December 26, 2023 • 22 mins
In this episode, Loraine Ballard Morrill, Director of News and Community Affairs for iHeartMedia Philadelphia, and advocate Tony Luke Jr. are joined by Dr. Pete Vernig, VP of Clinical Services, and alumni coordinators Julie Toy and Bob Gibson from Recovery Centers of America. Together, they delve into the significance of prioritizing personal well-being and recovery for professionals in the addiction field.
This podcast episode and others are available to watch in video format here www.RCARecovery360.com
Any views or comments provided by individuals other than RCA employees are their own and do not represent the official views of Recovery Centers of America.
***Any views or comments provided by individuals other than RCA employees are their own and do not represent the official views of Recovery Centers of America.
This podcast episode and others are available to watch in video format here www.RCARecovery360.com
Any views or comments provided by individuals other than RCA employees are their own and do not represent the official views of Recovery Centers of America.
***Any views or comments provided by individuals other than RCA employees are their own and do not represent the official views of Recovery Centers of America.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:05):
Hello, Welcome to Recovery three sixty, the podcast dedicated to exploring the pathways
to treatment and recovery, brought toyou by Recovery Centers of America. I'm
Lorraine Ballard, Moral Directive, Newsand Community Affairs for iHeartMedia, Philadelphia,
and I am joined by the fantasticTony Luke Junior Ato. Lorraine, how
are you today? This has beenamazing? Right, I'm good? Another
(00:27):
show, some more information. Well, let's help some people today. Absolutely.
In each episode, we sit downwith experts, survivors, advocates in
the field of treatment and recovery.Will unravel the complexities of addiction, mental
health, and physical wellness while sheddinglight on the diverse range of therapies,
interventions, and approaches available. Intoday's episode, we're going to be talking
(00:49):
about being in recovery and also workingin recovery. An individual's personal journey of
recovery from substance use disorder is acourageous and transfer formative process. To talk
about what it's like to be inrecovery while working in recovery, We're joined
by Bob Gibson Alumni Coordinator, JulieToy Alumni coordinator, and doctor Peter Vernick,
(01:14):
who serves as vice president of MentalHealth Services all from Recovery Centers of
America. Well, let's start withyou guys, Julie and Bob. What
inspired you to pursue a career inthe recovery profession given your personal experiences with
recovery. Julia, don't me togo first, Yeah, you go first.
What started my journey was the factthat obviously I had firsthand experience in
(01:38):
addiction. I struggled for about twentyseven years an active addiction, you know,
just kind of being in like corporateAmerica, working jobs because I had
to really no purpose in it.Then I went and got treatment actually at
RCA, and was really just blownaway by the treatment that was afforded to
me, and I saw that therewere there's a lot of purpose in that
(02:00):
journey and being able to help otherpeople, and it's it's one thing that
helps my sobriety on a daily basis. What about you, Bob, I
would say, as far as likehow it started, I spent a lot
of my life feeling kind of purposelessand honestly like pretty useless most of the
time and massive lack of direction.Never knew what I wanted to do or
be and then it sounds kind ofsilly, but like the first time I
(02:23):
went to a detox, I wasgetting my search before I went into the
facility, and the guy that wasdoing it told me that he was in
recovery and he was telling me alittle bit about himself, and like,
immediately from that moment, I thoughtto myself, like, that would be
cool. That'd be cool to likebe that guy that gets to like talk
to somebody when they come in.And I didn't like stay sober for a
little while after that, but thatseed had been planted, Like that was
(02:46):
with me the whole time, evenwhen I was still using that someday that
might be something I might be interestedin. So it's cool to have the
opportunity to like actually do that today. Yeah, So, Pete, it
looks like Bob had a possibility rolemodel there, someone who was in recovery
and was helping with recovery. Whatis the value of having individuals who had
that lived experience be in that space. Well, it's absolutely invaluable having individuals
(03:12):
working in the field who have experiencedthemselves, first of all in their ability
to connect often with those who aregoing through it. There is an honesty,
there is there's knowledge, there isjust an ability to be heard that
oftentimes you don't get from other professionalswho haven't had that experience. And also
I think that it helps us allto understand more about what we do on
(03:36):
a day to day basis from thepoint of view of you know, something
as simple as you know you hadbrought up, Bob, the process of
somebody going through the admissions process,what does that actually feel like to somebody
who is having that experience. Wetry very hard to be trauma informed.
We try very hard to provide thatas a non stigmatizing, non re traumatizing
(03:57):
experience. But if you haven't beenthrough that, you know, you really
can't see that fully from the outside. So, you know, I've worked
with many people who are in recoveryfrom substance use disorder, from mental illness,
and some of the colleagues I've learnedthe most from are those. So
how does your personal journey in recoveryinfluence the way you personally approach and connect
with individuals who are seeking their ownaddiction issues. That'd be abop question to
(04:23):
start. Yeah, yeah, sure, go for it. So as far
as like, how does it influencethe way I approach and connect with individuals.
I would say, I mean mostof what I'm going to talk about
with like a perspective patient that comesinto the facility is going to be based
on my own actual personal experience.It's not like something that's like a theory
or something that I learned. It'slike something that I did, something like
(04:43):
mistakes that I made, things thatworked for me. So it's like coming
from a place of like personal,real world experience, and I think they
appreciate that when it's it's coming fromsomebody who's been there, done that.
You learn a lot I've found throughmaking mistakes as much as you do by
doing the right thing. So Ishare a lot of the mistakes with them,
so like ideally they can hopefully avoidthose things. It's nice they find
(05:06):
us to be somebody they can believein and they believe that we're being honest
about our experience, and I thinkit's useful. Yeah, Julie, I
think what Bob says is so importantto talk about the mistakes that you made
as well as the successes that youhad. Right, Yeah, one hundred
percent. I think you said itperfectly. I don't know that I would
have said anything different. Honestly.I do know though that when I speak,
(05:30):
it's very draining. Like there's timeswhere I used to do maybe two
sometimes three speaking events in the sameday and I found myself at the end
of the day just completely destroyed.So obviously being in it and doing what
you're doing, how do you maintainyour own recovery when you're so involved in
(05:51):
helping those to commit to start theirown journey in that? So what do
you do as your techniques you've learnedthat work for you where you're able to
kind of release your own struggle becauseyou're hearing it every day. So what
is affecting you? It's bringing backmemories, it's things that you have been
(06:12):
through. Is there anything that youcan share that you personally do that kind
of helps you let some of thatgo so you can maintain your own recovery
while doing the work that you're doing. Yeah, I mean that it's a
really tough balance to have. Butthe one thing at least in you know,
the fellowship that I belong to,which is a twelve step fellowship,
is you know, making sure thatwe're staying active in that community because being
(06:36):
inside the treatment world, isn't yourrecovery really having some solid support reaching out
to people. It's critical, it'sreally critical making sure that you carve out
time for yourself. I think insidethe facility and in our own recovery journey,
we're not just helping people inside thetreatment center, but we're also helping
people who are in our recovering communities. So it's kind of NonStop. But
(06:59):
for myself, I know, likemaking sure that I'm hitting my meetings,
making sure that I'm connected to mysponsor, making sure that I'm going through
my steps constantly, Like that doesn'tstop. I'm really just leading by example,
right, and I have to followthe lead of other people to keep
myself going and really just continue totake suggestions from other people like Ajel,
I see you're burned out, youneed to take some time off kind of
things like that. Yeah, Bob, I imagine that being in this it's
(07:21):
work is very can be very triggering, right, So how do you overcome
that? How do you what areyour strategies? I would say, so
I agree with like literally everything Juliesaid. I was taught like in the
very beginning, so I was kindof told by other people in recovery that
you know, working in treatment canbe like a really dangerous thing for somebody
(07:44):
that's in recovery because what tends tohappen to a lot of people is if
they were working some sort of program, and as Juli mentioned, like I'm
a member of a twelve step program, what happens is you go to work
every day and you're talking recovery allday, and it's you're not talking recovery
with like other recovered people who arethere to talk about and like hope necessarily
you're talking to people who are likefirst two days, five days, thirty
days of recovery, who are youknow, as they kind of use the
(08:07):
term like sick, like not reallywell at the moment. So it's like
it can be very draining, likeyou don't go in there and necessarily get
what you need for your recovery.If anything, it gets sucked out of
you. So like what I waswarned is like whatever I'm doing with my
recovery, not only can I notdo less, I have to do more.
So like I have to go tomore meetings, I have to pray
more, I have to call morepeople as far as like outside of that
(08:28):
like specific thing though. For me, I spend time every single morning exercising.
That's a big thing for me.I'd say that I kind of work
out like a drug addict if I'mbeing honest, because I am. I
also, you know, I praya lot. I like to play video
games. That's a good way forme to unplug back. I need some
time every day because we essentially justtalk all day. That's basically our job.
(08:48):
So like I need alone time.I need like some time like at
least every couple of days, ifnot every day, where I can just
like completely unplug and not have tospeak with anybody. That's a really big
deal for me. Right, So, Pete, you have two great examples
of people in recovery who are helpingothers in recovery. You know, you're
on the other end of things.You're not someone who's experienced recovery, but
(09:09):
you know what the issues are.How do you support and protect these two
wonderful individuals so that they can continueto do what they're doing. I think
that in the field, we needto be supportive and protective of each other,
regardless of someone's background. I thinkit's an over used cliche in health
care, but it's an important oneof the oxygen mask on an airplane that
(09:31):
you need to before helping someone elseout, they tell you put your own
oxygen mask on, because if you'renot wearing a mask and breathing, you're
not going to be able to behelpful to anyone else. So I think
that for people in the field,regardless of if you're in recovery or not.
You know, for myself, Iknow if I'm not taking good care
of myself, if I'm not well, if I'm not healthy, I'm not
(09:52):
going to be very helpful to others. So I think that creating a space,
creating a culture in which you cantake care of your and in which
self care is prioritized, and inwhich you know, if if a person
is really struggling, we can takea day off of work, or we
can take a little bit of timeto decompress, and we have supervisors and
(10:13):
we have colleagues who help and supportthat. I think that that's one of
the most important things for everybody inthe field. So if you can please
explain to me, what are someof the common misconceptions or stigmas you face
as a professional in recovery, andhow do you address them? I'll give
it a shot, so not todisappoint anyone, but if I'm being honest,
(10:33):
I don't really feel like I faceany of that. That's why I'm
bounding. And most of the there'sprobably a large percentage, if not more
than fifty percent of the people thatwork where I work at are in recovery,
and the people that are not personallyin recovery do have an understanding of
what the disease of addiction is.So I don't think that there's really so
much of like a judgment or astigma. There is that something that exists
(10:54):
like outside in the regular world.Yeah, certainly, but I don't really
personally experience in the workplace at all. If I'm being honest, I feel
the same way. It's kind ofwhy I get turn over to him because
I didn't have an answer. Ihaven't faced any of that. If anything,
it's kind of like you feel athome, you feel right where you're
supposed to be. Well, here'sa question that I'm sure you're happy to
(11:15):
answer, and that is, canyou share some success stories that you've had
being able to work with individuals fromyour lived experience them knowing you've been there
and you know what they're feeling,what they're experiencing. There's a lot of
those. Fortunately, I think youknow, one of the things that I
(11:37):
can say from my own experience,which is truly a blessing a success story,
is I know the darkness in whichpeople sit in in their disease all
too well. And I know thatkind of like deer in headlights stare that
you get from them when they firstcome in. They're scared, they're filled
with fear, and it kind ofis like the light has gone out inside
(11:58):
of them. And then all ofa sudden you start helping them get to
the other side, and like that, you see this light going on inside
of them. And you know,for myself, I've sponsored quite a bit
of women, and most of mysponsores have so far to this day lived
long term sobriety that in itself,it's not my success, it's theirs.
But I just get to share init, and I think that's the success
(12:18):
that I get from it. It'sjust the sharing and watching somebody get their
life back. Do you have anyspecific stories that pop out so I do.
I would say I have a fewto kind of echo what Julie was
saying. So our position specifically wherewe work at is really cool because we
get to remain in touch with peopleafter they discharge from treatment, which is
pretty uncommon in the industry most ofthe time, like once people roll out
(12:39):
of the facility, that's where likethe contact ends due to the professional boundaries.
But our job is to try tokeep in touch with them. So
I get to see and hear successstories every day. That's kind of like
my job. I'm very blessed inthat. So we have like these big
meetings every week where we have fortyfifty sixty alumni come back and you know,
they're all doing well and sober,and their eyes are bright and their
smile and they're laughing, and it'sreally wonderful because we saw them when they
(13:03):
walked in. We saw what theylooked like, we saw we heard how
they felt, what they were thinking, and then to see them transform.
But one specifically I think about allthe time is I was outside of the
facility, like kind of in thedriveway and there was a couple of alumni
this was like a couple of yearsago, that were kind of standing in
a circle talking before they were aboutto go into a meeting, and I
walked up and I noticed one ofthem who was somebody who had been in
(13:26):
the facility like multiple times, andit was one of those situations where I
was speaking with him, but itwas like he was a completely different person,
and it was like really shocking.And then I'm having this experience where
it's something speaking with this person andit seems like I don't even know them
anymore in like the most beautiful,positive way ever. And then all of
a sudden, he pointed to myleft and he was like, Hey,
did you notice so and so overhere? And I looked over and there
(13:48):
was another guy that I'd known forlike years, but I just he was
so different in like the way thathe was carrying himself and looking people in
the eye. I mean physically hedidn't change like that significantly, but I
hardly recognized him. Like seeing howthe extreme levels of change that people can
have in their lives and how positiveit is, it's like, we couldn't
do this if that didn't happen,Like if nobody got better, there's no
(14:09):
chance that we'd be able to dothis. If we need to see that,
Yeah, yeah, that must beso satisfying to be able to see
that kind of transformation. As someonewho lives in Kensington, I and my
stepson used to go to Conwell MiddleSchool. I used to have to drive
up every day in the middle ofthe opioid epidemic, and you see people
(14:30):
on the street, and you seethem shooting up, and you see the
devastation. You see these young girlswho age over the course of weeks,
and so to be able to encountersomeone who's been through something like that and
to almost not recognize them because thatcloud has lifted, that that personal hell
(14:52):
is now healed or at least eased, must be something extraordinary, right,
Pete. Absolutely, one of myfavorite parts of doing this job is being
able to see somebody and you know, having seen them when they came in
and having seen them when they're leaving. And of course you make a very
good point that when somebody is leavingone of our facilities, that's not the
(15:15):
end of recovery. That's the beginningof recovery, and then there's that long
term journey that they're on. Butbeing able to see them and see that
change is one of the things thatyou know that that keeps me doing it,
that keeps a lot of us doingit. Tony the transformation. What
you're really talking about is it isnot the physical transformation, it is the
mental and spiritual transformation. Because youknow, we can look a certain way,
(15:41):
but when we look at someone andwe speak to them, the way
we carry ourselves says so much aboutwhat the inside of ourselves looks like.
And I've seen it as well,Like I've seen people that I have been
rooting for and speaking with, andyou know, I meet them and you
can tell immediately that the outward appearanceof them is still exactly the way they
(16:07):
looked from every time I've spoken tothem, But there was something in their
eyes. There was a look,a light, which is a great the
term you used, there's a lightthat goes on of not just hope,
but a light of that transformation.You know, there was a question here,
(16:29):
you know, how has working inrecovery? How has that enhanced you
know, your life and your purpose. But it's a question that doesn't need
to be asked because every single thingthat you have mentioned, everything that you
spoke about, you can see thatthey are on the journey with the people
that they are helping. It's anamazing feeling to know that someone is with
(16:53):
you. But it's even a greaterfeeling to know that someone is sharing,
legitimately sharing in the joy of yoursuccess. People can feel when you truly
are happy for them and you're trulysharing in that joy. And I don't
(17:14):
know how life can get any betterfor you than seeing the light come on
in someone's eyes where there was onlydarkness. That to me, there's no
money value that you can put onthat. I mean, that to me
is why we even exist as humanbeings. If we all thought of that,
(17:36):
if we all look to turn thelight on in everyone that we've met
in our life, it makes thelight inside us the brightest that it can
possibly be. So that's an incredible, incredible work that you do. Truly,
thank you. Bobby very Well saidyou talked about how earlier in your
life you didn't have purpose, oryou didn't think you had purpose. Yeah,
(17:57):
clearly working in recovery has enriched yourlives, both of you, Julie,
Bob, your life and your senseof purpose. And I wonder if
you can talk a little more aboutwhat it has meant for you to be
in this field. You know,twenty seven years in recovery is amazing.
No, no, no, nottwenty seven years in recovery, twenty seven
(18:18):
years of my addiction. I'm fiveyears in recovery, five years in recovery,
let me be corrected. Five yearsamazing years in recovery. Twenties after
twenty seven years. That's a remarkablestatement. And so working in this field,
clearly you've found your purpose. AndBob, you found your purpose,
right, yes, yeah, absolutely, yeah, would like me to expand,
(18:38):
please expand. Yeah. So everyonealready said like so many things very
beautifully, but I would say so, like, although you know it is
like an occupation, I would saythat probably nobody that I know that works
in the treatment field does it formoney. I don't think that's like why
anybody is involved in it. Ifthat's what you're after, is far is
(19:00):
why you're doing the profession or inthe wrong profession. That's not what we're
supposed to be doing here. Iwould say too, Like my favorite thing
about it is I get to carryout like my primary purpose on a daily
basis. I get to be exposedto people on their first day of recovery
all the time. So if you'rea part of like a twelve step community,
you might get to meet somebody onday one of sobriety. Once a
(19:21):
year, maybe maybe twice a yearif you're lucky, if you're in the
right place at the right time.I get to meet those people every single
day, multiple times a day,so getting an opportunity to kind of be
maybe the first person to like givethem a little spark of hope or do
what that person did for me whenI went into my first detas and just
like kind of let me know,like, hey, like some of us
make it, you know, someof us are okay and happy. It's
a pleasure. You also get likekind of like a secondary fellowship out of
(19:45):
it. So many people come throughthe facility and then I do run into
them like out in the out inthe world in my own recovery, and
everywhere I go, I get tosee them, and it's just nice.
I feel like I know people everywhereI go, and it's just nice to
feel a part of it. Soat least for myself, like having that
sense of purpose. Prior to Ialways felt that my destiny was to die
(20:08):
from this disease, and I justkind of accepted it. But you know,
once I got treatment for the eighthtime, and God willing, it's
my last time and walked into myfellowship and was taught this way of life
that Bob is talking about, andthen being able to transform my career into
this, like you said, justkind of being able to meet those people
(20:29):
every single day live out our primarypurpose, which is for ourselves to stay
sober and help the next suffering addictor alcoholic, And that in itself is
like you said, Tony, Ithink, as human beings, that's kind
of what we're here to do inthe first place. So let's take out
the fact that it's recovery. Butbecause we have this type of fellowship and
program, it just kind of excelsit in a different direction, I guess.
(20:52):
I mean, it's truly just beautiful. It really is. And I
think given our positions inside the facility, it's so different than your traditional treatment
center employees and stuff like that.Like we really we get to teach our
fellowship twelve step programs to them,We get to meet with them one on
one, we get to introduce themto different parts of the step work.
(21:14):
We get to introduce them and linkthem up with sponsors on the outside.
I mean, we do so muchwith them that, like, how can
our life not be filled with purpose. You know what I mean. It
just there's no way around it.It's beautiful, yeah, Pete. If
people want more information about Recovery Centersof America, where do they go?
For more information about Recovery Centers ofAmerica, you can go to Recoverycentersofamerica dot
com or call us twenty four hoursa day, seven days a week at
(21:38):
eight four four two five Recovery.Thank you, Bob Gibson, Julie Toy,
alumni coordinators at RCA. Pete Vernig, vice President of Mental Health Services
from Recovery Centers of America. I'mLorraine Ballad Morrel. I'm Tony Luke Junior.
Thank you all for joining us todayand the number of p
Hello, Welcome to Recovery three sixty, the podcast dedicated to exploring the pathways
to treatment and recovery, brought toyou by Recovery Centers of America. I'm
Lorraine Ballard, Moral Directive, Newsand Community Affairs for iHeartMedia, Philadelphia,
and I am joined by the fantasticTony Luke Junior Ato. Lorraine, how
are you today? This has beenamazing? Right, I'm good? Another
(00:27):
show, some more information. Well, let's help some people today. Absolutely.
In each episode, we sit downwith experts, survivors, advocates in
the field of treatment and recovery.Will unravel the complexities of addiction, mental
health, and physical wellness while sheddinglight on the diverse range of therapies,
interventions, and approaches available. Intoday's episode, we're going to be talking
(00:49):
about being in recovery and also workingin recovery. An individual's personal journey of
recovery from substance use disorder is acourageous and transfer formative process. To talk
about what it's like to be inrecovery while working in recovery, We're joined
by Bob Gibson Alumni Coordinator, JulieToy Alumni coordinator, and doctor Peter Vernick,
(01:14):
who serves as vice president of MentalHealth Services all from Recovery Centers of
America. Well, let's start withyou guys, Julie and Bob. What
inspired you to pursue a career inthe recovery profession given your personal experiences with
recovery. Julia, don't me togo first, Yeah, you go first.
What started my journey was the factthat obviously I had firsthand experience in
(01:38):
addiction. I struggled for about twentyseven years an active addiction, you know,
just kind of being in like corporateAmerica, working jobs because I had
to really no purpose in it.Then I went and got treatment actually at
RCA, and was really just blownaway by the treatment that was afforded to
me, and I saw that therewere there's a lot of purpose in that
(02:00):
journey and being able to help otherpeople, and it's it's one thing that
helps my sobriety on a daily basis. What about you, Bob, I
would say, as far as likehow it started, I spent a lot
of my life feeling kind of purposelessand honestly like pretty useless most of the
time and massive lack of direction.Never knew what I wanted to do or
be and then it sounds kind ofsilly, but like the first time I
(02:23):
went to a detox, I wasgetting my search before I went into the
facility, and the guy that wasdoing it told me that he was in
recovery and he was telling me alittle bit about himself, and like,
immediately from that moment, I thoughtto myself, like, that would be
cool. That'd be cool to likebe that guy that gets to like talk
to somebody when they come in.And I didn't like stay sober for a
little while after that, but thatseed had been planted, Like that was
(02:46):
with me the whole time, evenwhen I was still using that someday that
might be something I might be interestedin. So it's cool to have the
opportunity to like actually do that today. Yeah, So, Pete, it
looks like Bob had a possibility rolemodel there, someone who was in recovery
and was helping with recovery. Whatis the value of having individuals who had
that lived experience be in that space. Well, it's absolutely invaluable having individuals
(03:12):
working in the field who have experiencedthemselves, first of all in their ability
to connect often with those who aregoing through it. There is an honesty,
there is there's knowledge, there isjust an ability to be heard that
oftentimes you don't get from other professionalswho haven't had that experience. And also
I think that it helps us allto understand more about what we do on
(03:36):
a day to day basis from thepoint of view of you know, something
as simple as you know you hadbrought up, Bob, the process of
somebody going through the admissions process,what does that actually feel like to somebody
who is having that experience. Wetry very hard to be trauma informed.
We try very hard to provide thatas a non stigmatizing, non re traumatizing
(03:57):
experience. But if you haven't beenthrough that, you know, you really
can't see that fully from the outside. So, you know, I've worked
with many people who are in recoveryfrom substance use disorder, from mental illness,
and some of the colleagues I've learnedthe most from are those. So
how does your personal journey in recoveryinfluence the way you personally approach and connect
with individuals who are seeking their ownaddiction issues. That'd be abop question to
(04:23):
start. Yeah, yeah, sure, go for it. So as far
as like, how does it influencethe way I approach and connect with individuals.
I would say, I mean mostof what I'm going to talk about
with like a perspective patient that comesinto the facility is going to be based
on my own actual personal experience.It's not like something that's like a theory
or something that I learned. It'slike something that I did, something like
(04:43):
mistakes that I made, things thatworked for me. So it's like coming
from a place of like personal,real world experience, and I think they
appreciate that when it's it's coming fromsomebody who's been there, done that.
You learn a lot I've found throughmaking mistakes as much as you do by
doing the right thing. So Ishare a lot of the mistakes with them,
so like ideally they can hopefully avoidthose things. It's nice they find
(05:06):
us to be somebody they can believein and they believe that we're being honest
about our experience, and I thinkit's useful. Yeah, Julie, I
think what Bob says is so importantto talk about the mistakes that you made
as well as the successes that youhad. Right, Yeah, one hundred
percent. I think you said itperfectly. I don't know that I would
have said anything different. Honestly.I do know though that when I speak,
(05:30):
it's very draining. Like there's timeswhere I used to do maybe two
sometimes three speaking events in the sameday and I found myself at the end
of the day just completely destroyed.So obviously being in it and doing what
you're doing, how do you maintainyour own recovery when you're so involved in
(05:51):
helping those to commit to start theirown journey in that? So what do
you do as your techniques you've learnedthat work for you where you're able to
kind of release your own struggle becauseyou're hearing it every day. So what
is affecting you? It's bringing backmemories, it's things that you have been
(06:12):
through. Is there anything that youcan share that you personally do that kind
of helps you let some of thatgo so you can maintain your own recovery
while doing the work that you're doing. Yeah, I mean that it's a
really tough balance to have. Butthe one thing at least in you know,
the fellowship that I belong to,which is a twelve step fellowship,
is you know, making sure thatwe're staying active in that community because being
(06:36):
inside the treatment world, isn't yourrecovery really having some solid support reaching out
to people. It's critical, it'sreally critical making sure that you carve out
time for yourself. I think insidethe facility and in our own recovery journey,
we're not just helping people inside thetreatment center, but we're also helping
people who are in our recovering communities. So it's kind of NonStop. But
(06:59):
for myself, I know, likemaking sure that I'm hitting my meetings,
making sure that I'm connected to mysponsor, making sure that I'm going through
my steps constantly, Like that doesn'tstop. I'm really just leading by example,
right, and I have to followthe lead of other people to keep
myself going and really just continue totake suggestions from other people like Ajel,
I see you're burned out, youneed to take some time off kind of
things like that. Yeah, Bob, I imagine that being in this it's
(07:21):
work is very can be very triggering, right, So how do you overcome
that? How do you what areyour strategies? I would say, so
I agree with like literally everything Juliesaid. I was taught like in the
very beginning, so I was kindof told by other people in recovery that
you know, working in treatment canbe like a really dangerous thing for somebody
(07:44):
that's in recovery because what tends tohappen to a lot of people is if
they were working some sort of program, and as Juli mentioned, like I'm
a member of a twelve step program, what happens is you go to work
every day and you're talking recovery allday, and it's you're not talking recovery
with like other recovered people who arethere to talk about and like hope necessarily
you're talking to people who are likefirst two days, five days, thirty
days of recovery, who are youknow, as they kind of use the
(08:07):
term like sick, like not reallywell at the moment. So it's like
it can be very draining, likeyou don't go in there and necessarily get
what you need for your recovery.If anything, it gets sucked out of
you. So like what I waswarned is like whatever I'm doing with my
recovery, not only can I notdo less, I have to do more.
So like I have to go tomore meetings, I have to pray
more, I have to call morepeople as far as like outside of that
(08:28):
like specific thing though. For me, I spend time every single morning exercising.
That's a big thing for me.I'd say that I kind of work
out like a drug addict if I'mbeing honest, because I am. I
also, you know, I praya lot. I like to play video
games. That's a good way forme to unplug back. I need some
time every day because we essentially justtalk all day. That's basically our job.
(08:48):
So like I need alone time.I need like some time like at
least every couple of days, ifnot every day, where I can just
like completely unplug and not have tospeak with anybody. That's a really big
deal for me. Right, So, Pete, you have two great examples
of people in recovery who are helpingothers in recovery. You know, you're
on the other end of things.You're not someone who's experienced recovery, but
(09:09):
you know what the issues are.How do you support and protect these two
wonderful individuals so that they can continueto do what they're doing. I think
that in the field, we needto be supportive and protective of each other,
regardless of someone's background. I thinkit's an over used cliche in health
care, but it's an important oneof the oxygen mask on an airplane that
(09:31):
you need to before helping someone elseout, they tell you put your own
oxygen mask on, because if you'renot wearing a mask and breathing, you're
not going to be able to behelpful to anyone else. So I think
that for people in the field,regardless of if you're in recovery or not.
You know, for myself, Iknow if I'm not taking good care
of myself, if I'm not well, if I'm not healthy, I'm not
(09:52):
going to be very helpful to others. So I think that creating a space,
creating a culture in which you cantake care of your and in which
self care is prioritized, and inwhich you know, if if a person
is really struggling, we can takea day off of work, or we
can take a little bit of timeto decompress, and we have supervisors and
(10:13):
we have colleagues who help and supportthat. I think that that's one of
the most important things for everybody inthe field. So if you can please
explain to me, what are someof the common misconceptions or stigmas you face
as a professional in recovery, andhow do you address them? I'll give
it a shot, so not todisappoint anyone, but if I'm being honest,
(10:33):
I don't really feel like I faceany of that. That's why I'm
bounding. And most of the there'sprobably a large percentage, if not more
than fifty percent of the people thatwork where I work at are in recovery,
and the people that are not personallyin recovery do have an understanding of
what the disease of addiction is.So I don't think that there's really so
much of like a judgment or astigma. There is that something that exists
(10:54):
like outside in the regular world.Yeah, certainly, but I don't really
personally experience in the workplace at all. If I'm being honest, I feel
the same way. It's kind ofwhy I get turn over to him because
I didn't have an answer. Ihaven't faced any of that. If anything,
it's kind of like you feel athome, you feel right where you're
supposed to be. Well, here'sa question that I'm sure you're happy to
(11:15):
answer, and that is, canyou share some success stories that you've had
being able to work with individuals fromyour lived experience them knowing you've been there
and you know what they're feeling,what they're experiencing. There's a lot of
those. Fortunately, I think youknow, one of the things that I
(11:37):
can say from my own experience,which is truly a blessing a success story,
is I know the darkness in whichpeople sit in in their disease all
too well. And I know thatkind of like deer in headlights stare that
you get from them when they firstcome in. They're scared, they're filled
with fear, and it kind ofis like the light has gone out inside
(11:58):
of them. And then all ofa sudden you start helping them get to
the other side, and like that, you see this light going on inside
of them. And you know,for myself, I've sponsored quite a bit
of women, and most of mysponsores have so far to this day lived
long term sobriety that in itself,it's not my success, it's theirs.
But I just get to share init, and I think that's the success
(12:18):
that I get from it. It'sjust the sharing and watching somebody get their
life back. Do you have anyspecific stories that pop out so I do.
I would say I have a fewto kind of echo what Julie was
saying. So our position specifically wherewe work at is really cool because we
get to remain in touch with peopleafter they discharge from treatment, which is
pretty uncommon in the industry most ofthe time, like once people roll out
(12:39):
of the facility, that's where likethe contact ends due to the professional boundaries.
But our job is to try tokeep in touch with them. So
I get to see and hear successstories every day. That's kind of like
my job. I'm very blessed inthat. So we have like these big
meetings every week where we have fortyfifty sixty alumni come back and you know,
they're all doing well and sober,and their eyes are bright and their
smile and they're laughing, and it'sreally wonderful because we saw them when they
(13:03):
walked in. We saw what theylooked like, we saw we heard how
they felt, what they were thinking, and then to see them transform.
But one specifically I think about allthe time is I was outside of the
facility, like kind of in thedriveway and there was a couple of alumni
this was like a couple of yearsago, that were kind of standing in
a circle talking before they were aboutto go into a meeting, and I
walked up and I noticed one ofthem who was somebody who had been in
(13:26):
the facility like multiple times, andit was one of those situations where I
was speaking with him, but itwas like he was a completely different person,
and it was like really shocking.And then I'm having this experience where
it's something speaking with this person andit seems like I don't even know them
anymore in like the most beautiful,positive way ever. And then all of
a sudden, he pointed to myleft and he was like, Hey,
did you notice so and so overhere? And I looked over and there
(13:48):
was another guy that I'd known forlike years, but I just he was
so different in like the way thathe was carrying himself and looking people in
the eye. I mean physically hedidn't change like that significantly, but I
hardly recognized him. Like seeing howthe extreme levels of change that people can
have in their lives and how positiveit is, it's like, we couldn't
do this if that didn't happen,Like if nobody got better, there's no
(14:09):
chance that we'd be able to dothis. If we need to see that,
Yeah, yeah, that must beso satisfying to be able to see
that kind of transformation. As someonewho lives in Kensington, I and my
stepson used to go to Conwell MiddleSchool. I used to have to drive
up every day in the middle ofthe opioid epidemic, and you see people
(14:30):
on the street, and you seethem shooting up, and you see the
devastation. You see these young girlswho age over the course of weeks,
and so to be able to encountersomeone who's been through something like that and
to almost not recognize them because thatcloud has lifted, that that personal hell
(14:52):
is now healed or at least eased, must be something extraordinary, right,
Pete. Absolutely, one of myfavorite parts of doing this job is being
able to see somebody and you know, having seen them when they came in
and having seen them when they're leaving. And of course you make a very
good point that when somebody is leavingone of our facilities, that's not the
(15:15):
end of recovery. That's the beginningof recovery, and then there's that long
term journey that they're on. Butbeing able to see them and see that
change is one of the things thatyou know that that keeps me doing it,
that keeps a lot of us doingit. Tony the transformation. What
you're really talking about is it isnot the physical transformation, it is the
mental and spiritual transformation. Because youknow, we can look a certain way,
(15:41):
but when we look at someone andwe speak to them, the way
we carry ourselves says so much aboutwhat the inside of ourselves looks like.
And I've seen it as well,Like I've seen people that I have been
rooting for and speaking with, andyou know, I meet them and you
can tell immediately that the outward appearanceof them is still exactly the way they
(16:07):
looked from every time I've spoken tothem, But there was something in their
eyes. There was a look,a light, which is a great the
term you used, there's a lightthat goes on of not just hope,
but a light of that transformation.You know, there was a question here,
(16:29):
you know, how has working inrecovery? How has that enhanced you
know, your life and your purpose. But it's a question that doesn't need
to be asked because every single thingthat you have mentioned, everything that you
spoke about, you can see thatthey are on the journey with the people
that they are helping. It's anamazing feeling to know that someone is with
(16:53):
you. But it's even a greaterfeeling to know that someone is sharing,
legitimately sharing in the joy of yoursuccess. People can feel when you truly
are happy for them and you're trulysharing in that joy. And I don't
(17:14):
know how life can get any betterfor you than seeing the light come on
in someone's eyes where there was onlydarkness. That to me, there's no
money value that you can put onthat. I mean, that to me
is why we even exist as humanbeings. If we all thought of that,
(17:36):
if we all look to turn thelight on in everyone that we've met
in our life, it makes thelight inside us the brightest that it can
possibly be. So that's an incredible, incredible work that you do. Truly,
thank you. Bobby very Well saidyou talked about how earlier in your
life you didn't have purpose, oryou didn't think you had purpose. Yeah,
(17:57):
clearly working in recovery has enriched yourlives, both of you, Julie,
Bob, your life and your senseof purpose. And I wonder if
you can talk a little more aboutwhat it has meant for you to be
in this field. You know,twenty seven years in recovery is amazing.
No, no, no, nottwenty seven years in recovery, twenty seven
(18:18):
years of my addiction. I'm fiveyears in recovery, five years in recovery,
let me be corrected. Five yearsamazing years in recovery. Twenties after
twenty seven years. That's a remarkablestatement. And so working in this field,
clearly you've found your purpose. AndBob, you found your purpose,
right, yes, yeah, absolutely, yeah, would like me to expand,
(18:38):
please expand. Yeah. So everyonealready said like so many things very
beautifully, but I would say so, like, although you know it is
like an occupation, I would saythat probably nobody that I know that works
in the treatment field does it formoney. I don't think that's like why
anybody is involved in it. Ifthat's what you're after, is far is
(19:00):
why you're doing the profession or inthe wrong profession. That's not what we're
supposed to be doing here. Iwould say too, Like my favorite thing
about it is I get to carryout like my primary purpose on a daily
basis. I get to be exposedto people on their first day of recovery
all the time. So if you'rea part of like a twelve step community,
you might get to meet somebody onday one of sobriety. Once a
(19:21):
year, maybe maybe twice a yearif you're lucky, if you're in the
right place at the right time.I get to meet those people every single
day, multiple times a day,so getting an opportunity to kind of be
maybe the first person to like givethem a little spark of hope or do
what that person did for me whenI went into my first detas and just
like kind of let me know,like, hey, like some of us
make it, you know, someof us are okay and happy. It's
a pleasure. You also get likekind of like a secondary fellowship out of
(19:45):
it. So many people come throughthe facility and then I do run into
them like out in the out inthe world in my own recovery, and
everywhere I go, I get tosee them, and it's just nice.
I feel like I know people everywhereI go, and it's just nice to
feel a part of it. Soat least for myself, like having that
sense of purpose. Prior to Ialways felt that my destiny was to die
(20:08):
from this disease, and I justkind of accepted it. But you know,
once I got treatment for the eighthtime, and God willing, it's
my last time and walked into myfellowship and was taught this way of life
that Bob is talking about, andthen being able to transform my career into
this, like you said, justkind of being able to meet those people
(20:29):
every single day live out our primarypurpose, which is for ourselves to stay
sober and help the next suffering addictor alcoholic, And that in itself is
like you said, Tony, Ithink, as human beings, that's kind
of what we're here to do inthe first place. So let's take out
the fact that it's recovery. Butbecause we have this type of fellowship and
program, it just kind of excelsit in a different direction, I guess.
(20:52):
I mean, it's truly just beautiful. It really is. And I
think given our positions inside the facility, it's so different than your traditional treatment
center employees and stuff like that.Like we really we get to teach our
fellowship twelve step programs to them,We get to meet with them one on
one, we get to introduce themto different parts of the step work.
(21:14):
We get to introduce them and linkthem up with sponsors on the outside.
I mean, we do so muchwith them that, like, how can
our life not be filled with purpose. You know what I mean. It
just there's no way around it.It's beautiful, yeah, Pete. If
people want more information about Recovery Centersof America, where do they go?
For more information about Recovery Centers ofAmerica, you can go to Recoverycentersofamerica dot
com or call us twenty four hoursa day, seven days a week at
(21:38):
eight four four two five Recovery.Thank you, Bob Gibson, Julie Toy,
alumni coordinators at RCA. Pete Vernig, vice President of Mental Health Services
from Recovery Centers of America. I'mLorraine Ballad Morrel. I'm Tony Luke Junior.
Thank you all for joining us todayand the number of p
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