter. See I'm
doing it an it's their daughter, Well, Savannah, it kind
of led this effort, this campaign to pardon her parents.
And she got a phone call last week from President
Donald Trump and said, you know, your parents seem like
(01:01:55):
really nice people. I feel like they've been railroaded. I'm paraphrasing, please,
you know, I feel like they've been railroaded. They're going
to be home tomorrow. And sure enough, guess what, she
went and picked them up. The next day, they're home
and guess what else, guess who was with her. We're
learning this is breaking news a camera crew.
Speaker 3 (01:02:15):
I'm so unsurprising, and I know it's very unsurprising.
Speaker 4 (01:02:19):
So Lifetime green lit a project to kind of document
the struggles that you know, the family's facing. You know,
the parents are in prison, the kids are taking care
of the other kids. It's, you know, a sad situation,
very surface level. Well, right after this got green lit,
they got pardoned. So now the project is apparently changing. Right,
(01:02:40):
It's not going to be these poor kids, you know,
talking to their parents on you know, monitors and you know,
through email tablets and in jail. They're going to be
talking face to face in person. This is completely changes
the project. And I mean, I feel like Lifetime really
scored here right, like watching, Oh, I'll be watching for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:03:00):
It's pretty interesting because Todd Crisly, who's the patriarch of
the family and on the show, if you've never seen it,
he is sort of this bossy, flamboyant, ritzy, fancy guy
and he runs the roost. That's kind of the stick.
And Julie is his devoted wife. And look, Julie went
down with him. The two of them definitely served some time.
But Todd the dad was very outspoken about the prison
(01:03:22):
conditions and the prison that he was being held in
is actually being kind of put to rest, like they're
slowly getting rid of inmates, and that might be a
part of this equation that's alleged. We don't know that
for sure. But interestingly enough, do you guys remember when
Kim Kardashian when she got an inmate released from prison
(01:03:46):
several years ago. Her name was Alice Marie Johnson.
Speaker 3 (01:03:49):
Do you guys remember this?
Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
She was doing time for cocaine distribution for life without parole.
Speaker 3 (01:03:54):
Now she's free.
Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
She's working within the Trump administration as like a tzar,
the pardon czar. I'm not totally sure what their leans
but it's like a real thing.
Speaker 3 (01:04:07):
Kim Kardashian is no, no Alice. You just got to
keep up. You got to keep up. So it's really Alice.
Speaker 2 (01:04:17):
Marie Johnson is the woman who was behind bars, and
due to Kim Kardashian's you know, impact, as she has
been released and now she's in charge of getting the
Chris Lyes out, so she's sort of air quotes paying
it forward. And if you saw the you know, the
press conference that Todd did you know he is speaking
(01:04:37):
about prison reform and that it's inequitable, which of course
it is, and that's sort of his now new mission.
But we'll kind of we'll see. What's kind of terrible though,
is poor Julie the wife. I shouldn't say poor Julie
because she was convicted of a very serious crime, So
I say that a little bit. I don't mean to
be glib, but she came out from prison now years
(01:04:59):
later her and she typically has very bright blonde hair
and is in full makeup, and now she has gray
hair and no makeup and is a different woman. Time
has passed, well, she's only been impressed for like three years,
but still she's not like.
Speaker 3 (01:05:14):
And your roots. I get you, Yeah, maybe she has
gray hair, yet I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:05:19):
I'm very like, yeah, quitting, I don't know, I know,
and I'm a natural blonde to right. So they say, well,
so Julie gets out, she's great, and all everyone talks
about is how Todd is so ripped and he's so
and how terrible poor Julie looks.
Speaker 4 (01:05:34):
And they even mentioned at the press conference about how
it beamed.
Speaker 5 (01:05:38):
So mom, she's like, he looks so much better coming
out than he looked going in.
Speaker 3 (01:05:42):
It did him a favor.
Speaker 5 (01:05:44):
So I wanted really quickly to talk about presidential pardons
because this got me a google. I really said, you
know what, I have no idea how it actually works.
So not a history lesson, real quick a pardon. It's
a form of legal forgiveness and it's granted only by
the president. It specifically wipes away a federal conviction and
(01:06:05):
any related punishment.
Speaker 3 (01:06:07):
It doesn't apply to state charges. So that's and that's
why this is a big deal for Diddy too.
Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
So, just to circle back to an earlier conversation, that
would give the president the power to potentially release Diddy
should he choose to.
Speaker 3 (01:06:19):
And again, this is not a Trump thing.
Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
You know, every president roster of pardon, so you know,
we're keeping out of any of that judgment. But you know,
look what he said, you know at his press conference
and by him, I mean Todd Qrisley with his daughter Savannah,
is that you know, he received terrible treatment behind behind
prison bars, but that he had better treatment than some
(01:06:44):
of his fellow inmates, and that there's a race disparity
in that. That's something that he's going to now be
a priority and that's going to be his platform.
Speaker 3 (01:06:54):
So he's going to pay it forward.
Speaker 4 (01:06:56):
I tell you, I was very judgmental when I was
going into watching this press I was like, a rich
guy gets pardoned.
Speaker 3 (01:07:02):
Okay, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (01:07:03):
But then when I actually listened to it, I was
actually pretty impressed with what he had to say.
Speaker 3 (01:07:08):
You know, but here's a thing.
Speaker 4 (01:07:10):
I'm still going to be judgmental, because you can say
one thing and not do it.
Speaker 3 (01:07:14):
But he said he's going.
Speaker 4 (01:07:15):
To use his voice, you know, and champion these issues
in the pedal system, and if he sticks to that,
I'm a fan.
Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
And by the way, the statistics are pretty harrowing, and
he may note of this in the press conference as well,
and we did another googling of that as well. The
Bureau of Justice Statistics says that twelve point four percent
of the population is African American, yet thirty two percent
of individuals in the state or federal system are also
(01:07:44):
African Americans.
Speaker 3 (01:07:45):
So that seems, you know, unfair. And he made a
very clean example.
Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
Is like he was able to get some sort of
privileges that some of his fellow inmates were not, and
he felt that that was racially charged. So look, if
he could shed a highlight on something positive and make
this mess something positive, great. If not, somehow, I'm still
going to be watching the Lifetime show.
Speaker 4 (01:08:07):
Don't judge me, judge, where's my gavel? I need a gavel,
sound judge to the judge. But you know, again, a
real fall from grace, you know. So now their family
is back together, hopefully for happier times.
Speaker 2 (01:08:24):
Well, you guys look so convinced. I just saw dummy
eye rolls. Nobody cares about Julie Chrisly's hair journey.
Speaker 3 (01:08:29):
I mean, I really don't, don't.
Speaker 5 (01:08:33):
They're thirty million dollars that they care they had.
Speaker 3 (01:08:37):
It's it's hard for my heart to bleed.
Speaker 5 (01:08:39):
Sympathy same, you know, when you've been doing that when
people don't have a dollar to their name.
Speaker 4 (01:08:44):
Right, And I mean would if if they didn't have money,
right and they weren't so high profile, would they be
getting a pardon. That's also like something that I think about,
you know, like why them and not the you know
his sell me?
Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
Well, his take on that is that he was on
fairly targeted or everybody says that.
Speaker 4 (01:09:02):
Nobody's going like, yeah, I did it, I'm guilty. I
deserve to be here. Hardly anybody does that. They're all,
you know, innocent and head they've all been railroaded.
Speaker 3 (01:09:11):
Why them? Why?
Speaker 2 (01:09:14):
Well, he believes that law enforcement specifically targeted them because
of their fame and their notoriety, and that that is
why he just honestly, he couldn't he couldn't get a
fair shake. By the way, They're not the only ones
in reality TV who have had a bad a bad run.
You know, remember the Teresa from the Real Housewives of
(01:09:35):
New Journey.
Speaker 3 (01:09:36):
Yes, yeah, I thought you're gonna say me, I was
gonna know. I would never let go to prison. He
went to.
Speaker 5 (01:09:42):
Prison, and our husband, Joe Judice, I believe it is
and he doesn't even like.
Speaker 3 (01:09:49):
To Italy.
Speaker 5 (01:09:51):
That's right, there's another story. We'll just touch on it
a little bit. We might need to get into it
another time because it's a big one. But did you
guys hear about the Love Island alum Mischelle Barnett.
Speaker 4 (01:10:05):
Yes, he lives in Utah, Salt Lake City and his partner.
His girlfriend reported threats to her life, assault and attempted
strangulation in front of their child, in front of their
little kid. She suffered symptoms including she couldn't breathe, she
had some neck pains, she was throwing up, she couldn't
remember anything. And now if you don't know who he is,
(01:10:28):
he was on Love Island Season USA season one and
The Challenge USA in twenty twenty two. Now, this is
a pretty big mental break. And I have to tell you,
as somebody that's spent on reality TV. I was on
The Mole on Netflix. You go through massive mental testing.
They don't just accept anybody. You have to basically pass
(01:10:48):
mental like excruciating mental challenges in order to even get
accepted to be on the show because they put you
through hell. You guys, I mean, they really put you
through the ring. Are all worth it, by the but
I will say it's it's harrowing that the things that
you have to go through. So I'm really surprised that
a lot of these reality stars are experiencing some of
(01:11:10):
these mental breaks. I'm very surprised because I mean, I
just can't imagine going through all these tests and then
having this kind of thing happen.
Speaker 5 (01:11:18):
Well, that's that's a fair point, because those batteries of
tests and they are they are deep, they're intense, they're intense,
So it kind of begs the question to me is
that does someone go in mentally healthy, stable, strong of
mind and then the process something happens.
Speaker 3 (01:11:37):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:11:38):
It has been a real night of chat and we're
going to be here tomorrow also talking about some of
the stuff that we covered tonight as well. The Didy
trial Week four kicks off on Monday, as well as
the Karen Reid trial. The defense kicks in tomorrow, so
we'll be covering that all week as well. And there
also might be a killer, potentially a serial killer in
(01:12:00):
the Northeast. So this doesn't work if we don't hear
from you, So any night this week, please call us
at eight eight eight three to one Crime and we
actually have a caller right now named Abraham, So we're
looking forward to hearing from that. And also if there
are cases that you want us to cover or start tracking,
please also let us know that as well. The whole
(01:12:21):
idea of this is to create a swell and have
a conversation for all of us.
Speaker 3 (01:12:26):
So, Abraham, what do we think? I don't know.
Speaker 5 (01:12:30):
I'm dying to know what Abraham has to say. How
are you this evening?
Speaker 3 (01:12:33):
Hi? Abraham?
Speaker 6 (01:12:35):
Hi, I'm good. How are you guys?
Speaker 3 (01:12:37):
We're good. Where are you calling us from?
Speaker 6 (01:12:39):
I am in Phoenix, Chandler specifically, I love thanks.
Speaker 3 (01:12:43):
Thanks for joining us on our first night. Abraham, what
is your question?
Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
Hi?
Speaker 6 (01:12:48):
So I was listening for the on the Ditty Trial
and I was just wondering, don't do you guys feel
like you know? These a lot of these testimonies, these
people are risking everything, you know, like how protected? How
protected are they when they when they're using you know,
a different name, but everybody knows that it was a
former assistant, you know, Like how protected could they be?
(01:13:10):
Could the court really pull them?
Speaker 3 (01:13:13):
Great question? Did he sitting right there?
Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
So they can be as anonymous as they want by name,
But there, you're sitting right in front of the person
who you're most afraid of, and right question.
Speaker 4 (01:13:23):
Again, he's being charged with racketeering, so that means basically
they're saying that he has a criminal enterprise, which means basically,
you know, he has a team of people that are
doing his bidding, right, and they're not all locked up,
So are they at risk?
Speaker 3 (01:13:39):
I think that's an excellent question. There's a great question. See.
Speaker 5 (01:13:43):
I like to think since this is now out in
the light of day, it's at least less risky. I'm
not saying no risk at all, and I'm the bravery.
I can't even begin to applaud on their end. But now,
I mean, you know, even with pseudonyms like you said,
now everyone knows everything. So I think it would have
(01:14:04):
been much more dangerous prior to stop someone before they
were going to testify. And now it's kind of the
damage is done and the federal government would be after
Diddy and any cohorts so quickly, is my thought.
Speaker 2 (01:14:20):
But you just don't know. I mean, he knows somebody everywhere.
I mean, that's the assertion, right, is that there are
people around every bend that are getting paid off. We
saw that happen at the CNN when that video was
leaked of Cassie Ventura being beaten up. The reality is
that was surveillance footage that was from many years ago,
(01:14:41):
and did he paid people off so that never saw
the light of day allegedly, So you know, to that end, yeah,
I think it's pretty dangerous and I think it's really
brave for any witness in a high profile case to
come forward. Period the end, and you know, I guess
this week will be very ten because there's many more
to come. So please, you know, the hope is that
(01:15:04):
you're going to stay with us all week as we
follow this trial and so many more because this is
the summer of trials. There are so many around the
bend and look, we're not lawyers, but we do love
to unpack it and unrelated to one. So we'll have
to call him tomorrow as well, So stay with us,
please join us. Thank you for a great first night,
(01:15:25):
and thank you for those that called in, and we
look so much forward to hearing more. This has been
true Crime Tonight, where we talk about true crime all
the time.
This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,
and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,
it's affiliates, or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio, where we talk
true crime all the time. Tonight is Sunday, June first,
and it's our first official live show and we have
a stacked night of headlines. Another former employee of Ditty
turns against him. Week four of the trial lies ahead,
New claims and the Idaho College murders. Could the killer
still be out there? And the prosecution rests in the
(00:42):
Karen Reid retrial. I'm Stephanie Leidecker and I head U
KAT Studios where we make true crime podcasts and documentaries
and I get to do that with Courtney Armstrong, hour
producer and crime analyst.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Body move in. So Ladies night one.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
So there is so much to unpack and Body, let's
start with you.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Where should we begin? First case of the first show? Wow?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Okay, So let's just die right in now if you
haven't been following along, and what's happening with Diddy or
what he's being accused of by basically the United States
of America, the federal government is prosecuting him. So if
you haven't been paying attention, I'm just going to bring
you up to speed very very quickly, so that moving
forward you can just kind of like follow along where
you left off. So Sean Ditty Combs is being charged
(01:29):
with sex trafficking and racketeering, and a lot of times
when you're thinking about racketeering, you're thinking about the mafia
and whatnot, and we're going to get into that a
little bit later, but just kind of keeping the back
of your mind about what he's being charged with and
what the federal government is saying is that he used
his influence and money and power to perform all these
(01:50):
illegal acts, and he used a criminal enterprise to do so.
He additionally is being charged with sex trafficking, which we
all kind of know what that means without getting into
like the nitty gritty, because we are on the radio,
we have to be careful. So where we are right
now is last week on Friday, a woman that went
by the name of Mia. She is a former assistant
(02:12):
to Ditty and she worked for him for like eight years,
for like a really long time. She was his assistant
and she was hired to like anticipate all of Ditty's
needs and probably not realizing how you know, insane he
would turn out to be. She was really happy to
be taking this job, and you know she's in the
music industry. Well, she said the highs were really high
(02:33):
and the lows are really low. She testified that sometimes
she didn't sleep for days while working for Ditty. She
testified that sometimes she went five days and she would
live on adderall just to make it through the week.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
And they would basically allegedly pump her and others.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Full of drugs.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Right, so this was a bubble that allegedly and Diddy controlled.
And if you don't know who Diddy is, I was
explaining this to my mom and just for her. Really,
he's a clarity, you know. Sean Combs is also known
as Diddy. He's also known as Puff Daddy. He's gone
by love back in the day, and look, he was
a very huge deal.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
He's a mogul and entrepreneur, assive.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah, he ran or runs Bad Boy Records, right, he
was the founder. And this is really a fall from grace,
if ever there was one.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Right, I mean, how humiliating, especially the details of these stories,
like it's got to be humiliating, but you know what,
if any of it is true, shame on him. He
deserves the humiliation. So Mia testified about several ways in
which Combes was violent with her as well. He would
throw things at me. He's thrown me against the wall,
he's thrown me into a pool, and he's thrown ice
(03:43):
buckets on my head. She also testified that he has
sexually assaulted her on more than one occasion.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Like, so think about this.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
This is an employee and that's I think a big
piece of this case in terms of the racketeering versus
him being discharged for domestic violence, right for sexual assault,
which would be I think a state charge.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
This is federal.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
So this is the big dogs coming in. They raided
his house both in Miami and in bel Air, and
it is not looking very promising because person after person
after person keeps, you know, corroborating a very similar story
of violence and this controlling environment that was really hard
to escape.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
Yeah, and they felt really kind of emboldened to stay
there too, because this is her big break, Like she's
you know, in the music industry. Now you know, he's
got money and power and he could root her. Mia
is only one of four assistants who have testified against
Diti so far. I mean, wow, four assistants have testified
against him. In fact, the next one or the one
(04:44):
that testified prior to Mia, her name was Capricorn Clark,
and she testified on May twenty seventh, and she said
that she witnessed a lot of violence and threats and
while working for him, and that he told her he
would throw her into the East River if she failed
a five day light detector test.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Can you imagine.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
Well, he locked her in a room with a bodyguard.
So here's the thing with this, and this is why
it's so important. It's kidnapping. That's kidnapping, and that is
a predicate for Rico in order to prove this racketeering,
which is you know, Rico, you have to have two
predicate acts and kidnapping is one of them. So that's
a check mark for the federal government. Okay, there's one.
(05:28):
So he's being charged with this, Rico. This is a
really big deal. So she also said that she was
forced to force to accompany Colmbs to confront rivaling musician
Kid Cutty. And we know that kid Cutty testified as well,
so she's cooperating things that Kid Cutty said, so that
she was a very important once you guys like and
(05:49):
super important, and.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Kid Cutty just too.
Speaker 5 (05:52):
Because there are a lot of players and there have
been a lot of people testifying over these weeks. Kid
Cutty comes into play because he was seeing Ditty's ex girlfriend,
Cassie Ventura for a while and Cassie Ventura was the
first woman who came to testify and kind of got
this whole ball rolling.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Absolutely she did, right, And here's the other this is
another reason why Capricorn is so important. She also testified
that she was forced to procure legal and prescription drugs
for homes. That's drug trafficking. Another predicate.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
That's two. That's all they need.
Speaker 4 (06:27):
That's all they need is too predicate acts to charge
in convict him of rico and then he's in big trouble.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
And then he's in big trouble looking at potentially a
life sentence. Right, And you know, Courtney, you brought up
Cassie Ventura, his ex that he was with for ten years.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
They didn't have any children together. She took the stand.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
If you missed any of it, it was harrowing and heartbreaking,
and she had to recount a lot of what they
call freak offs.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Right, we're all now getting a.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Lot getting a lot of information about what that really means.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
But what it means is there were.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
These choreographed sexual encounters with escorts, etc. That Cassie and
male escorts participated in, and then Diddy would sort of
sit off to the side and kind of direct a
little bit as if he was making a music video
of sorts, you know, being an executive producer and a mogul.
But the tricky thing here is that he was allegedly
(07:18):
recording these encounters. So if he's recording these encounters and
using that as some sort of reveverage exactly, and he
has bodyguards and assistant, it's a whole operation around.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
Him that makes, you know, silence the name of the game.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
We're talking about the p Diddy case, and we want
you to weigh in. Give us a call eight eight
eight to three one crime or hit us on the
talkbacks on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
So body.
Speaker 5 (07:45):
Another kind of big thing that hit the news was
that President Donald Trump is considering a pardon. He was
asked the question by a reporter and he kind of
equivocated and said maybe maybe that what do you what
do you guys think of that?
Speaker 3 (08:02):
So it's crazy.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
You know, we just learned of the chrislies who just
got a pardon, and we're going to be talking about
that later.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Little tease for you.
Speaker 4 (08:10):
But you know, now we have the possibility that President
Donald Trump may pardon Diddy if he is convicted. So
it was during a press conference and he was asked
and Trump emphasized that no formal pardon request has been
made by the defense team, like there's there's been no
official We want to make that very clear. There's been
no official ask from the Diddy camp, you know, team
(08:33):
to get a pardon. But he did acknowledge. President Trump
did acknowledge that discussions about a potential pardon are taking place.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Or that he was considering that they would happen sometime soon.
He wouldn't be surprised, right, So this is not a
huge surprise in my personal opinion.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Either.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
He's the president. He has the ability to do a
pardon should he choose to.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
But here's the thing.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Person after person after person has shared harrowing details about
violence and revenge, have had family members threatened. Cassie Ventura's
family was threatened. Her mom and dad were threatened. What
happens if he gets off That is so dangerous for
anybody who spoke out against him. Now that we're mentioning
the Donald Trump pardon thing, do you guys remember this was.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
Back in maybe twenty eighteen.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
There was a gentleman named Jonathan Odie and he apparently
just like rolled into one of the Trump hotels in
South Florida and he basically wrapped himself in an American
flag and was shooting at the at the ceiling and
was ultimately shot down by police.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
He was not killed, he was shot in the leg.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
But he goes on to tell this crazy story about
how he was a former sex slave of Diddy and
of his then extant friend Cassie Ventura, And it sounded nuts, right.
I remember real time when this happened, and it sounded
so outlandish, like a person who had slipped and hit
their head and is having a psychotic break.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Now cut two years later, not so far fetched.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
This guy was really telling the tale that we've now
heard other people say on the stand that he was
a male escort. He was being used regularly as an
air quote sex slave and it's.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Not that far fetched.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
I bring that up only because that's an interesting connection.
It has nothing to do with Trump, it is I
don't know that.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
I kind of wonder if that maybe is what bustled
the doors open to this investigation.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
You know, this this.
Speaker 4 (10:26):
Accusation that he made and then Cassie of course it's time.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Yeah, funny enough, So twenty eighteen, that's when Cassie Ventura
and Diddy broke up. So this encounter with Jonathan Odie,
we should dig into this a little bit more because
again it sounded insane. Now his hearing, if I remember correctly,
had been pushed a few times, and there's an online
chatter of maybe he was an informant now or he's
in productive custody. Who knows that is, you know, will
(10:54):
remain to be seen. But it's interesting as this landscape
opens that there are so many players. And also remember
Diddy's always at the center of you know, the nineteen nineties,
the you know, the hip hop battle and the East
Coast West Coast with Biggie and Tupac. You know, Diddy
was right at the center of that Bad Boy Records.
And this has been a long steeped legacy of violence.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
And by the way, I was.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Always a ditty fan, So I'm embarrassed to say that
now that I've seen this, or I've seen the footage
of him beating up a girl his love. It's of
Cassie Ventura getting beaten by him in an elevator. She's
trying to escape and you cannot unsee it. And granted
he's not being tried for being a bad boyfriend guilty
(11:40):
as charged, it really paints a picture that's so different
than his public appearance.
Speaker 5 (11:45):
Well, you know, you say you're embarrassed about being a
fan in the nineties, but everyone was. He was the nineties,
the white parties who didn't want to go to a
white party. Everybody wanted to live in that opulence where
it seemed like it was chandeliers and pain and sure
famous people.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
What a facade? Huh, what a facade?
Speaker 2 (12:04):
And I guess both things can be true, right, Isn't
that What we now know just by working in true
crime is Listen, somebody can be a really great person
on the outside and a real monster behind closed doors.
And I think we're all finding it so confusing but
also just really scary that this underworld exists.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
You're listening to True Crime tonight on iHeartRadio, where we
talk true crime all the time. We've been talking about
p Diddy. If you want to weigh in, we want
to hear from you. Call us eight at eighty three
one crime or hit us on the talkbacks on the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
We have a lot of updates on the Karen Reid retrial.
Oh my goodness, the prosecution has finally rested and this
week is guaranteed to be explosive. And right now we're
also going to jump into the Brian Cooberger college trial.
If you haven't been following that in Idaho new developments.
Apparently he claims there may have been another assailant. So
(13:09):
is that possible, Courtney, what do you think? I know
this is a place of real expertise for you.
Speaker 5 (13:14):
Well, Brian Coberger's defense absolutely stipulates that there is someone
else involved. So next week the prosecutors must respond to
Brian Coberger's request to name this different possible suspect, to
catch anyone up who's not super conversant, because this is
going to be a huge trial starting August eleventh. Brian
(13:35):
Coberger is a former PhD student in criminology and he's
accused of fatally stabbing four University of Idaho students. This
happened in November twenty two in Moscow, Idaho.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Also pretty major because this guy, the accused, Brian Coberger,
was studying criminology. He was getting his PhD in the
actual science that he was studying and is now accused of.
Speaker 5 (13:58):
That's right, So you know, does that make him potentially
the perfect mastermind of a murderer or is some of
is he being sort of framed in the public eye
because he has some quote, weird searches on his Internet
and he's looking up different serial killers.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
Well, you know, my friend Cheryl McColl him fame forensic
Emmy Award winning forensic analysis. She told me because I
said the same thing, like this criminology thing, this, this
has got to be something. And she said, body in
her little Southern accent that we all love Body, just
because you have a cookbook and you can read a
cookbook doesn't mean you know how to cook.
Speaker 6 (14:33):
oOoOO.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
That's a really good quote.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Because look, that's what's so confusing about this particular case,
and maybe that's why we're all so enthralled with it
is because first off, first and foremost for incredible young
people who have lost their lives. Their families are an agony.
They're grieving, and it was really incredibly senseless, but really
an overkill. You know, the walls in this house in
(14:56):
Idaho were literally bleeding. You could see the blood coming
down the walls. It was that violent. So here is
one regular PhD student. Some say he was shy or awkward,
like it's a lot of press and a lot of
conversations around him being odd.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
He just goes to class one.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Day, murders four people and then rolls back to class
after that. Seems impossible to me. I want that to
be impossible. And at the same time, it's not looking great.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
It's not looking great. That is very true.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
However, Anne Taylor, his defense attorney, she brought up this
was weeks ago. She said that absolutely buried. Going through
troves and troves of tips collected by police. She is
saying that they found an alternate suspect and a lead.
Now the duzz has kept this sealed. In other words,
they haven't said who the person or persons are, which
(15:51):
is great because what kind of man hunt, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Yeah, the tan hunts. What manhuntter do you speak of?
Is there a killer at large? Is that the insinuation
at this point that trials in August. He's been waiting
trial for a long time, by the way, a death
sentenced trial, so the stakes are very high. Is it
possible that there is a person at large as we
speak and that it's dangerous?
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Like where has this person been the whole time? Listen?
Speaker 5 (16:13):
Defense suggests there is. I mean, we'll find out more
of the details as it moves forward. But the defense
attorney also previously she said that she plans to argue
that Coburger was actually framed by someone, and that someone
planted his DNA at the crime scene. She also has
thrown out maybe two people committed the crime using two
(16:35):
different weapons.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Okay, you can't see me, but I'm totally eye rolling
right now. I'm like, I can see the biggest eye
roller ever at the moment, like, yeah, come on, come on,
but wait, getting old.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
He could also be a target. You know, remember this,
you know again, my heart is really we on behalf
of all of us, you know, for the victims and
for Madison Mogen and Xana Kernodle and Kaylee Gonzalvez and
Ethan Chapin, Like, let that not get left out of
this story. But Brian Coberger, the accused, listen, he claims
his innocence. He comes from a really loving family, people
(17:08):
really love him. He has no reason to just go
and thrill kill. But at the same time, this evidence
is not looking so ideal, specifically where you're just you know,
speaking about body, which is this touch of DNA left
behind on a knife sheath. You know, there's been so
much conversations about knives and sheaths.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Is that damning? I guess we'll have to wait and see.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
So a couple of weeks ago, there was a bombshell
dateline that was released. It was a two hour special
and it has gotten both a lot of press and
it also is impacting the trial.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Potentially potentially, and yeah, in.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
A big way because in this dateline, what they released
was information that was could only be known by law
enforcement or someone on the prosecution side.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
Right, Like these were selfies taken from his cell phone
in the moments after the murder. These are telephone calls,
These are things that only somebody on the inside would
have And you know, the defense is arguing that this
is like highly prejudicial and quite frankly, if any of
them are true, which I believe they are some of them,
(18:18):
then I kind of agree with the defense, and I
think it's possible that this could force a continuance.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
And by the way, the family has been waiting for
so long for this trial to begin.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
You know, Courtney and.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
I made the podcast with iHeart the Idaho Massacre, so
we did a really, you know, a pretty big deep dive,
and really this focus of it was, there's no way
this one person can go and kill four people and
then go to school. And while they test this in yeah,
we can't. This is alleged, right. It seemed far fetched,
and we really did go down the rabbit hole trying
(18:49):
to find alternate theories or making the assertion that maybe
he struck prior or maybe there was somebody else involved,
and it really came up as a goose egg. So
we're all playing along real time as these things unfold.
But why now suddenly this is a big ticket item,
literally a quote smoking gun, if there was another person involved,
(19:10):
why would we only be hearing about that just weeks
before the trial?
Speaker 5 (19:14):
Well, Ann Taylor and I don't know the details of
how she's going to present this but again it was
indicated that this suspect that she quote, you know, just
found was hidden, so it could be officers not meaning
poor intentions can get myopically focused on one thing.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
Tunnel vision.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
Tunnel vision, that's exactly right. But Judge Hippler, who honestly
seems like a really measure judge, and we're.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Very no nonsense, right, Yeah, I like him.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
I do too, I quite like him. He's very no nonsense,
very to the point yep. He kind of doesn't take
any crap from either the state or the defense. He's
just very kind of this is what's.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Happened to books. Yeah, right, I do like him.
Speaker 5 (19:53):
He's considering appointing a special prosecutor to investigate this dateline leak.
Speaker 4 (19:59):
I think they should, absolutely they should, Yeah, because what
was put out there, I mean it really is very incendiary.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
It has from Brian Coburger's cell phone. It has dozens
of screenshots of female students who went both to his college,
WSU and the University of Idaho, some of whom were
friends of three of the murdered students.
Speaker 4 (20:21):
And it has the Amazon click history, and the Amazon
click history shows according to the dateline Leaks again, this
is all alleged because it hasn't been you know, in
the trial yet. It is alleging that Brian Coberger searched
for a sheath on Amazon after the murders. Why would
you look for only a sheath after the murders because
you knew you've left yours behind. I mean, this is
(20:43):
so prejudicial. And we again, we don't know if it's
any of it's true. These are all alleged, and you know,
some of the things we know are true, like the
selfies and you know, things like that, but the searches
and click history, we really don't know if.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
It's true yet or not. We're assuming it is because
Dateline is a very reputable organization.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
Of And just in case you're not familiar with this
case as closely as we are, just for the play along,
there isn't really a great known connection between the four
victims who were students who all lived together in the
same house. There were two surviving roommates, thankfully, and there
doesn't seem to be an obvious dot to connect the why.
(21:20):
So in this case, if in fact these Dateline leaks
are accurate, some of these photographs that were found on
the accused Brian Coberger's phone were photographs of young women
in bathing suits who are friends, allegedly on social media
with several of the female victims.
Speaker 6 (21:37):
Right.
Speaker 3 (21:38):
Additionally, and this seems more damning.
Speaker 5 (21:40):
And to underline what you said, Boddy, we do not
know if it's true, but Dateline said that sell records
revealed that Brian Colberger, who apparently has no direct connection
with these women, was within one hundred meters of their
home twenty three times in just the short months leading
up to the murders.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Yeah, and that like particular house where it's located is
sort of on a culture sack, so you have to
really drive to go out of your house with intention. Yeah,
it was a house that was, you know, a party house.
They were in college, right they were. They were living
it up and there was friends in and out. It
was a very odd It was kind of an odd
house the lad I think it was.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
A house that was built and then they kept doing additions.
It's great, So like the kind of like John Bonnet's house, Right,
that's very true. Every How, every it just didn't it
didn't slow, that's right. You know, you could tell they
were auditions. So like the layout of the house is
very confusing, which is another kind of strange thing, like
how did Brian Coberger know where to go?
Speaker 3 (22:33):
But I dougress we'll talk about that. We have a
lot to talk about with Idaho. We're gonna talking about.
Speaker 4 (22:37):
The start a long time, right, There's so much to
talk about. But I think I think he's guilty, you guys,
I think he's guilty. And the dateline stuff nailed it
for me. So the prejudicial thing could be an argument
that Ann Taylor can make and win.
Speaker 5 (22:51):
Absolutely tainted jury. I mean, this information is spread out wide.
There's a book well we'll talk about this another time,
but there's a book from James Atterson coming out where
he claims that Brian Colberger was quote and apparent in
cell another just incendiary. We have no knowledge it's based
in fact, but things are being put out before the trial.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
Netbook is coming out how many days before the trial,
like eleven days.
Speaker 5 (23:16):
It's sixteen days before the trial. And that's also something
that the defense brought up.
Speaker 4 (23:21):
Well, we're going to be talking about key updates and
the Karen re retrial. Are you new to the case.
We're going to get you right at the speed. But
first we actually have our very first caller. We have
Indie calling right now, so let's let's go with it.
Speaker 7 (23:35):
Hi, Indeed, Hello, how you guys doing Hello?
Speaker 2 (23:37):
And how are you?
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Thanks for Colin problem.
Speaker 7 (23:40):
I just want to ask about the Diddy case in
kim Porter so we all know that, you know, kim
Porter tragically passed away, and being that, I'll be sure
who is Quincy's dad stated that he feels like he
was poisoned. Do you think that they will open or
(24:00):
reopen Kim's Porter's case or go into Albi Shore's alleged poisoning.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Such a great question, Such a great question. So all
of this is alleged, and I'll be Shore. Who you're
referring to is basically kim Porter's X, with whom she
has a child that now lives with Ditty, And kim
Porter was with Ditty for many, many years. They have
several children together. You've seen those children in court many times,
(24:29):
standing by their dad. But then she died, to your point,
very mysteriously, very healthy woman.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
Suddenly.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
I think the cause of death was pneumonia, and it
felt sort of unexpected tragic. Diddy often publicly spoke about
how much he missed her and loves her and may
she rest in peace. But now many people are saying
that maybe her death was suspicious and that maybe she
had new information again allegedly, allegedly allegedly that perha, perhaps
(25:00):
kim Porter had some details or was going to go
to the public or to the press, and in therefore
she was you know, poisoned or something. These again are
all rumored, but it's it's something that gets spoken about
online on a daily basis, and many are asking for
kim Porter's body and her death to be really reevaluated.
Speaker 3 (25:22):
Oh yeah, it is.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
Big online, but I will say so far as of today,
there has been no official action to reopen the case,
but who knows if, you know, chatter continues or more
details emerge, because thirteen years is a long time.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Thirteen years is a long time.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Yeah, And like some of the family members on Ditty
side and Kim's children, several of them have spoken out
and said this is untrue, There is no way true,
this isn't true. So these are really difficult things to
even have speculated about your parents, obviously, but again those
are the same kids that are forced to sit in
the courtroom and listen to the these hideous recounts of
(26:02):
stories involving their father. I mean, that's like the optics
of that alone. I'm like, why would you have your
eighteen year old twins in the courtroom when they're talking
about freak offs all day, all night. But again, you know,
it's optics. The courtroom is a circus, right, So you
want you want the image of a father who has
a family that loves him. It looks good for the jury,
(26:23):
it does. So that's a great question, and I think
the truth is we don't know, and.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
We're going to be following it all week, so we're
gonna we're gonna keep talking about this.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
So thank you very much for are Colin Dy, thank
you for your colleagues.
Speaker 5 (26:34):
So, as mentioned, we are now going to get into
the Karen Reid retrial, the saga. So it just wrapped
up at sixth week, excuse me, and the prosecution finally
rested their case and the defense began their own. So
we're going on to finally hear what's on the other
side of the coin. For anyone who maybe doesn't remember,
(26:55):
Karen Reid is accused of hitting her boyfriend, a Boston
police officer named John O'Keefe, with her suv and this
was after a night of drinking. The allegation is that
she backed up into him and left him for dead
in the snow and peeled away. What the defense is
claiming is that Karen indeed did stop her suv at
(27:15):
the bottom of the driveway where John o'keep's body was found,
and she left, but that he then went up the
driveway to the home of fellow police officers who he
was really friendly with, and potentially that something in there happened.
There was some kind of fight, or a lot has
been thrown out. Maybe he was bitten by a dog.
It's kind of I feel like a little bit everything.
(27:36):
Maybe a sex party, I cannot maybe, But the allegation,
the defense is saying, no, no, Karen Reid did not
back up and hit her boyfriend and leave him for dead. Instead,
he died with his fellow police officers, who then brought
John o'keef's body out to the bottom of the driveway
and framed Karen Reid and very specifically, she has pleaded
(28:00):
not guilty to the charges of its second degree murder.
It's manslaughter while operating under the influence of alcohol, as
well as leaving the scene of a personal injury death.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Also to set the stage too, that particular night in
Boston was terrible snow so it's a.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
Super snowy knive. It was like a blizzard. It was
a blizzard.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
Nobody should have been driving, let alone drug driving, which
is it's kind of a real tell that this was
a night gone wrong. You know, Karen is dating a
guy who was a veteran of the police force and
his buddy, so she was kind of the outsider of
their cop crew, you know, and their wives and their friends.
That was the group, right, so she was sort of
(28:40):
the tag along.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Here we are.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
But Karen Reads already survived one trial, so now this
is the second.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
And it's very confusing in my opinion. What is the
major allegation that the defense is making. Are they saying
that the police did like a terrible investigation. Are they
saying they're corrupt?
Speaker 2 (28:58):
Like?
Speaker 3 (28:58):
What are they saying?
Speaker 5 (28:59):
Well, well, I think objectively, the police did a terrible investigation.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
And that's a hard thing for me to say, as
excuse me.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Yes, I'm a very pro police officers exactly regard. It's
a very difficult job.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
But the investigation, and there is evidence of this, they
were physically taking from the scene of the crime of
the death of their fellow officer evidence in solo cups,
those red cups that you would see at a party.
They were putting evidence into shopping bags like you would
get it anything. So the investigation in saying that, oh,
(29:32):
it was hard because it was snowing and that's why
things went awry. Listen, this was in Massachusetts, and.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
This is like a major city, right, Like it's not
you know the sticks, right, this is like a major
metropolitan area.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Let's be real, red solo cups. Who goes to an
investigation where a person has been killed and this is
a police officer, Karen Reid, Yeah, a police officer, no
less has been killed and his girlfriend is now looking
at a life sentence.
Speaker 3 (29:57):
This is a big deal.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Either she goes away for life or she so who
would actually be gathering evidence with red solo cups or
putting blood swabs in a paper bag?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
That alone seems banannas to me.
Speaker 5 (30:12):
Well, and that's what absolutely puts the alarm bells off
in my head. And that's why the defense is alleging
and ps. There has at different times during this first
trial and second trial, there has been a lot of
support to free Karen Read, A lot of support on
our side because she is alleging that there is a
cover up within the police department, and that John O'Keefe,
(30:33):
this poor victim, you know, at the center of it all,
there is a man who lost his life. But that
again he went inside to the house, there was a
confrontation and you know that.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
Again the dog.
Speaker 5 (30:45):
I don't know, I get a little if when the
dog's thrown out there that he was attacked or it
was a person like that just seems.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
It's life and death.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
How do you not have it should be black and white. Fact,
This is a person who was out with a group.
They were all they were all driving, they were all
boozy mcboozy, and again somebody lost their life in courtney.
To your point, our hearts are also going out to
his mother and family who have to witness this in
the courtroom. But there was like the lead investigator was
(31:14):
sending tech texts internally basically I wish I could say
it online because it's foul language and my mom would
kill me. But essentially basically saying that Karen Reid is
a see you next Tuesday, and also that she has
a flat butt and that she should kill herself.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
So this is the lead investigator.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
So if it's possible that there was something nefarious that
maybe happened in that house, you know, she was waiting
in the car. He runs in to talk to her friends,
who hasn't been in this situation where you're like, really
with your knucklehead friends, it's late, I want to go home.
We've been out drinking all night. It's time to call
it a night. He goes in, apparently never comes back.
She dips and goes home, and.
Speaker 3 (31:55):
Then starts calling him time after time after time, yelling at.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
Him, screaming at him, you're pervert, screaming all time with
other women exactly. So that's where the whole like little
sex party thing comes from.
Speaker 3 (32:07):
Rumored, rumored, rumored.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
Allegedly, allegedly, allegedly. So there just seems like there's more
to this story other than, Hey, a woman just backed
over her boyfriend and now she should go to prison
for the rest of her life.
Speaker 5 (32:18):
Though I will say the prosecution has put up a
pretty convincing case so far. I mean, with the backing up,
there has been John Keith's DNA tied to the tail
light that was busted.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
There are details about.
Speaker 5 (32:33):
When John O'Keefe's phone stopped moving, which is the same
time that Karen Reid, the accused, was allegedly backing up,
and that can't.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
Be underlined anymore.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
I mean that is think has changed. Though there's no
information on this. I have stopping here. I think that's
actually inaccurate. That's right, So what is the accurate information?
So that's what the prosecution alleges.
Speaker 5 (32:55):
Okay, the defense again, they're day one, prosecution's day six,
so we should be convinced we have heard one side
of the story, right, But in the defense is opening
their expert stipulates that no, no, there was a timing.
There was like a lag between John O'Keefe's cell phone
time and the time in the suv, and that he
(33:16):
actually could have been moving after it, which would mean
he was not hit by the car. So that's day
one though, and there's a lot. I'm gonna have to
wait to listen to.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
That, don't we think? Though?
Speaker 2 (33:26):
Karen Reid is so divisive because again, according to the
CNN polls, everybody thinks she's guilty. I must be the
only wonderful I don't know if she's guilty or innocent.
I'm just saying they have to prove it, and we
shouldn't be proving it in the media, right. But she
has sort of an affect about her. I actually don't
notice this as much because I'm back from the East
as well. It doesn't seem as though she's such a
(33:47):
tough guy. But people online just think her personality stinks.
They think she's cold and icy and she's smilingly behaving
inappropriately in the courtroom, and I personally don't really see that.
I just think she's putting on a tough exterior and
maybe she's in trouble because she's unlikable.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Well, maybe we'll have to see. Well, we want to
hear what you have to say about all snein stories.
Give us a call at one eight thirty one Crime
to talk about Diddy, Prian Coberger or Karen Reid.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
We just kind of wanted to introduce ourselves and each other.
As I've mentioned now, I'm Stephanie Leidecker and I head
up a production company that makes true crime documentaries and podcasts.
And Courtney and I go way back. We've been working
together for well over ten years or so by now.
We used to work in you know, reality shows. We
(34:43):
call it unscripted now it sounds so fancy, and we
sort of parlayed from that into true crime together.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
What was your what's your big takeaway? Oh man, my
big takeaway?
Speaker 5 (34:54):
Well, first of all, my big takeaway is what a
great pleasure it has been working with for the past
ten years. Yeah, and honestly, Stephanie is just as a
human to brag on you for a hot second. She
helms an amazing ship at Katie's Studios. She produced multiple
documentaries and justice with Nancy Grace Murdered and Missing in
(35:15):
Montana one of my favorites. Yeah, worth, I mean highly worth,
the watch and the Queen Nancy Grace.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
Come on now, come on, I can't get any more
true crime royalty.
Speaker 5 (35:25):
Yes, and Stephanie, you know it's been It's been quite
a ride. And then also tons of podcasts that we've
done for iHeart, including the piked In Massacre and the
Idaho Massacreeah.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
Courtney's the voice of all of these. So if you
recognize that sultry voice, it is Courtney Armstrong herself, the
voice of the piked In Massacre and the Idaho Massacre
and many more so yeah, the show goes on.
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Kid, Stephanie's so too much.
Speaker 5 (35:51):
But all of this crime brought us Stephanie and I
to Crime Colm on a panel, and it is at
that point where are stars aligned with Body move In,
who we met in the green room because she was
also at crime Con right on a panel.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
You guys know what crime con is.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
It's like that huge event where enthusiasts for crime shows
and things come to listen to detectives and you know,
Dan Abrams and Nancy Grace and Body move In, who
was making a big appearance there.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Right, That was a that was a fun day. I
was giving a talk about how animal abuse leads to
bigger crimes, and I was also of course talking about
don't f with cats, and you guys ran up to
me and like it felt very natural, and you know,
here we are, like two years later, we've worked on
a couple things together and now we're doing this and
I couldn't be happier to be here.
Speaker 5 (36:47):
Yeah, I was gonna say it was kind of a scene.
Stephanie and I were a little fan girling. Definitely not
the smoothest moment, but instant.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
I never made an ego boost.
Speaker 4 (36:57):
I'll go to crime con because everybody comes up to
the everybody fangirls and it makes me.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
Feel really Yeah, we were alone, we were like, there
she is.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
It's body moving because if you haven't seen her work
on the documentary don f with Kats, which you can
see on Netflix, it's astounding and it really personally changed
my DNA.
Speaker 3 (37:13):
I watched it.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
I've said this many times during COVID and I really
think it's shaped a lot of the things and decisions
we made as a company thereafter. So in my opinion,
you hold the keys to greatness. So when Courtney and
I were in the same green room with you, you know,
we're eating the donuts and having their free coffee, and
they were like, there's body and we literally tackled her
(37:35):
and it was love at first sight and it's been
it's been a real joy ride ever since. So yeah, yeah,
the best thing. I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 3 (37:42):
I'm so excited. I just love talking true crime.
Speaker 4 (37:45):
I love talking with girls, and I feel like we're
sitting around the kitchen table with a cup of coffee
and that's what you know, and that's what I think
the vibe of the show is right exactly.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Chatting with your girlfriends, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
And that's why you guys, you know, have to call us,
you know, call us at eight eight eight three to
one crime.
Speaker 8 (38:02):
Can you hear me?
Speaker 3 (38:03):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Welcome, Welcome, Heather, you have me, Stephanie, you, Courtney and Body.
Speaker 8 (38:09):
Hi ladies.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
Hello.
Speaker 8 (38:11):
I was calling to ask there's a lot of discussion
online on whether Karen is guilty or innocent, but I
was more curious about your opinions on whether or not
the prosecution has actually proven the keyse because they have
skipped over a lot of key witnesses in the in
the case this time, Albert, Yes.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Great question. Who wants that question?
Speaker 4 (38:38):
You know, it's such a hard one to answer in Heather,
You're right, this is like a super divisive case online,
and I feel like, no matter which what you say
about it, you're going to get lambassad from the other side.
These these sides hate each other, Okay, the free Karen
repeople hate the guilty Karen repeople.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
So I feel like either way we answered this, we're
going to get in trouble.
Speaker 4 (38:59):
However, I think it's too early to say whether the
prosecution has proved their case. I think by now we
should have an answer to that. But because this case
is so god, it's so divisive, it's hard to say
I would say they have not. Here's my thing. I
think Karen Reid is guilty, but I think guilt and
(39:22):
provable guilt are two different things, right, Like, it's just
not the same thing. And I don't because the defense
basically is going to show and we're going to hear
all about it coming up. How terrible this investigation was
and how terrible police you know, crime scene I was
processed from start to finish was just terrible. I think
(39:45):
that there's going to be at least one juror that's
going to have reasonable doubt on whether or not she's
guilty or not. And I just don't think the state
proved it.
Speaker 3 (39:54):
I agree, Heather. What do you think? Heather? Where are
you calling us from? We're so excited to know.
Speaker 8 (40:01):
Oh I'm calling from Florida.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
Nice. So what do you think, Heather? What's your what's your.
Speaker 8 (40:08):
I I don't know where I stand on whether some
days I think she's guilty, some days I think she's innocent.
But either way, I don't think that there's any way
that any jury could find her guilty because of the
investigation personally, I think they grossly mishandled it from don't
you think Heether that.
Speaker 4 (40:29):
Don't you think Heather that it's a gross injustice to
John O'Keeffe, like their fellow police officer, that this was handled.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
Absolutely, I hopefull. We need to keep that up.
Speaker 4 (40:39):
Front, like there's a victim here and you know, and
often he gets lost in the sauce.
Speaker 7 (40:45):
He does.
Speaker 8 (40:46):
And I feel like, as a brother in blue, you
would have expected them to cross all their tees and
dot every eye and for them to just be no,
like so nonchalant about it is absolutely wild to me.
And he deserved better, They owed him better, And yes,
I just the whole thing is super sad because whether
(41:09):
she's found guilty or innocent, there's never going to be
justice for him in my opinions, because of the way
that the police conducted themselves in the investigation, and they
can't go back and get a redo.
Speaker 4 (41:20):
Well, Hart, thank you so much for calling. Welcome to
the True Crime Tonight. Family, Thank you so much for calling.
We again, if you want to give us a call,
call us at one eight eight eight thirty one Crime.
But we're going to jump right into another case and
we're going to be talking about a kidnapping in New
York City, and I'm telling the story. And this is
I swear I'm going to get all the crazy stories. Okay,
(41:41):
So if you want to know what's happening in the
crazy town, just follow a body moving. Okay, this is
this is pretty crazy. There's a guy in New York
that basically is running down the street in like pajamas
and a polo shirt and he's barefoot, he's bloody. This
is all captured on video. And he runs up to
(42:02):
a New York City police officer. This isn't like beautiful, soho.
You know, Manhattan in New York City very posh, very
beautiful in the city.
Speaker 3 (42:12):
Yeah, very say, it's literally sucks in the city. Okay.
Speaker 4 (42:15):
And he's running down the street and he runs up
to a police officer and you know, he's bruised and bloodied.
And this is the surveillance video that's been released, and
what we find out behind it, behind the scenes, is
that he's been kidnapped by the King of Crypto in Kentucky.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
Quite a mouthful.
Speaker 5 (42:36):
It's quite him name himself or is that like a
pals call him that?
Speaker 3 (42:41):
Right?
Speaker 4 (42:42):
No, that's like his self proclaimed name. Well hit the
victim's name he well, the victim is from Italy, Okay,
name is Michael Cadaran, and he's also a crypto king
basically of Italy. He's got millions of dollars in cryptocurrency.
And they the people that napped him or trying to
get basically his seed, his password, his his bitcoin password
(43:06):
to steal from him. And here's what they did, you guys.
I mean, it's absolutely insane. They took his passport and
all of his electronics devices. They beat him with the pistol,
held a gun to his head, used a chainsaw on
his leg. They urinated on him, they peed on him,
you guys. They tied him up, They dangle him off
(43:27):
the building. It's very shug Night, right, it's very you know,
dangling from the building, like we learned he did to
like Vanilla Ice, right, Like, it's very super villain what
they did to this man. And eventually he was like, okay,
I'm going to give you my passwords, but it's on
my computer at my hotel room. So they're like going
to basically get his computer, and that's when he is
(43:48):
able to escape. But he was held for three weeks.
You guys, three weeks he was held.
Speaker 2 (43:53):
He was held hostage, and exactly, it's right out of
the scariest movie. And by the way, these were like young,
successful men with big lives ahead. So how is it
possible that this is your version of something going correctly?
You know, they knew this guy, so they lured this
man from Italy under the pretense that they were going to,
(44:14):
you know, get some negotiations going. They had some sort
of a partnership that was longstanding. Can you imagine you
come to New York City and you go meet your
buds and suddenly you're now being locked up and frankly
nature for all intensive purposes. They were being waterboarded. It's nuts.
Speaker 5 (44:34):
And it seems like this was not their first negative interaction.
This one escalated really high, but this was not the
first time they had been in bad contact. So there's
also in addition to the two men who have been
arrested for this kidnapping, there is also a third. It's
(44:55):
a young woman. She's twenty four years old, and I
believe she was an assist, didn't right, Beatrice, Beatrice, That's right.
Speaker 4 (45:03):
Beatrice Fulci. She was the owner of the Soho apartment
John Waltz. She was his assistant to him. But here's
the thing. She's been released with prosecution deferred, which is interesting. Well,
I kind of wonder if it means that she's like
basically going to be cooperating and getting some kind of
immunity deal where she'll be able to testify against the
(45:27):
two that are accused. Now, the two that are accused,
one is William Duplessi. Now he here's this kind of
like grinds on my gears. You guys, he was able
to negotiate a surrenderer, okay, and he after he negotiated
the surrender, he went and partied in the Hamptons for
a couple of days and then just kind of waltzed
(45:47):
in and turned himself in, Like how do you get
to do that for torturing somebody?
Speaker 6 (45:51):
For it's so.
Speaker 5 (45:52):
Gross just to party in the Hamptons and to make
that arrangement and coming like it's disgusting.
Speaker 4 (45:59):
It's not that, but you just tortured a guy for
three weeks and now you're just like, oh, gonna go party,
Like how depraved you have to be? And listen, these
guys are already mega rich, right, how much more money
do they need that they're going to torture this guy
for there has to be more to this story. There
has to be more to this. In my humble opinion,
(46:19):
it seems impossible that it's just over money when they're
obviously so wealthy to begin with.
Speaker 3 (46:24):
Well, Crypto King of Kentucky is allegedly worth almost one
hundred million dollars? Is how much more does he need?
How give me a break?
Speaker 5 (46:33):
But this is so deviant. It goes to some different psychology.
It's like, I mean, it's like some American psycho stuff,
a little.
Speaker 3 (46:41):
Bit, a little bit well, you know.
Speaker 4 (46:42):
Sources with knowledge of the situation told reporters that two
of the two men that have been accused have been
violent with the victim in the past, but not to
this level.
Speaker 3 (46:53):
Not to this level. There was a chainsaw involved. They
took a chainsaw to his leg. Oh isn't it yeah? Crazy?
It's like, yes, but.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
They didn't like chop off his leg or anything. I mean,
you can see him walking down the street. His leg
is perfectly intact. I want to make that clear. But
there there's definitely some kind of deviant behavior. They peed
on him, you guys, they peed on this guy. They
electrocuted him.
Speaker 5 (47:15):
There has also there has been a spate of crypto
kidnappings going on in Paris, for example, there has been
multiple kidnappings out on the street and broad daylight to
get money from people who hold crypto and body, am
I correct that right where you are in Vegas?
Speaker 3 (47:34):
Yeah? What happened just happened.
Speaker 4 (47:36):
So there was a big convention here in Vegas and
one of the guys was giving like a keynote speech
on it and he's finished, and he's going home. And
as he's going home, these three kids, literal kids, they're
sixteen years old from Florida. They drove to Vegas to
kidnap this guy. They successfully kidnapped him and drove him
to the Arizona desert and they successfully stole four million
(47:59):
dollars from.
Speaker 3 (48:00):
What Yeah, did they get away with it?
Speaker 4 (48:03):
They well know they were caught because you know, he
was able to he survived. He walked five miles through
the desert to get to a phone to call for help.
Speaker 3 (48:13):
This poor guy.
Speaker 4 (48:16):
Yeah, so this is going to be like, I think,
a new wave of of robbery because you know, crypto
is you know, I guess it's kind of you know, untraceable,
because you're sending him to anonymous blockchain wallet addresses, which
you really can't really trace because there's no name attached
to it. So this is going to be the wave
of the future, and I think we're going to be
hearing about this a lot more.
Speaker 5 (48:36):
You're listening to True Crime tonight on iHeartRadio, where we
talk true crime all the time. I'm Courtney Armstrong here
with Stephanie Leidecker and body move in. If you want
to weigh in, we want to hear from you. Call
us eighty eight three one Crime or hit us on
the talkbacks on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
Have you guys heard of the Gone Girl? The real
life Gone Girl, Sherry Peppini. She's the girl who said
that she was kidnapped and abducted by an ex who
branded her and her husband and children were not only
looking for her, the whole country, the whole world was
looking for her. And it turns out that she was
(49:23):
being dishonest and is recently been released from prison and
is speaking out for the first time.
Speaker 5 (49:30):
Yeah, I mean you call her gone girl, I call
her liar, liar, pants on fire And she for a
while was America's what was it?
Speaker 3 (49:38):
Super Mom? Oh gosh, she's another woman of many names.
Speaker 5 (49:42):
But last week Shary Pepinie is back big in the
news because Investigation Discovery they just put out Cherry Peppini
Caught in a Lie. Caught in the Lie. It's a
four part documentary series and it features Sherry Peppini and
it seemed it's like she is changing her story yet again.
(50:03):
This will be the third iteration. So Steph, like you said,
it was back in twenty sixteen when she went for
a run in where she lives in Redding, California, and
then simply vanished.
Speaker 3 (50:17):
Her husband.
Speaker 5 (50:18):
At the time he came home, her car was in
the driveway where it shouldn't have been, and their two
young children were in daycare. Her husband immediately calls the police,
and this search goes on twenty two really long days.
And do you guys remember how big.
Speaker 3 (50:36):
Yeah, I was concerned looking for Sherry.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
All eyes were out and I think she came back
on Thanksgiving or something.
Speaker 3 (50:43):
Right it was, it was right around there. There was
a hero return, a hero return. Absolutely, she came home.
It was Thanksgiving day.
Speaker 5 (50:51):
She's weighing eighty seven pounds and she had lost all
of this weight in that twenty two days, her hair
has been cut off off, the branding, like you said,
and the beating and the bruises, and so at the time, oh,
thank god, America's mom supermom is back, and.
Speaker 4 (51:11):
Everybody's fawning over her, right like they're taking care of her,
like look at the bruises, like, oh my god, it's
like a you know, she's getting all this sympathy in her,
you know, like a husband's.
Speaker 3 (51:21):
Like excited that she's home. Like just that's right. And
so we're just trying to set the story right, like
remember this time, and you know, she was just getting
all this attention that everybody was fawning all over her,
that's right.
Speaker 5 (51:34):
And not only was she getting attention, she got three
hundred thousand dollars or actually more than because for this
six years while Sherry Peppini the hoax was not proven otherwise,
so it was just horay, she's home, supermom.
Speaker 3 (51:51):
Thank god.
Speaker 5 (51:53):
She collected all this money from victim compensations funds, donations
from public people were donating to her out of their
own pocket, as well as disability payments. But guess what
that cut up to her because when the investigators started
unfolding and saying something is not right. One of her
(52:13):
main charges was mail fraud, and that was because that
had to do with while she was lying, she used
the mail to obtain these funds from, for example, the
California Victim Compensation Board.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
So taking from real victims. Yeah, three hundred thousand dollars.
That disgusted money, that's right. Wow.
Speaker 5 (52:35):
And then so she ended up she was sent to
she pled guilty, so there was no trial. She went
to federal prison for eighteen months. And then now again
she's kind of she's back on the scene. And what
she had said was it was two Hispanic women in
masks who kidnapped her and did all of the beating. Ultimately,
(52:58):
it was revealed that no, she was hiding out at
her boyfriend's house. Remember she's married, so it's a little
inconvenient to have a husband.
Speaker 3 (53:07):
And a boyfriend.
Speaker 5 (53:09):
Things got dicey with the husband, and so she went
to chill out with this boyfriend and that was the story,
and that he had no he was aware she was
sort of harming herself, but that she was the one
who precipitated this whole event.
Speaker 4 (53:23):
He didn't notice that she was like cutting her hair
off and got down to eighty seven pounds and was
branding herself like.
Speaker 3 (53:29):
What the heck?
Speaker 2 (53:30):
Well, according to her, he was branding her. So yes,
a little bit of more backstory. Sherry Peppini had a husband, Keith,
and Keith did this documentary. It's very good and it's
basically his side of the story, which was everything you
could imagine, where's my wife? My kids miss their mom.
This is devastating, and she comes from a really loving family,
(53:52):
so everybody was looking for her, myself included. So now
that she's out of prison, you know, look and she
tells a different tale. Her take on it is that
she married Keith. They were very young. It was her
first kiss in seventh grade. They go way back. He
kind of held the purse strings in their relationship. She
(54:13):
had a job, lost that job, had kids, became a
stay at home mom, and little by Little tells a
story of how she was just unhappy and felt as
though she didn't really have any outside sources and she
couldn't make her own money, and that her husband was
a bit controlling, and she started kind of texting with
(54:34):
this ex boyfriend of hers.
Speaker 3 (54:36):
By the way, they seemed very immature.
Speaker 2 (54:38):
She even said that too it seemed like they married
young and were a little you know, immature generally speaking.
And she started texting with an ex and I guess
like there was a funeral and she was reaching out
because of the funeral, and so it escalates, and she
also realized that she couldn't exactly leave her husband for
(54:59):
this ex boyfriend because she had no money. He actually
made her sign a post up, and in that post up,
a post up is sort of like a prenup, but
after marriage.
Speaker 3 (55:12):
He made her sign.
Speaker 2 (55:13):
That because if she was unfaithful or looked at another guy,
she would be left with nothing. And that was a
way for in her opinion, allegedly, that was a way
for her husband to control, control the narrative and control her.
And in a very desperate, bad scenario right now, add
(55:33):
two kids and you know whatever, she has this big
kakamimi idea that she's going to go visit her her
lovely ex. And and so the branding begins.
Speaker 3 (55:45):
Wow. But speaking of documentary, have you guys seen it yet?
Speaker 6 (55:48):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (55:48):
Yeah, oh you want so you did?
Speaker 7 (55:50):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (55:51):
So, my friend Michelle saw it and she said she
wanted to punch her through the TV.
Speaker 3 (55:55):
How did you feel? Oh, my God, I felt a
little bit more compassion for her. You I did.
Speaker 2 (56:01):
Listen, I'm a bit of a sucker too. I am
three of us, let's be honest, I'm the gullible one.
I was very confused by her. And again those branding
and the bruises, it was all very intense. She kind
of just feels like somebody who got very in over
their head and definitely made a really bad judgment call.
(56:22):
And I mean, this is as I'm saying this, I
want to throw up in my own mouth.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
So thanks, regardless, can I take that record?
Speaker 3 (56:31):
Agree with you?
Speaker 4 (56:31):
But she took three hundred thousand dollars from victims basically,
and from me also.
Speaker 2 (56:36):
The bigger I was going to say, the investigation, all
those police resources that could have been used to actually
solve crimes that were really happening at that time, How
very very dangerous and how very targeted to say it
was two Hispanic women.
Speaker 3 (56:51):
That's like, you know, a real problem, very very serious.
Speaker 4 (56:55):
And the other real problem too, is now other victims
who actually might have issues are going to be not
It's kind of like the boy who cried Wolf's like,
is she is she really missing or is she just shock?
Speaker 6 (57:06):
It?
Speaker 3 (57:06):
Up with her boyfriend, Like, the disservice you're doing to
future victims is unforgivable in my book, absolutely unforgivable. And
by the way that.
Speaker 5 (57:15):
They to involve literally the nation to get in on
what's doing in your marriage, which is I mean, that's
how it started and that's what it escalated to. It's
really hard to be sympathetic to her. So I have
not seen the documentary yet. I will be in the
coming days, but it's I don't know. Maybe I'll be Swede,
(57:39):
and like I said, maybe they'll be compassion but they're still.
Speaker 3 (57:42):
Going into it very prejudiced.
Speaker 2 (57:44):
I'm not really actually just say I'm not pro Peppini
in either scenario.
Speaker 3 (57:48):
I have no real skin in the game.
Speaker 2 (57:50):
I just felt like they both have these opposing documentaries
which tell very different tales, and look, at the end
of the day, who cares. She has been forced to
pay restitution. I think the police said that she she
roughly spent about one hundred and fifty thousand dollars in
law enforcement. You know, just that's a pretty big deployment
of funding. So of course she has to pay that back,
(58:13):
and you know, she has trouble seeing her kids and
and allegedly she has a new boyfriend that's very wealthy,
and know, it just seems like a mess.
Speaker 4 (58:22):
So what is she saying She's saying that in this documentary.
Is she saying that, you know, she was a victim
really and that he was responsible for this?
Speaker 2 (58:30):
Yeah, there's a little bit of you know, she seems
a little like unhinged, no question, But again, is that
a crime to be?
Speaker 3 (58:36):
On hand? She's hinge. She seems like a.
Speaker 2 (58:38):
Little bit out there and a little less you know,
a little less apologetic than perhaps we would want her
to be. You know, her parents were also on the documentary.
Her former sister in law also appears on the documentary.
And look, she just seems like this very young girl
who's now an adult woman who did serve her time.
And again it sounds like I'm justifying Sherry Pippini's behavior.
Speaker 3 (59:01):
I am not. I'm just saying and seeing it.
Speaker 2 (59:04):
I felt a little compassion for her, just as a
woman who really felt like she was a bit trapped
financially and you know, wanted to have a little excitement
in her life.
Speaker 3 (59:14):
And man that ever backfire.
Speaker 4 (59:16):
I mean I would feel the same way if she
didn't blame two Hispanic women and they can torture herself.
Speaker 2 (59:22):
Oh what she said about that was that she because
she felt like she was afraid. Because now her story is,
as I say this, I'm changing my vote. Okay, because
now her story is the boyfriend that she was, you know,
hanging with for that you know, little stint that she's
saying that he was actually abusive and he did the
branding and it was against her will, and she was
(59:43):
too afraid to tell anybody when she came back, and
that her way of telling people was that in the
sketch of the Hispanic woman, apparently that sketch looks just
like the ex boyfriend's mother, and that was a way
for her to signal to a thought.
Speaker 3 (01:00:00):
Wink wink.
Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
You know, I know I'm saying to Hispanic women, but
here's a picture of my ex boyfriend who branded me
against my own wills.
Speaker 3 (01:00:10):
Mother.
Speaker 4 (01:00:11):
Okay, Well, I'm rolling my eyes again. I am rolling
my again. We'll stick around because we've got a lot
more to dig into. A lot more. We're gonna be
talking about Todd and Julie Chrisly's pardon from prison, and
later we're going to be hearing from you stick around
true crime tonight will we talk true crime all the time.
Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
So, guys, the Chrislies have been pardoned. You know America's
reality TV star gems. If you haven't seen their show before,
it's called Chrisly Knows Best. It was on for many
many years. And then the parents, Todd Krisly, Julie Chrisly,
they were they were basically imprisoned for tax evasion and
(01:00:58):
now we're pardoned by is it in Trump't.
Speaker 4 (01:01:02):
Think it's making all the news and like, listen, if
you work like two jobs like me, I didn't. I
didn't even know about this. I had to learn all
about this. So if you're anything like me and you're
just too busy, I'm going to bring up to speed
because it's everywhere right now, it's all over social media.
Savannah his daughter, I should say their daughter, because right
now it feels like Todd's getting all the attention, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (01:01:23):
Poor Julie.
Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
By the way, Julie deserves a high five because Todd
does steal her spotlight.
Speaker 3 (01:01:32):
I mean at the press.
Speaker 4 (01:01:33):
So there was a press conference and it was it
was Todd and Savannah his daughter, their daughter. See I'm
doing it an it's their daughter, Well, Savannah, it kind
of led this effort, this campaign to pardon her parents.
And she got a phone call last week from President
Donald Trump and said, you know, your parents seem like
(01:01:55):
really nice people. I feel like they've been railroaded. I'm paraphrasing, please,
you know, I feel like they've been railroaded. They're going
to be home tomorrow. And sure enough, guess what, she
went and picked them up. The next day, they're home
and guess what else, guess who was with her. We're
learning this is breaking news a camera crew.
Speaker 3 (01:02:15):
I'm so unsurprising, and I know it's very unsurprising.
Speaker 4 (01:02:19):
So Lifetime green lit a project to kind of document
the struggles that you know, the family's facing. You know,
the parents are in prison, the kids are taking care
of the other kids. It's, you know, a sad situation,
very surface level. Well, right after this got green lit,
they got pardoned. So now the project is apparently changing. Right,
(01:02:40):
It's not going to be these poor kids, you know,
talking to their parents on you know, monitors and you know,
through email tablets and in jail. They're going to be
talking face to face in person. This is completely changes
the project. And I mean, I feel like Lifetime really
scored here right, like watching, Oh, I'll be watching for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:03:00):
It's pretty interesting because Todd Crisly, who's the patriarch of
the family and on the show, if you've never seen it,
he is sort of this bossy, flamboyant, ritzy, fancy guy
and he runs the roost. That's kind of the stick.
And Julie is his devoted wife. And look, Julie went
down with him. The two of them definitely served some time.
But Todd the dad was very outspoken about the prison
(01:03:22):
conditions and the prison that he was being held in
is actually being kind of put to rest, like they're
slowly getting rid of inmates, and that might be a
part of this equation that's alleged. We don't know that
for sure. But interestingly enough, do you guys remember when
Kim Kardashian when she got an inmate released from prison
(01:03:46):
several years ago. Her name was Alice Marie Johnson.
Speaker 3 (01:03:49):
Do you guys remember this?
Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
She was doing time for cocaine distribution for life without parole.
Speaker 3 (01:03:54):
Now she's free.
Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
She's working within the Trump administration as like a tzar,
the pardon czar. I'm not totally sure what their leans
but it's like a real thing.
Speaker 3 (01:04:07):
Kim Kardashian is no, no Alice. You just got to
keep up. You got to keep up. So it's really Alice.
Speaker 2 (01:04:17):
Marie Johnson is the woman who was behind bars, and
due to Kim Kardashian's you know, impact, as she has
been released and now she's in charge of getting the
Chris Lyes out, so she's sort of air quotes paying
it forward. And if you saw the you know, the
press conference that Todd did you know he is speaking
(01:04:37):
about prison reform and that it's inequitable, which of course
it is, and that's sort of his now new mission.
But we'll kind of we'll see. What's kind of terrible though,
is poor Julie the wife. I shouldn't say poor Julie
because she was convicted of a very serious crime, So
I say that a little bit. I don't mean to
be glib, but she came out from prison now years
(01:04:59):
later her and she typically has very bright blonde hair
and is in full makeup, and now she has gray
hair and no makeup and is a different woman. Time
has passed, well, she's only been impressed for like three years,
but still she's not like.
Speaker 3 (01:05:14):
And your roots. I get you, Yeah, maybe she has
gray hair, yet I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:05:19):
I'm very like, yeah, quitting, I don't know, I know,
and I'm a natural blonde to right. So they say, well,
so Julie gets out, she's great, and all everyone talks
about is how Todd is so ripped and he's so
and how terrible poor Julie looks.
Speaker 4 (01:05:34):
And they even mentioned at the press conference about how
it beamed.
Speaker 5 (01:05:38):
So mom, she's like, he looks so much better coming
out than he looked going in.
Speaker 3 (01:05:42):
It did him a favor.
Speaker 5 (01:05:44):
So I wanted really quickly to talk about presidential pardons
because this got me a google. I really said, you
know what, I have no idea how it actually works.
So not a history lesson, real quick a pardon. It's
a form of legal forgiveness and it's granted only by
the president. It specifically wipes away a federal conviction and
(01:06:05):
any related punishment.
Speaker 3 (01:06:07):
It doesn't apply to state charges. So that's and that's
why this is a big deal for Diddy too.
Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
So, just to circle back to an earlier conversation, that
would give the president the power to potentially release Diddy
should he choose to.
Speaker 3 (01:06:19):
And again, this is not a Trump thing.
Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
You know, every president roster of pardon, so you know,
we're keeping out of any of that judgment. But you know,
look what he said, you know at his press conference
and by him, I mean Todd Qrisley with his daughter Savannah,
is that you know, he received terrible treatment behind behind
prison bars, but that he had better treatment than some
(01:06:44):
of his fellow inmates, and that there's a race disparity
in that. That's something that he's going to now be
a priority and that's going to be his platform.
Speaker 3 (01:06:54):
So he's going to pay it forward.
Speaker 4 (01:06:56):
I tell you, I was very judgmental when I was
going into watching this press I was like, a rich
guy gets pardoned.
Speaker 3 (01:07:02):
Okay, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (01:07:03):
But then when I actually listened to it, I was
actually pretty impressed with what he had to say.
Speaker 3 (01:07:08):
You know, but here's a thing.
Speaker 4 (01:07:10):
I'm still going to be judgmental, because you can say
one thing and not do it.
Speaker 3 (01:07:14):
But he said he's going.
Speaker 4 (01:07:15):
To use his voice, you know, and champion these issues
in the pedal system, and if he sticks to that,
I'm a fan.
Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
And by the way, the statistics are pretty harrowing, and
he may note of this in the press conference as well,
and we did another googling of that as well. The
Bureau of Justice Statistics says that twelve point four percent
of the population is African American, yet thirty two percent
of individuals in the state or federal system are also
(01:07:44):
African Americans.
Speaker 3 (01:07:45):
So that seems, you know, unfair. And he made a
very clean example.
Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
Is like he was able to get some sort of
privileges that some of his fellow inmates were not, and
he felt that that was racially charged. So look, if
he could shed a highlight on something positive and make
this mess something positive, great. If not, somehow, I'm still
going to be watching the Lifetime show.
Speaker 4 (01:08:07):
Don't judge me, judge, where's my gavel? I need a gavel,
sound judge to the judge. But you know, again, a
real fall from grace, you know. So now their family
is back together, hopefully for happier times.
Speaker 2 (01:08:24):
Well, you guys look so convinced. I just saw dummy
eye rolls. Nobody cares about Julie Chrisly's hair journey.
Speaker 3 (01:08:29):
I mean, I really don't, don't.
Speaker 5 (01:08:33):
They're thirty million dollars that they care they had.
Speaker 3 (01:08:37):
It's it's hard for my heart to bleed.
Speaker 5 (01:08:39):
Sympathy same, you know, when you've been doing that when
people don't have a dollar to their name.
Speaker 4 (01:08:44):
Right, And I mean would if if they didn't have money,
right and they weren't so high profile, would they be
getting a pardon. That's also like something that I think about,
you know, like why them and not the you know
his sell me?
Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
Well, his take on that is that he was on
fairly targeted or everybody says that.
Speaker 4 (01:09:02):
Nobody's going like, yeah, I did it, I'm guilty. I
deserve to be here. Hardly anybody does that. They're all,
you know, innocent and head they've all been railroaded.
Speaker 3 (01:09:11):
Why them? Why?
Speaker 2 (01:09:14):
Well, he believes that law enforcement specifically targeted them because
of their fame and their notoriety, and that that is
why he just honestly, he couldn't he couldn't get a
fair shake. By the way, They're not the only ones
in reality TV who have had a bad a bad run.
You know, remember the Teresa from the Real Housewives of
(01:09:35):
New Journey.
Speaker 3 (01:09:36):
Yes, yeah, I thought you're gonna say me, I was
gonna know. I would never let go to prison. He
went to.
Speaker 5 (01:09:42):
Prison, and our husband, Joe Judice, I believe it is
and he doesn't even like.
Speaker 3 (01:09:49):
To Italy.
Speaker 5 (01:09:51):
That's right, there's another story. We'll just touch on it
a little bit. We might need to get into it
another time because it's a big one. But did you
guys hear about the Love Island alum Mischelle Barnett.
Speaker 4 (01:10:05):
Yes, he lives in Utah, Salt Lake City and his partner.
His girlfriend reported threats to her life, assault and attempted
strangulation in front of their child, in front of their
little kid. She suffered symptoms including she couldn't breathe, she
had some neck pains, she was throwing up, she couldn't
remember anything. And now if you don't know who he is,
(01:10:28):
he was on Love Island Season USA season one and
The Challenge USA in twenty twenty two. Now, this is
a pretty big mental break. And I have to tell you,
as somebody that's spent on reality TV. I was on
The Mole on Netflix. You go through massive mental testing.
They don't just accept anybody. You have to basically pass
(01:10:48):
mental like excruciating mental challenges in order to even get
accepted to be on the show because they put you
through hell. You guys, I mean, they really put you
through the ring. Are all worth it, by the but
I will say it's it's harrowing that the things that
you have to go through. So I'm really surprised that
a lot of these reality stars are experiencing some of
(01:11:10):
these mental breaks. I'm very surprised because I mean, I
just can't imagine going through all these tests and then
having this kind of thing happen.
Speaker 5 (01:11:18):
Well, that's that's a fair point, because those batteries of
tests and they are they are deep, they're intense, they're intense,
So it kind of begs the question to me is
that does someone go in mentally healthy, stable, strong of
mind and then the process something happens.
Speaker 3 (01:11:37):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:11:38):
It has been a real night of chat and we're
going to be here tomorrow also talking about some of
the stuff that we covered tonight as well. The Didy
trial Week four kicks off on Monday, as well as
the Karen Reid trial. The defense kicks in tomorrow, so
we'll be covering that all week as well. And there
also might be a killer, potentially a serial killer in
(01:12:00):
the Northeast. So this doesn't work if we don't hear
from you, So any night this week, please call us
at eight eight eight three to one Crime and we
actually have a caller right now named Abraham, So we're
looking forward to hearing from that. And also if there
are cases that you want us to cover or start tracking,
please also let us know that as well. The whole
(01:12:21):
idea of this is to create a swell and have
a conversation for all of us.
Speaker 3 (01:12:26):
So, Abraham, what do we think? I don't know.
Speaker 5 (01:12:30):
I'm dying to know what Abraham has to say. How
are you this evening?
Speaker 3 (01:12:33):
Hi? Abraham?
Speaker 6 (01:12:35):
Hi, I'm good. How are you guys?
Speaker 3 (01:12:37):
We're good. Where are you calling us from?
Speaker 6 (01:12:39):
I am in Phoenix, Chandler specifically, I love thanks.
Speaker 3 (01:12:43):
Thanks for joining us on our first night. Abraham, what
is your question?
Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
Hi?
Speaker 6 (01:12:48):
So I was listening for the on the Ditty Trial
and I was just wondering, don't do you guys feel
like you know? These a lot of these testimonies, these
people are risking everything, you know, like how protected? How
protected are they when they when they're using you know,
a different name, but everybody knows that it was a
former assistant, you know, Like how protected could they be?
(01:13:10):
Could the court really pull them?
Speaker 3 (01:13:13):
Great question? Did he sitting right there?
Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
So they can be as anonymous as they want by name,
But there, you're sitting right in front of the person
who you're most afraid of, and right question.
Speaker 4 (01:13:23):
Again, he's being charged with racketeering, so that means basically
they're saying that he has a criminal enterprise, which means basically,
you know, he has a team of people that are
doing his bidding, right, and they're not all locked up,
So are they at risk?
Speaker 3 (01:13:39):
I think that's an excellent question. There's a great question. See.
Speaker 5 (01:13:43):
I like to think since this is now out in
the light of day, it's at least less risky. I'm
not saying no risk at all, and I'm the bravery.
I can't even begin to applaud on their end. But now,
I mean, you know, even with pseudonyms like you said,
now everyone knows everything. So I think it would have
(01:14:04):
been much more dangerous prior to stop someone before they
were going to testify. And now it's kind of the
damage is done and the federal government would be after
Diddy and any cohorts so quickly, is my thought.
Speaker 2 (01:14:20):
But you just don't know. I mean, he knows somebody everywhere.
I mean, that's the assertion, right, is that there are
people around every bend that are getting paid off. We
saw that happen at the CNN when that video was
leaked of Cassie Ventura being beaten up. The reality is
that was surveillance footage that was from many years ago,
(01:14:41):
and did he paid people off so that never saw
the light of day allegedly, So you know, to that end, yeah,
I think it's pretty dangerous and I think it's really
brave for any witness in a high profile case to
come forward. Period the end, and you know, I guess
this week will be very ten because there's many more
to come. So please, you know, the hope is that
(01:15:04):
you're going to stay with us all week as we
follow this trial and so many more because this is
the summer of trials. There are so many around the
bend and look, we're not lawyers, but we do love
to unpack it and unrelated to one. So we'll have
to call him tomorrow as well, So stay with us,
please join us. Thank you for a great first night,
(01:15:25):
and thank you for those that called in, and we
look so much forward to hearing more. This has been
true Crime Tonight, where we talk about true crime all
the time.
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