June 10, 2025 • 35 mins
Today on The Breakfast Club, Harry O Speaks On Calculated Communication, Reputation, New Book. Listen For More!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that ass up in the morning. The Breakfast Club Morning,
Everybody's DJ Envy just hilarious. Charlamagne the God we are
the Breakfast Club Lawn. La Rosa is here as well.
And we got a special guest in the building. We
got the good brother Harold Wilkerson. Anybody gonna know who
that is?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Harry Old.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Ladies and gentlemen, what's up, brother?
Speaker 3 (00:21):
What's going on? What's going on? Everyone? Thank you for
having me? L L Lauren?
Speaker 1 (00:25):
What's up?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
HARRYO? Got a new book called It's Beyond Words, which
is out right now.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
And you talk, you're talking about.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
The art of calculated communication.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Yes, what is that?
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Great question? So the art of calculated communication? Let me
just rewind a little bit for the room who may
not know or those who don't know in the room
that besides an entertainment executive, I'm also a college professor
and I've been teaching communication courses for maybe twelve to
thirteen years.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
You know that if you're gonna go that far, let's
go all the way back there. You know, HARRYO. It
was started off as a rapper. Yes, that's originally know HARRYO.
He's from high Bridge, He's from the Bronx he s
throught up as a rapper from and it was signed
to the Ink. Yes, signed to the Ink. You was
a hype man for Jo Roll for many years and
then you stop rapping and now break it that. Well,
(01:13):
first of all, how did you meet IRV and everybody
and go through that whole list of things?
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Great question, So let me rewind, right, So first I
started entertainment business. I had a deal with Uptown Records
first with Andre Hrrell and everyone over there. God bless
it that level favorite favorite, right best for R and
B music, all right, So I was maybe like in
eighth grade, so that came went. Then I was working
with Puff for a while. Whoa, oh that bad boy. Yeah, listen,
(01:38):
I know my guy's going through a lot. But I
got to give him a lot of credit for helping
me of where I'm at today. Like I have to
give him his credit because I probably wouldn't be here
without the image of him.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Right, Well, we can't take away what he did professionally.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Professionally and what he and what he did for me
in my life. Person He did a lot for me
and and I you know, tell you about it if
I have time, Like he stuck up for me plenty
of times when executives tried to blackball me and things
like that. Puff found out about it, step in like you, now,
you're not doing that to my guy. So I got
to give him this credit. So from there we transition quick.
I had to deal with Motown, they had to deal
with murder inc Right.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
How many deals do you have?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
About four deals starting at eighth grade? Starting in eighth grade,
started in the eighth grade. Like, I've been doing entertainment
for a long time. So now fast forward. Let me
just tell you as far as me and Ja, I
met Ja on the set of a movie called Turn
It Up. Right, You're not gonna remember me in the
movie because they edited me out through movie.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
You're not gonna remember me.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
But you if you look at the credits, you'll see
me in the credits or whatever. So the movie was
shot in Canada, So we traveled to Canada. Right, I'm
there with my manager. We're trying to get into Canada.
My manager at the time, he gets arrested for some reason.
He can't get into Canada. You know how that goes.
So now I'm just I'm young. I'm in Canada about
to shoot this movie. I'm by myself. I'm a little nervous.
(02:56):
So my trailer is right next to Jo's trailer. But
I would always see Ja in the Violator office because
we was working with a violator death Jam. But we
never really, you know, knew each other. We saw each other,
we passed. So I'm in a trailer. He knocks on
my trailer door, so I opened up. He goes, yo,
you signed a death Jam, you signed a violator. I'm like, nah,
my god, my song this, and we're doing work over there.
He goes, man, I hear you here by yourself and
(03:17):
your manager got arrested. Listen, anything you need, come to
my trailer. If you need weed, if you need hennessy,
if you need anything. Joe has been trying to get
me high since I met him, Right, yeah, I don't
do any of that. So from there, John and I
had a connection. That was his first album, like right
before his first album came out. After this album came out,
he blew up and took off, and you know, my
(03:39):
career was going wherever it was going. But anytime we
would see each other, it would like we would stop
everything and give each other love. And then I met
Chris Gotti, Irv's brother, somewhere in the club and he
knew I did music. He said, listen, won't you come
down to the studio. Went to the studio. So I
recording records with IRV, records with Ashanti records with Joe. Next,
(04:00):
you know, a brotherhood form where although me and Joh
came in through entertainment, that's more my brother like that,
that's my guy. And on I said before my company
chased Republic, we serve as like an independent agency form.
We close a lot of different deals like I do
with you. I and we'll talked about made a lot
of money together. But more importantly, that's that's my brother,
that's my guy.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
So now so now you get out of music, and
music never takes off. I see.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
You can look at it that way, right, you tell me, well,
I had the transition. I always say this, right, somebody
can ask you, like, how do you view success? Right,
So in your eyes you may say Harry Yo as
an artist wasn't successful, and that's fine. You can see
it that way. I don't view it that way. I
view it as I came into the entertainment business in
(04:47):
eighth grade. I made a life out of it. I'm
sitting here doing an interview on a breakfast club, not
a rapper.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
I'm not always doing you as an executive. Like that's
how I always looked at Harry as an executive. I
never even knew anything about.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Like being a DJ. Yeah, there's been plenty of times
where like I would have to wait for E outside
of the radio station, try to get music played, like
we have that relationship you and I met later on
in life as being an entertainment. Exact the same thing
with Lauren, like you and I met. First conversation I
have with you, it says, Listen could probably make some
money with you, right, Yeah, and that's how it went.
(05:22):
But he just knows a little bit of the backstory.
But yeah, so it all depends on how you want
to look at it as far as you're not being successful.
But I made a life for it, my dad, Listen,
I paid her tuition. That's entertainment. Do you understand her
private school tuition, which we all know is very expensive?
All through entertainment. So someone asks, hey, you weren't successful,
(05:43):
I don't know. I wouldn't say that. I say I
think them pretty well.
Speaker 4 (05:45):
Are you probably about to ask this, Well, then I'm
interested in know so from the artist's perspective, then you
transition into the executive side because of the relationships.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
And what is that transition because.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
You started at eight, an executive is an adult making
real doark decisions.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Right, Well, it's two folds to it, right. As I said,
I've been a college professor teaching communication courses. Now with
communication to understand the art of connecting with others, we're
first connecting with yourself. And what we were talking about.
Once I understood and fully came of who I am,
a higher sense of awareness of me, I understood my abilities.
(06:18):
I understood how I can build relationships. So I just
started to build and form credible relationships with people, building trust,
but in a strategic way, not in a manipulative way,
just very strategic and like I can talk a lot
about me and MV because MB and I made some
money together and our relationship build, and I was intentional
on how we're building our relationship. So what I did
(06:40):
is I just merged the world between entertainment and education
and made a life.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
So what is the art of calculator communication? And how
has that helped you? Okay, got to get through all
those different worlds.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
So the art of calculator communication and to make it sure.
Because you can talk about this all day. But what
I would do is this, right, say with Lauren, for instance,
right I met Lauren at the Brooklyn Nets event. Now
you said, hey, Lauren's on her way here, can you
send somebody to get it in Immediately, I'm like, all right,
I know who she is. I absolutely know that we
(07:13):
can probably do business with her.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Lauren was two hours late, by.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
The way, I wasn't gonna say, is like driving to
another planning and it was raining, but I will pull
up for y'all later or not.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
We had an event in the Barclay Center for the
Brooklyn Nets, which are one of my partners, and I
hire you to do different events. So he while we're there,
he's like, listen, Lauren's on the way, can you send
somebody to get it. You know how difficult it is
to get someone inside the Barclay Center when it's closed,
like it's really closed at this point. But I understand
I have to be a little bit strategic. I want
(07:47):
to build a relationship with this young lady possibly do business.
So we sent an executive to go outside and figure
it out to get her in now as she's in.
I understand it takes more than one encounter for us
to start building some type of relationship, but we have
to have that first encounter. It have to be a
genuine encounter. It has to be maybe someone can help
(08:08):
build that bridge between you and I, and I use June.
June em he's manager. Whoever's listening. I said, June, ju
me in favor, let her know, stamp me right, let
her know. So June went to you and said, Hey, Harry, yo,
this is my guy. That's all I needed to start
building some type of communication with you. Now, to make
it a little bit shorter. In order for Lauren and
(08:29):
I to build a relationship, I have to get her
to peel back hilarious. I have to try to get
to know her. The closer I get to her, the
more of a chance I have of doing great business
with her. I just can't pick up the phone and say, hey,
I have a bunch of deals for you. She doesn't
even know who I am. Yeah, we have to build trust.
So I have to get her to pill back layers.
I have to ask her questions. But if she never responds,
(08:50):
like say, if I say, hey, as simple as this, Laurna,
how was your day today?
Speaker 4 (08:54):
Great so far besides dealing with Charlamagne.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
But other than that, I'm the best part of her
day the other day.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
What are your plans tomorrow?
Speaker 4 (09:02):
We have a flight. We're going to la for the
BT Awards. Me and the team at the Breakfast Club. Wow, well,
not them, but the producers and stuff.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
You have a lot of work at the BT Awards.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
We do the latest with Laurena Rose is in the
radio room for the first time ever for two days.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
Pretty cool. Congratulations, I love that. Now check this out right.
So I would have to work a little bit harder
now with Lauren because although I asked these questions, and
I know we're on air's a lot going on. I
asked her how it was her day, right, and she
said how what they was? She didn't say, how is yours? Too?
Speaker 4 (09:32):
Oh shoot, sorry, so's I'm intating the next question.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
I know I would know it's fine. I'm interested in
knowing about her day, but I want to see how
much interest she's holding in me to know about me
as well, and sooner or later that would come. This
is our made me like our second encounter, But if
I can't get you to have that exchange with me,
I have to work a lot harder and be more
strategic and to get you to communicate with me.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
And if you never do that, it's right.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
This person doesn't have any interest in building with me
in this area.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I think also too in business. I've never had a
business interaction where my first thought is to say, how
is your Like most people come to you just like so, like,
this is what I want, this is what I need.
So you just kind of sit and listen and then
you try and think through can I even do that
with everything else that have happening.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
That's the problem with communication where I don't want any
communication with anyone to feel transactional. And I'm only using
NBA as example because we made some money they give
me through business. NBA and I have a relationship where
NBA called me at five o'clock in the morning and
we're talking about dance.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
We're not even talking about business, we're talking about dance.
He's like, Yo, do you do this with your daughter?
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Look at these classes? Check this out. How did it
get there?
Speaker 1 (10:41):
It got there through.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
Strategic communication and connecting and building. If every time I
seee it's just hey, I got a you got B
sooner or later. If I don't have a anymore, or
I'm in a downside, I can't get either really pick
up my calls because we don't have a connection. If
I'm making sense here.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
You are making sense what I will say, hate small talk, right,
So when I hear that conversation with you and law
and I'm like, Okay, what does he want?
Speaker 1 (11:05):
That's what I was thinking.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
To what I'm saying, I'd rather you just get to it.
And I don't think there's anything wrong with a transactional conversation.
Like you know, if you have something to offer me
and you think that I'm a person that can help
you execute something, bring it to the table. That's intentional conversation.
Speaker 3 (11:21):
Now here's the thing that may work in your professional world.
It may not work in your personal life though, because communication.
Listen to understand communication will be the key to your
professional and your personal life. That may be okay for
your business relationship, but not every personal relationship. Not somebody
that's just trying to build a genuine friendship with You
don't want it to feel transaction.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
That's what you're trying to do. You're trying to build
a personal relationship with lawn.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Well, for me, my success comes when I'm building a
relationship with a person where we have some type of friendship.
If we have some type of some kind of friendship,
like we don't have to talk at five o'clock in
the morning, but we have some type of action, some
type of friendship, it's a higher ratio that we can
do great business together.
Speaker 4 (12:06):
I think people there are some people that would argue
against that though, because I mean I think too. It's
kind of like the background that you have, like knowing
the type of like music and era that you come from.
You value that, but a lot of people don't have
values today. So it's like I don't want to be
your friend. If we're gonna do business, will do it,
and then we determine what that looks like after.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
I won't say this though. The one thing for people
listening to me, Harry O is like Steve stout right,
And when I say like Steve stout that might.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Not be a good thing for some people.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
No, well, let me tell you, I'm go politest I made.
He connects businesses to people to talent. So for instance, okay,
he had a one of his clients was East New York,
which was a show that was on out of Channel
nine or whatever it was, uh, And he called me
one day and was like, I have a part for
(12:51):
you in this in this show. I'm like, bro, I'm
not acting. I'm taken acting lessons a long time. He
was like, nah, I really want you to read the
script and try it right. And I'm like, because of
our relationship, I was like, no, let me give it
a shot. And when I did it, it went well.
They loved me. They wanted to bring me back for
more episodes. But what impressed me more was, you know,
I know Harrio from a street rapper, like from the Bronx,
(13:14):
like gangster rapper, so but to see him being a
guy that's in the middle of East New York and
me we're in the trailer, but he's teaching a class
in the middle of me shooting on as a professor.
And I'm like, this is amazing because you see how
people evolve, you know what I mean, And a lot
of people don't evolve, a lot of people still want
to be the toughest, hardest rapper at you know whatever agent.
(13:35):
It just doesn't make sense. And I appreciated that. I'm like,
because he revolved. But that relationship, like you said, was
the reason why I trusted you to try East New York. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Absolutely, And to Laurren's point, listen, Yeah, when we discussing
communication Shaul and everyone, it's all theoretical, like what I'm
saying may not work with you or resonate with you.
It just happens that it resonates with me, and it's
been proven to be successful for me. And like I said,
I'm glad he like mentioned that because he is a
testament to what I'm saying. As far as how we
(14:03):
build this relationship where it's trust, I call him and say, Vy,
I'm gonna put you on TV. Is a network. We're
doing this cop show, wants you to act in it?
All right? Cool? After we discussed whatever the logistics are,
he doesn't even have to think anymore because you're like,
you know what, I trust Harry, Yo. But we built
our relationship to that point and I was intentional about that.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Yeah, I give you saying like the established a real connection.
I think the established a real connection has to be
some form of real communication.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
Yes, absolutely absolutely, And I think guard too depends on
because like there are certain times where like if people
approach me to do certain things and they say that
they've worked with Charlamage or Envy, I'll call them and say, hey,
do you know this person?
Speaker 3 (14:41):
Like is it?
Speaker 4 (14:42):
Because nowadays too, because you turned to this chapter or
page in your book you talk about like the influencer.
You talk about like media being the beauty and then
the beast being society because of the way that things
are distorted or like shown online. With people in business,
you never know what's real and what's faked. So it's
like you got to kind of like hold up what
you want before you even be like, let me allow
(15:03):
you to enter what I've worked on.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Right, absolutely, And for me, it is building your reputation.
I'm not sure if you heard the saying people meet
your reputation before.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
They meet you.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
Yeah, right, your reputation. My reputation is in this room
before I walked in. That's the only reason I was
able to get it. So I know, building my reputation,
that's a form of knowing how I connect with myself,
knowing how I see me and how what I project
for others to see. And if my reputation is solid,
people will vouch for it, so yes, absolutely, and he
(15:33):
represent me. I mentioned media and manipulation in the book
as well, which is really really important. And if I
have some time, can I touch on it all right?
Because in the book I mentioned I brought up Shine
in the book and the shooting that happened X amount
of years ago, And this is really important that I
don't want to seem as like I'm poking a hole
(15:56):
at Shine or picking at wounds anything like that. Now,
Sean was arrested for what, Like, what did he get
arrested for? What did you do? So it was.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
Assault or something man shooting a gun and illegal fire.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
That's when somebody else to say, that's all okay.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
That's why I believe it thiss George and illegal fire?
All right?
Speaker 3 (16:16):
So what happened? Meaning what led him to do that?
And it's not only that Sean that has these issues
or that had these issues a young a lot of
young people in our hip hop culture had these issues. Now,
let me connect it to media, manipulation and representation. Media,
how we describe it is any way you receive information,
(16:38):
any way you receive thoughts, right, So it could be
the movies you watch, it could be the music you're
listening to. So if you are young and you not
understand exactly who you are yet, you're not connecting with yourself.
But every time you see you, it's in the wire,
it's on these shows, of these criminal shows. All the
(16:59):
music you're listening to is telling you who you are.
You have to be this, you have to be that.
All of these images in media creates a distorted image
of who you supposed to be. But that distorted image
can cause a real life consequence for you. So when
I look at somebody like Sean and others, and I
can recall, like Sean saying the reason why I brought
(17:20):
it up, I was there, like I was there for
this whole thing. I remember Sean saying to someone, I'm
not gonna mention the person's name, but he said, I
need people to see me and respect me the way
they respect jay Z. Right, And it's like, all right,
but what you know of jay.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
Z is, yeah, you don't get different busting your gun.
Speaker 3 (17:40):
But something manipulated him to feel that way, right to
do that. But it's all about what he's singing in
the media and the music you're listening to and the
TV show you're watching all of this is polluting how
you feel about you and who you think you have
to be.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
I have to be this. I need you.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
No, I'm not Rick Ross, the uh the officer. I'm Ross.
I need you to see me like that. But all
of that is manipulating you. And if you're not understanding
who you are, it's going to cause a real life
consequence for you. And that's what happened with Sean. So
like when I look at you, right, this is a
brown girl grinding right. It's important that I brought my
(18:19):
daughter here today to see what we see in this box.
What we see this is a beautiful brown sister who
bullied her way onto the show, who's making noise, making moves,
she's covering the Diddy trial, and she's killing the outfits
are crazy, crazy, crazy in a good way crazy. So no,
(18:48):
and as we're viewing her in media, we're looking at her.
This image is important because a brown girl is watching
and seeing that and that reality is something that she
can obtain and it's something that's authentic. Outside of that,
it can cause a disruption if you understand what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
So now I got to ask you with murder ink
for a long time. How was the passing of Earth
have affected you? Because you know Irv in and outs,
and we've had conversations about it and conversations about his health.
So how has that affected you?
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Well? The passion of Earth is still like in disbelief,
right when I'm talking about Irv or you know, up
in conversation to say, all right, rest in peace Earth God, Like,
it's really weird still now, the passion of him. I
see how it affects me and everyone around, Like I
am very very very close with Jah, right, and Irv
(19:43):
and I were really cool, but I'm closer with Jah.
It affects me because in this way, no one may
not know this outside of his family. Earth is such
a family family man, right. I have never seen a
family as close as his in my life. I've never
seen it so. And he was like the hero of
(20:06):
the family. And for no disrespect to anyone else in
the family that's doing great things, but he was like
a hero. And so for the hero to pass, and
see how that affects the family dynamic, it made me
how it affects me may become closer with my family,
like Irv is the type where listen if it was holidays.
(20:27):
His house is packed with the whole family, not just
him and the kids. It's nieces, it's nephews, his aunts
and uncles. It's like thirty people running around his house.
And it was just a loving, loving, loving family. Lot
of people didn't see that side of them. You see
murder inc. You see the music, or you see the
problems with the city sent or whatever, so on and
so forth. But the guy was an amazing family man
(20:50):
and to watch that and as a father, yeah, it
affects me. I want to be closer with my family
the way IRV is with his family. So that's how
I would say to.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
Fame, you know what's in est when you talk about
the art of communication, like, I like the way of communicated.
It may have rubbed some people the wrong way, but
I like it because it's direct. Like when we talked
about how you know, it was intentional. He wasn't a
small talker. It was this is what we're doing, this
is how we're doing it, this is how I think
it should go.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Right. I like that, No, listen, absolutely, it's something to
be admired there. Everyone has different strategies on how they communicate.
IRV being direct may work for him with certain people,
but I'm quite sure it didn't work whatever, it didn't
work with everyone, right, But so it all depends on
(21:37):
what your style is. And I was thinking about something. Yeah,
some people don't like small talk, and that's fine. Like
in the book, I mentioned a term called farming and hunting.
Those are different ways of nurture and a relationship. When
we're cutting the small talk out with I'm hunting. I
know exactly what I want, I know what you have.
We know we can make that work. But every relation
(21:57):
doesn't work like that. Sometimes we have to find we
have to plant seeds. I don't know where the relationship
may go, but I know we can possibly build. So
I'm a plant seeds. Then we just water the seeds,
water the seeds, and next thing you know, we're eating
off the fruit from the seeds. And it's really important. Yes,
I'm an entertainment executive. So all we're talking about is
(22:19):
how these theories affect in business. It's in your personal
life as well. If a young man is trying to
get to know a young lady or vice versa. Is
ways you go about that. You have to be intentional,
you have to be strategic. Yes, what is your goal
by dating this woman? That's transaction. Cut the small talk
doesn't work like that in your personal life, right, you
(22:40):
have to farm. Your daughter is seeing someone, they're not engaging.
Nohing like that.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
No, I'm sorry, he's twenty.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
Three, right, But that young gentleman, he had to farm
the relationship with Madison, he had to farm. It wasn't
a transaction to a hunting relationship. It doesn't work like that.
He had to be intentional, farm, plant seeds, whatever those
seeds are, check up on it. No, her birthday, No,
her dad's birthday, so on and so forth. So farming
and hunting are two different ways of building a relationship.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
And you talk about the diher between interpersonal and interperson.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Oh yes, So the first form of communication, the most
important form is your intra personal I n tr A.
That's the conversation within how you see yourself? How do
you connect with yourself? What do you think about yourself?
How do you evaluate yourself? If you can't evaluate, if
(23:37):
you don't possess ability to self evaluate, then you got
to disconnect with you. So everything how I feel and
think about me, that's my intra will depict my inter
my interpersonal relationship. So you know, Charlemagne, you say something
that hurt people. Hurt people, you say that a lot. Right,
It's something internally that's got to disconnect. Since they're at
(24:00):
a disconnect internally, they're at a disconnect externally with others.
So when you understand who you are in your intra
and you've reached the highest level of who that person is,
you understand who you are, you understand what you can do,
and I understand how to connect. I can connect with
others better because I connect with myself at a certain level.
(24:22):
So intra depicts how your inter will turn out.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
You also talk about in your book hip hop and
how it shaped you as a man, both good and bad.
How does that speak to your communication?
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Wow?
Speaker 1 (24:36):
All right?
Speaker 3 (24:36):
So yes, hip hop aiding me on the path to
self actualization of being the man who I am today.
And I mentioned this in the book and I'm gonna
get the gentleman credit where I heard the term, And
I tell you, yes, hip hop got me on this path.
But I have to have accountability and understand that also
some of that content in the music could have caused
(24:57):
a self destruction, some form of self instruction, like some
of the artists were you know? I was mentioning in
the book I mentioned, are we the heroes? Are all
we the villains? And I heard this term through a pod.
Know it's a ted talk by the guy of Crete
and you're gonna make a documentary about it. Suit to him, Yes,
salute to him. So I want to give him his credit.
(25:17):
He mentioned hip hop? Are we the heroes or are
we the villains? Are we? The reason why I mentioned this, Yes,
I'm a child of hip hop. I have the credit
hip hop for being taking me where I am. But
also there's things in the music that's villain like that
can cause you on the wrong destruction, wrong path. We
glorify the person that's coming home from jail before we
(25:38):
glorify the person that's going away to college. Right, We
do a lot of that in this music. So are
we the heroes? Are all we the villains? Now? What's
the difference between the hero and the villain. A hero
has the same attributes as a villain, But a hero
becomes a person becomes a villain through trauma. Some type
of trauma can make you become a villain. You look
(25:58):
at anything and non thine of fiction. Batman, his parents
got killed and he became this if you can the
joke or something happened. He became a villain for these reasons.
What term hip hop music villain like? The crack epidemic?
The crack epidemic, as far as in my theory in
this documentary with shooting, the crack epidemic shaped and destroyed
(26:21):
hip hop music into the way where it turned into
more villain like and the music and the content that's
in it. So are we the heroes? Are are we the villains?
I understand that hip hop made me a hero, but
I also understand some of it could have made me
a villain as well.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
In my last book, Get On as a Die Line
Watch Small Talk Sucks, I have a whole chapter with
basically the same thing. I'm just exploring hip hop's ability
to be a positive and self destructive force. Listen literally,
like I think that if you come, if you're a
certain age, at some point we got to have some accountability.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
At some point. I'm glad we feel the same way
because that's at some point you have to have accountability.
I'm never disrespecting my hip hop music. It made me
who I am, But yes, there are images, it's things
that we put up on a pedestal. If we don't
have accountability, we are causing poison if we don't know
(27:18):
how to steer that ship in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
But is it also how it's cultivated? Right? And the
reason I say that is if I put a gun
on the table and you use a gun, that could
be a negative thing. But if I teach somebody how
to use the gun the proper way, in the right way,
and what to use it for, it's a positive thing.
Same thing with hip hop, right, yes, hip hop. All
those images we've all seen, all seen. But my parents,
(27:42):
especially my dad, cultivated me to look at things a
certain way. I never sold crack, I never sold drugs
and I never used cocal crack or nothing like that
because my dad cultivated to me to like, no, this
is what this is for. These are messages from here.
But that's not You don't make that you you know
what I'm saying, So it's not different. Second, it's all
about side with your daughter. Your daughter dances, she listens
(28:03):
to hip hop music, and I'm sure she might dance
to some stuff that's a little salacious, but you tell
her this is cool for this, But that's not.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
You listen and there's a job. Like you just said,
your dad, Your dad was dead. Like I always say,
you know how you take a kid bowling, and they
got to put the barriers up so the ball can
go down. That's what parents are, right.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
We are the.
Speaker 3 (28:22):
Barriers and we need both. We need both because you
have one parent and that ball could still gut her
that way, right, we are the barriers to keep the
kids going forward. So your dad was that to let
you know, like, yeah, this is what the world is,
but that's not what's good for you. Listen, there were times, Yeah,
my daughter dances, he dances to hip hop, and she's
not gonna remember this. We're getting the car and I
(28:42):
wouldn't play no hip hop in the car at all,
none whatsoever. When she was younger, when she was maybe four,
five six. It's not going to be certain shows on TV.
No disrespect to any of the shows, but certain shows,
excuse me, certain shows wouldn't be on television because I'm
trying to shape her mind to see a certain way.
Now we can listen to certain music because I see
(29:05):
that the barriers are working.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
I see who this young lady is.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
So yeah, we could listen to hip hop, and I
would rather have listened to you know, Drake than over
some other artists. But yeah, we have to be those
barriers because in hip hop we could be the heroes.
H we could be the villains.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
That is a fact, Seductive Communication. You leave that chapter
blank in the book. Why it just says to be continued.
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Right, So when I first wrote the book, I wrote
the book in twenty twenty during the pandemic, when I
started now as a college professor, there's different chapters in
the book, right, So I'm going to answer your question quickly.
We start off with intra personal communication, the conversation within.
So if I'm teaching the class and it's the first
day at the semester, and I say, all right, Charlae,
(29:49):
welcome to my class. Did you take any communication courses
before mine? And you may say, uh, yeah, I took
a leadership in communication class. I'm like that was your
first communication class. Communication should be taught with prerequisites in
a certain order, right, So the first order is intra.
Then I go into inter Then I speak about culture
and communication. I speak about media and communication, power and leadership.
(30:14):
I'm taking you on a journey. Seductive communication is sort
of like the final level of the book on how
you use seduction to communicate and not seduction in the
sense of a sexual form, just knowing how to seduce
someone's mind to navigate in a certain way. And the
reason why I left it blank because I have to
(30:35):
be a part two to the book.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Now, come on, I got to be a part two
to the book now as a professor, right, you know,
I look at college courses as sometimes outdated. Yes, right,
And that bothers me a lot, especially with my kids,
you know, going to college because a lot of things
that they want to learn or that they're into a
lot of times these colleges don't necessarily teach, right. My
first major was communications. I left communications, who went to
(30:58):
business management and marketing. But for me, what I wanted
to learn from communications wasn't helping me with what I
wanted to do, right. Communications was a lot of reading,
a lot of interro a lot of this, a lot
of that. But I wanted to be hands on this
stuff like that. So talk about some of the courses
that you think should be in college and some of
the things that should be taken out of college.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Right, that's great, because I.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Have no disrespect a lot of the algorithms that I
learned in college I don't use.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I've never used. And if I have to, I have
a computer that will do absolutely. Now it's two parts
I want to get into. Now. Some of the courses
out in college, I have to be really careful because
I'm still a college professor and I don't want the
college to be listening right now. So I do believe
there should be more entrepreneur courses in college. We're going
(31:44):
to need AI courses in college. We're going to need
real estate courses in college. You're gonna need these things
in colleges now. I believe certain colleges are doing it.
Jar Rul's son shout out to Jordi. He just graduated
from SCAD in Atlanta, Savannah, I'm sorry, Savannah, and he
was home for his sister's wedding and we were in
(32:06):
the kitchen at Jo's house and he was saying, how
all these different courses that he's taking that gut that
it was never available to me as a student. So
some of the courses that we're talking about, like we've
been out, we've been removed from college for a little bit.
Some of these colleges are doing that like teaching him
how to cold. He can build games, he can do
all the things that I would never even.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
Throw it up.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
My daughter has been talking about.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
She like, that's what.
Speaker 3 (32:29):
But like even when John talks, He's like, listen, I've
visited campus, and I'm like, I've never seen a school
like this. So yeah, I do think we need those
particular courses. Now, let me just rewind as far as
like a communication course I mentioned in the book, I
credit Eddie Murphy to where to one of the reasons
I'm here today. In the movie Boomerang, Like Boomerang is
(32:50):
one of my favorite movies, it seemed like he was
a marketing executive. He garners so much attention for woman.
He was smart, he was he was everything. I'm watching
this and this goes back to my repensation. I'm watching
this movie, I'm like, I want to I want to
do that. I want to know how to do that.
So I was in college at the time. So I
went to my counselor. I said, listen, in this movie,
(33:12):
this guy Eddie Murphy play Marcus Grant, He's a marketing executive.
How do I get into marketing? She said, well, you
need to understand what communication is to understand what marketing is,
I said, well, Samnia for all communication courses. X amount
of years later, I'm doing marketing strategies for my own company,
so I needed that course. I needed these courses to
(33:33):
be able to do what I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Now, gotcha, Well tell him where they could get this book.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
Brother, You can get the book on Amazon. Right, if
you're listening, you could just type in Harold wilkersons to
be typing HARRYO. Nothing's going to come up. People always
make that mistake too, but that's a different story. Yeah,
but you can get the book on Amazon and a
(33:59):
search engine just putting It's beyond Words by Harold Wilkerson
and then to pop up. So please get the book
and one of the lessons I want you to understand
and learn to leave it off. I close deals with
the WNBA and I close deals with the NBA for
going over six six or seven seasons now. And it
all started for me attending one basketball game. I attended
(34:21):
a game, and it went from the person who handed
me my ticket to go sit on the floor, and
through strategic and intentional communication, I started closing deals with
the CEO of the New York Liberty, the CEO of
the Brooklyn Nets. Like it went from attending like how
do you attend a game? And then fast forward you
(34:43):
closing deals with the owners and CEOs of wnbas and
nbas and you hear all that and you pick up
the book.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
All right, Harry, Old ladies and gentlemen, pick up the book.
It's beyond words available.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
Now.
Speaker 1 (34:55):
Appreciate you, brother, Thank you.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
Do I get like the whole thing when they'd be like, Yo, tomorrow,
I'm gonna you on the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Can we close out the show first? I'm sorry, it's
Harry Yo. It's the Breakfast Club. Good morning. Wake that
ass up in the morning. The Breakfast clubm
Wake that ass up in the morning. The Breakfast Club Morning,
Everybody's DJ Envy just hilarious. Charlamagne the God we are
the Breakfast Club Lawn. La Rosa is here as well.
And we got a special guest in the building. We
got the good brother Harold Wilkerson. Anybody gonna know who
that is?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Harry Old.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Ladies and gentlemen, what's up, brother?
Speaker 3 (00:21):
What's going on? What's going on? Everyone? Thank you for
having me? L L Lauren?
Speaker 1 (00:25):
What's up?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
HARRYO? Got a new book called It's Beyond Words, which
is out right now.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
And you talk, you're talking about.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
The art of calculated communication.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Yes, what is that?
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Great question? So the art of calculated communication? Let me
just rewind a little bit for the room who may
not know or those who don't know in the room
that besides an entertainment executive, I'm also a college professor
and I've been teaching communication courses for maybe twelve to
thirteen years.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
You know that if you're gonna go that far, let's
go all the way back there. You know, HARRYO. It
was started off as a rapper. Yes, that's originally know HARRYO.
He's from high Bridge, He's from the Bronx he s
throught up as a rapper from and it was signed
to the Ink. Yes, signed to the Ink. You was
a hype man for Jo Roll for many years and
then you stop rapping and now break it that. Well,
(01:13):
first of all, how did you meet IRV and everybody
and go through that whole list of things?
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Great question, So let me rewind, right, So first I
started entertainment business. I had a deal with Uptown Records
first with Andre Hrrell and everyone over there. God bless
it that level favorite favorite, right best for R and
B music, all right, So I was maybe like in
eighth grade, so that came went. Then I was working
with Puff for a while. Whoa, oh that bad boy. Yeah, listen,
(01:38):
I know my guy's going through a lot. But I
got to give him a lot of credit for helping
me of where I'm at today. Like I have to
give him his credit because I probably wouldn't be here
without the image of him.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Right, Well, we can't take away what he did professionally.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Professionally and what he and what he did for me
in my life. Person He did a lot for me
and and I you know, tell you about it if
I have time, Like he stuck up for me plenty
of times when executives tried to blackball me and things
like that. Puff found out about it, step in like you, now,
you're not doing that to my guy. So I got
to give him this credit. So from there we transition quick.
I had to deal with Motown, they had to deal
with murder inc Right.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
How many deals do you have?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
About four deals starting at eighth grade? Starting in eighth grade,
started in the eighth grade. Like, I've been doing entertainment
for a long time. So now fast forward. Let me
just tell you as far as me and Ja, I
met Ja on the set of a movie called Turn
It Up. Right, You're not gonna remember me in the
movie because they edited me out through movie.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
You're not gonna remember me.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
But you if you look at the credits, you'll see
me in the credits or whatever. So the movie was
shot in Canada, So we traveled to Canada. Right, I'm
there with my manager. We're trying to get into Canada.
My manager at the time, he gets arrested for some reason.
He can't get into Canada. You know how that goes.
So now I'm just I'm young. I'm in Canada about
to shoot this movie. I'm by myself. I'm a little nervous.
(02:56):
So my trailer is right next to Jo's trailer. But
I would always see Ja in the Violator office because
we was working with a violator death Jam. But we
never really, you know, knew each other. We saw each other,
we passed. So I'm in a trailer. He knocks on
my trailer door, so I opened up. He goes, yo,
you signed a death Jam, you signed a violator. I'm like, nah,
my god, my song this, and we're doing work over there.
He goes, man, I hear you here by yourself and
(03:17):
your manager got arrested. Listen, anything you need, come to
my trailer. If you need weed, if you need hennessy,
if you need anything. Joe has been trying to get
me high since I met him, Right, yeah, I don't
do any of that. So from there, John and I
had a connection. That was his first album, like right
before his first album came out. After this album came out,
he blew up and took off, and you know, my
(03:39):
career was going wherever it was going. But anytime we
would see each other, it would like we would stop
everything and give each other love. And then I met
Chris Gotti, Irv's brother, somewhere in the club and he
knew I did music. He said, listen, won't you come
down to the studio. Went to the studio. So I
recording records with IRV, records with Ashanti records with Joe. Next,
(04:00):
you know, a brotherhood form where although me and Joh
came in through entertainment, that's more my brother like that,
that's my guy. And on I said before my company
chased Republic, we serve as like an independent agency form.
We close a lot of different deals like I do
with you. I and we'll talked about made a lot
of money together. But more importantly, that's that's my brother,
that's my guy.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
So now so now you get out of music, and
music never takes off. I see.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
You can look at it that way, right, you tell me, well,
I had the transition. I always say this, right, somebody
can ask you, like, how do you view success? Right,
So in your eyes you may say Harry Yo as
an artist wasn't successful, and that's fine. You can see
it that way. I don't view it that way. I
view it as I came into the entertainment business in
(04:47):
eighth grade. I made a life out of it. I'm
sitting here doing an interview on a breakfast club, not
a rapper.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
I'm not always doing you as an executive. Like that's
how I always looked at Harry as an executive. I
never even knew anything about.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Like being a DJ. Yeah, there's been plenty of times
where like I would have to wait for E outside
of the radio station, try to get music played, like
we have that relationship you and I met later on
in life as being an entertainment. Exact the same thing
with Lauren, like you and I met. First conversation I
have with you, it says, Listen could probably make some
money with you, right, Yeah, and that's how it went.
(05:22):
But he just knows a little bit of the backstory.
But yeah, so it all depends on how you want
to look at it as far as you're not being successful.
But I made a life for it, my dad, Listen,
I paid her tuition. That's entertainment. Do you understand her
private school tuition, which we all know is very expensive?
All through entertainment. So someone asks, hey, you weren't successful,
(05:43):
I don't know. I wouldn't say that. I say I
think them pretty well.
Speaker 4 (05:45):
Are you probably about to ask this, Well, then I'm
interested in know so from the artist's perspective, then you
transition into the executive side because of the relationships.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
And what is that transition because.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
You started at eight, an executive is an adult making
real doark decisions.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Right, Well, it's two folds to it, right. As I said,
I've been a college professor teaching communication courses. Now with
communication to understand the art of connecting with others, we're
first connecting with yourself. And what we were talking about.
Once I understood and fully came of who I am,
a higher sense of awareness of me, I understood my abilities.
(06:18):
I understood how I can build relationships. So I just
started to build and form credible relationships with people, building trust,
but in a strategic way, not in a manipulative way,
just very strategic and like I can talk a lot
about me and MV because MB and I made some
money together and our relationship build, and I was intentional
on how we're building our relationship. So what I did
(06:40):
is I just merged the world between entertainment and education
and made a life.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
So what is the art of calculator communication? And how
has that helped you? Okay, got to get through all
those different worlds.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
So the art of calculator communication and to make it sure.
Because you can talk about this all day. But what
I would do is this, right, say with Lauren, for instance,
right I met Lauren at the Brooklyn Nets event. Now
you said, hey, Lauren's on her way here, can you
send somebody to get it in Immediately, I'm like, all right,
I know who she is. I absolutely know that we
(07:13):
can probably do business with her.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Lauren was two hours late, by.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
The way, I wasn't gonna say, is like driving to
another planning and it was raining, but I will pull
up for y'all later or not.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
We had an event in the Barclay Center for the
Brooklyn Nets, which are one of my partners, and I
hire you to do different events. So he while we're there,
he's like, listen, Lauren's on the way, can you send
somebody to get it. You know how difficult it is
to get someone inside the Barclay Center when it's closed,
like it's really closed at this point. But I understand
I have to be a little bit strategic. I want
(07:47):
to build a relationship with this young lady possibly do business.
So we sent an executive to go outside and figure
it out to get her in now as she's in.
I understand it takes more than one encounter for us
to start building some type of relationship, but we have
to have that first encounter. It have to be a
genuine encounter. It has to be maybe someone can help
(08:08):
build that bridge between you and I, and I use June.
June em he's manager. Whoever's listening. I said, June, ju
me in favor, let her know, stamp me right, let
her know. So June went to you and said, Hey, Harry, yo,
this is my guy. That's all I needed to start
building some type of communication with you. Now, to make
it a little bit shorter. In order for Lauren and
(08:29):
I to build a relationship, I have to get her
to peel back hilarious. I have to try to get
to know her. The closer I get to her, the
more of a chance I have of doing great business
with her. I just can't pick up the phone and say, hey,
I have a bunch of deals for you. She doesn't
even know who I am. Yeah, we have to build trust.
So I have to get her to pill back layers.
I have to ask her questions. But if she never responds,
(08:50):
like say, if I say, hey, as simple as this, Laurna,
how was your day today?
Speaker 4 (08:54):
Great so far besides dealing with Charlamagne.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
But other than that, I'm the best part of her
day the other day.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
What are your plans tomorrow?
Speaker 4 (09:02):
We have a flight. We're going to la for the
BT Awards. Me and the team at the Breakfast Club. Wow, well,
not them, but the producers and stuff.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
You have a lot of work at the BT Awards.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
We do the latest with Laurena Rose is in the
radio room for the first time ever for two days.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
Pretty cool. Congratulations, I love that. Now check this out right.
So I would have to work a little bit harder
now with Lauren because although I asked these questions, and
I know we're on air's a lot going on. I
asked her how it was her day, right, and she
said how what they was? She didn't say, how is yours? Too?
Speaker 4 (09:32):
Oh shoot, sorry, so's I'm intating the next question.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
I know I would know it's fine. I'm interested in
knowing about her day, but I want to see how
much interest she's holding in me to know about me
as well, and sooner or later that would come. This
is our made me like our second encounter, But if
I can't get you to have that exchange with me,
I have to work a lot harder and be more
strategic and to get you to communicate with me.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
And if you never do that, it's right.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
This person doesn't have any interest in building with me
in this area.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I think also too in business. I've never had a
business interaction where my first thought is to say, how
is your Like most people come to you just like so, like,
this is what I want, this is what I need.
So you just kind of sit and listen and then
you try and think through can I even do that
with everything else that have happening.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
That's the problem with communication where I don't want any
communication with anyone to feel transactional. And I'm only using
NBA as example because we made some money they give
me through business. NBA and I have a relationship where
NBA called me at five o'clock in the morning and
we're talking about dance.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
We're not even talking about business, we're talking about dance.
He's like, Yo, do you do this with your daughter?
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Look at these classes? Check this out. How did it
get there?
Speaker 1 (10:41):
It got there through.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
Strategic communication and connecting and building. If every time I
seee it's just hey, I got a you got B
sooner or later. If I don't have a anymore, or
I'm in a downside, I can't get either really pick
up my calls because we don't have a connection. If
I'm making sense here.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
You are making sense what I will say, hate small talk, right,
So when I hear that conversation with you and law
and I'm like, Okay, what does he want?
Speaker 1 (11:05):
That's what I was thinking.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
To what I'm saying, I'd rather you just get to it.
And I don't think there's anything wrong with a transactional conversation.
Like you know, if you have something to offer me
and you think that I'm a person that can help
you execute something, bring it to the table. That's intentional conversation.
Speaker 3 (11:21):
Now here's the thing that may work in your professional world.
It may not work in your personal life though, because communication.
Listen to understand communication will be the key to your
professional and your personal life. That may be okay for
your business relationship, but not every personal relationship. Not somebody
that's just trying to build a genuine friendship with You
don't want it to feel transaction.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
That's what you're trying to do. You're trying to build
a personal relationship with lawn.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Well, for me, my success comes when I'm building a
relationship with a person where we have some type of friendship.
If we have some type of some kind of friendship,
like we don't have to talk at five o'clock in
the morning, but we have some type of action, some
type of friendship, it's a higher ratio that we can
do great business together.
Speaker 4 (12:06):
I think people there are some people that would argue
against that though, because I mean I think too. It's
kind of like the background that you have, like knowing
the type of like music and era that you come from.
You value that, but a lot of people don't have
values today. So it's like I don't want to be
your friend. If we're gonna do business, will do it,
and then we determine what that looks like after.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
I won't say this though. The one thing for people
listening to me, Harry O is like Steve stout right,
And when I say like Steve stout that might.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Not be a good thing for some people.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
No, well, let me tell you, I'm go politest I made.
He connects businesses to people to talent. So for instance, okay,
he had a one of his clients was East New York,
which was a show that was on out of Channel
nine or whatever it was, uh, And he called me
one day and was like, I have a part for
(12:51):
you in this in this show. I'm like, bro, I'm
not acting. I'm taken acting lessons a long time. He
was like, nah, I really want you to read the
script and try it right. And I'm like, because of
our relationship, I was like, no, let me give it
a shot. And when I did it, it went well.
They loved me. They wanted to bring me back for
more episodes. But what impressed me more was, you know,
I know Harrio from a street rapper, like from the Bronx,
(13:14):
like gangster rapper, so but to see him being a
guy that's in the middle of East New York and
me we're in the trailer, but he's teaching a class
in the middle of me shooting on as a professor.
And I'm like, this is amazing because you see how
people evolve, you know what I mean, And a lot
of people don't evolve, a lot of people still want
to be the toughest, hardest rapper at you know whatever agent.
(13:35):
It just doesn't make sense. And I appreciated that. I'm like,
because he revolved. But that relationship, like you said, was
the reason why I trusted you to try East New York. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Absolutely, And to Laurren's point, listen, Yeah, when we discussing
communication Shaul and everyone, it's all theoretical, like what I'm
saying may not work with you or resonate with you.
It just happens that it resonates with me, and it's
been proven to be successful for me. And like I said,
I'm glad he like mentioned that because he is a
testament to what I'm saying. As far as how we
(14:03):
build this relationship where it's trust, I call him and say, Vy,
I'm gonna put you on TV. Is a network. We're
doing this cop show, wants you to act in it?
All right? Cool? After we discussed whatever the logistics are,
he doesn't even have to think anymore because you're like,
you know what, I trust Harry, Yo. But we built
our relationship to that point and I was intentional about that.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Yeah, I give you saying like the established a real connection.
I think the established a real connection has to be
some form of real communication.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
Yes, absolutely absolutely, And I think guard too depends on
because like there are certain times where like if people
approach me to do certain things and they say that
they've worked with Charlamage or Envy, I'll call them and say, hey,
do you know this person?
Speaker 3 (14:41):
Like is it?
Speaker 4 (14:42):
Because nowadays too, because you turned to this chapter or
page in your book you talk about like the influencer.
You talk about like media being the beauty and then
the beast being society because of the way that things
are distorted or like shown online. With people in business,
you never know what's real and what's faked. So it's
like you got to kind of like hold up what
you want before you even be like, let me allow
(15:03):
you to enter what I've worked on.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Right, absolutely, And for me, it is building your reputation.
I'm not sure if you heard the saying people meet
your reputation before.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
They meet you.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
Yeah, right, your reputation. My reputation is in this room
before I walked in. That's the only reason I was
able to get it. So I know, building my reputation,
that's a form of knowing how I connect with myself,
knowing how I see me and how what I project
for others to see. And if my reputation is solid,
people will vouch for it, so yes, absolutely, and he
(15:33):
represent me. I mentioned media and manipulation in the book
as well, which is really really important. And if I
have some time, can I touch on it all right?
Because in the book I mentioned I brought up Shine
in the book and the shooting that happened X amount
of years ago, And this is really important that I
don't want to seem as like I'm poking a hole
(15:56):
at Shine or picking at wounds anything like that. Now,
Sean was arrested for what, Like, what did he get
arrested for? What did you do? So it was.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
Assault or something man shooting a gun and illegal fire.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
That's when somebody else to say, that's all okay.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
That's why I believe it thiss George and illegal fire?
All right?
Speaker 3 (16:16):
So what happened? Meaning what led him to do that?
And it's not only that Sean that has these issues
or that had these issues a young a lot of
young people in our hip hop culture had these issues. Now,
let me connect it to media, manipulation and representation. Media,
how we describe it is any way you receive information,
(16:38):
any way you receive thoughts, right, So it could be
the movies you watch, it could be the music you're
listening to. So if you are young and you not
understand exactly who you are yet, you're not connecting with yourself.
But every time you see you, it's in the wire,
it's on these shows, of these criminal shows. All the
(16:59):
music you're listening to is telling you who you are.
You have to be this, you have to be that.
All of these images in media creates a distorted image
of who you supposed to be. But that distorted image
can cause a real life consequence for you. So when
I look at somebody like Sean and others, and I
can recall, like Sean saying the reason why I brought
(17:20):
it up, I was there, like I was there for
this whole thing. I remember Sean saying to someone, I'm
not gonna mention the person's name, but he said, I
need people to see me and respect me the way
they respect jay Z. Right, And it's like, all right,
but what you know of jay.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
Z is, yeah, you don't get different busting your gun.
Speaker 3 (17:40):
But something manipulated him to feel that way, right to
do that. But it's all about what he's singing in
the media and the music you're listening to and the
TV show you're watching all of this is polluting how
you feel about you and who you think you have
to be.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
I have to be this. I need you.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
No, I'm not Rick Ross, the uh the officer. I'm Ross.
I need you to see me like that. But all
of that is manipulating you. And if you're not understanding
who you are, it's going to cause a real life
consequence for you. And that's what happened with Sean. So
like when I look at you, right, this is a
brown girl grinding right. It's important that I brought my
(18:19):
daughter here today to see what we see in this box.
What we see this is a beautiful brown sister who
bullied her way onto the show, who's making noise, making moves,
she's covering the Diddy trial, and she's killing the outfits
are crazy, crazy, crazy in a good way crazy. So no,
(18:48):
and as we're viewing her in media, we're looking at her.
This image is important because a brown girl is watching
and seeing that and that reality is something that she
can obtain and it's something that's authentic. Outside of that,
it can cause a disruption if you understand what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
So now I got to ask you with murder ink
for a long time. How was the passing of Earth
have affected you? Because you know Irv in and outs,
and we've had conversations about it and conversations about his health.
So how has that affected you?
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Well? The passion of Earth is still like in disbelief,
right when I'm talking about Irv or you know, up
in conversation to say, all right, rest in peace Earth God, Like,
it's really weird still now, the passion of him. I
see how it affects me and everyone around, Like I
am very very very close with Jah, right, and Irv
(19:43):
and I were really cool, but I'm closer with Jah.
It affects me because in this way, no one may
not know this outside of his family. Earth is such
a family family man, right. I have never seen a
family as close as his in my life. I've never
seen it so. And he was like the hero of
(20:06):
the family. And for no disrespect to anyone else in
the family that's doing great things, but he was like
a hero. And so for the hero to pass, and
see how that affects the family dynamic, it made me
how it affects me may become closer with my family,
like Irv is the type where listen if it was holidays.
(20:27):
His house is packed with the whole family, not just
him and the kids. It's nieces, it's nephews, his aunts
and uncles. It's like thirty people running around his house.
And it was just a loving, loving, loving family. Lot
of people didn't see that side of them. You see
murder inc. You see the music, or you see the
problems with the city sent or whatever, so on and
so forth. But the guy was an amazing family man
(20:50):
and to watch that and as a father, yeah, it
affects me. I want to be closer with my family
the way IRV is with his family. So that's how
I would say to.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
Fame, you know what's in est when you talk about
the art of communication, like, I like the way of communicated.
It may have rubbed some people the wrong way, but
I like it because it's direct. Like when we talked
about how you know, it was intentional. He wasn't a
small talker. It was this is what we're doing, this
is how we're doing it, this is how I think
it should go.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Right. I like that, No, listen, absolutely, it's something to
be admired there. Everyone has different strategies on how they communicate.
IRV being direct may work for him with certain people,
but I'm quite sure it didn't work whatever, it didn't
work with everyone, right, But so it all depends on
(21:37):
what your style is. And I was thinking about something. Yeah,
some people don't like small talk, and that's fine. Like
in the book, I mentioned a term called farming and hunting.
Those are different ways of nurture and a relationship. When
we're cutting the small talk out with I'm hunting. I
know exactly what I want, I know what you have.
We know we can make that work. But every relation
(21:57):
doesn't work like that. Sometimes we have to find we
have to plant seeds. I don't know where the relationship
may go, but I know we can possibly build. So
I'm a plant seeds. Then we just water the seeds,
water the seeds, and next thing you know, we're eating
off the fruit from the seeds. And it's really important. Yes,
I'm an entertainment executive. So all we're talking about is
(22:19):
how these theories affect in business. It's in your personal
life as well. If a young man is trying to
get to know a young lady or vice versa. Is
ways you go about that. You have to be intentional,
you have to be strategic. Yes, what is your goal
by dating this woman? That's transaction. Cut the small talk
doesn't work like that in your personal life, right, you
(22:40):
have to farm. Your daughter is seeing someone, they're not engaging.
Nohing like that.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
No, I'm sorry, he's twenty.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
Three, right, But that young gentleman, he had to farm
the relationship with Madison, he had to farm. It wasn't
a transaction to a hunting relationship. It doesn't work like that.
He had to be intentional, farm, plant seeds, whatever those
seeds are, check up on it. No, her birthday, No,
her dad's birthday, so on and so forth. So farming
and hunting are two different ways of building a relationship.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
And you talk about the diher between interpersonal and interperson.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Oh yes, So the first form of communication, the most
important form is your intra personal I n tr A.
That's the conversation within how you see yourself? How do
you connect with yourself? What do you think about yourself?
How do you evaluate yourself? If you can't evaluate, if
(23:37):
you don't possess ability to self evaluate, then you got
to disconnect with you. So everything how I feel and
think about me, that's my intra will depict my inter
my interpersonal relationship. So you know, Charlemagne, you say something
that hurt people. Hurt people, you say that a lot. Right,
It's something internally that's got to disconnect. Since they're at
(24:00):
a disconnect internally, they're at a disconnect externally with others.
So when you understand who you are in your intra
and you've reached the highest level of who that person is,
you understand who you are, you understand what you can do,
and I understand how to connect. I can connect with
others better because I connect with myself at a certain level.
(24:22):
So intra depicts how your inter will turn out.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
You also talk about in your book hip hop and
how it shaped you as a man, both good and bad.
How does that speak to your communication?
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Wow?
Speaker 1 (24:36):
All right?
Speaker 3 (24:36):
So yes, hip hop aiding me on the path to
self actualization of being the man who I am today.
And I mentioned this in the book and I'm gonna
get the gentleman credit where I heard the term, And
I tell you, yes, hip hop got me on this path.
But I have to have accountability and understand that also
some of that content in the music could have caused
(24:57):
a self destruction, some form of self instruction, like some
of the artists were you know? I was mentioning in
the book I mentioned, are we the heroes? Are all
we the villains? And I heard this term through a pod.
Know it's a ted talk by the guy of Crete
and you're gonna make a documentary about it. Suit to him, Yes,
salute to him. So I want to give him his credit.
(25:17):
He mentioned hip hop? Are we the heroes or are
we the villains? Are we? The reason why I mentioned this, Yes,
I'm a child of hip hop. I have the credit
hip hop for being taking me where I am. But
also there's things in the music that's villain like that
can cause you on the wrong destruction, wrong path. We
glorify the person that's coming home from jail before we
(25:38):
glorify the person that's going away to college. Right, We
do a lot of that in this music. So are
we the heroes? Are all we the villains? Now? What's
the difference between the hero and the villain. A hero
has the same attributes as a villain, But a hero
becomes a person becomes a villain through trauma. Some type
of trauma can make you become a villain. You look
(25:58):
at anything and non thine of fiction. Batman, his parents
got killed and he became this if you can the
joke or something happened. He became a villain for these reasons.
What term hip hop music villain like? The crack epidemic?
The crack epidemic, as far as in my theory in
this documentary with shooting, the crack epidemic shaped and destroyed
(26:21):
hip hop music into the way where it turned into
more villain like and the music and the content that's
in it. So are we the heroes? Are are we the villains?
I understand that hip hop made me a hero, but
I also understand some of it could have made me
a villain as well.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
In my last book, Get On as a Die Line
Watch Small Talk Sucks, I have a whole chapter with
basically the same thing. I'm just exploring hip hop's ability
to be a positive and self destructive force. Listen literally,
like I think that if you come, if you're a
certain age, at some point we got to have some accountability.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
At some point. I'm glad we feel the same way
because that's at some point you have to have accountability.
I'm never disrespecting my hip hop music. It made me
who I am, But yes, there are images, it's things
that we put up on a pedestal. If we don't
have accountability, we are causing poison if we don't know
(27:18):
how to steer that ship in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
But is it also how it's cultivated? Right? And the
reason I say that is if I put a gun
on the table and you use a gun, that could
be a negative thing. But if I teach somebody how
to use the gun the proper way, in the right way,
and what to use it for, it's a positive thing.
Same thing with hip hop, right, yes, hip hop. All
those images we've all seen, all seen. But my parents,
(27:42):
especially my dad, cultivated me to look at things a
certain way. I never sold crack, I never sold drugs
and I never used cocal crack or nothing like that
because my dad cultivated to me to like, no, this
is what this is for. These are messages from here.
But that's not You don't make that you you know
what I'm saying, So it's not different. Second, it's all
about side with your daughter. Your daughter dances, she listens
(28:03):
to hip hop music, and I'm sure she might dance
to some stuff that's a little salacious, but you tell
her this is cool for this, But that's not.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
You listen and there's a job. Like you just said,
your dad, Your dad was dead. Like I always say,
you know how you take a kid bowling, and they
got to put the barriers up so the ball can
go down. That's what parents are, right.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
We are the.
Speaker 3 (28:22):
Barriers and we need both. We need both because you
have one parent and that ball could still gut her
that way, right, we are the barriers to keep the
kids going forward. So your dad was that to let
you know, like, yeah, this is what the world is,
but that's not what's good for you. Listen, there were times, Yeah,
my daughter dances, he dances to hip hop, and she's
not gonna remember this. We're getting the car and I
(28:42):
wouldn't play no hip hop in the car at all,
none whatsoever. When she was younger, when she was maybe four,
five six. It's not going to be certain shows on TV.
No disrespect to any of the shows, but certain shows,
excuse me, certain shows wouldn't be on television because I'm
trying to shape her mind to see a certain way.
Now we can listen to certain music because I see
(29:05):
that the barriers are working.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
I see who this young lady is.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
So yeah, we could listen to hip hop, and I
would rather have listened to you know, Drake than over
some other artists. But yeah, we have to be those
barriers because in hip hop we could be the heroes.
H we could be the villains.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
That is a fact, Seductive Communication. You leave that chapter
blank in the book. Why it just says to be continued.
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Right, So when I first wrote the book, I wrote
the book in twenty twenty during the pandemic, when I
started now as a college professor, there's different chapters in
the book, right, So I'm going to answer your question quickly.
We start off with intra personal communication, the conversation within.
So if I'm teaching the class and it's the first
day at the semester, and I say, all right, Charlae,
(29:49):
welcome to my class. Did you take any communication courses
before mine? And you may say, uh, yeah, I took
a leadership in communication class. I'm like that was your
first communication class. Communication should be taught with prerequisites in
a certain order, right, So the first order is intra.
Then I go into inter Then I speak about culture
and communication. I speak about media and communication, power and leadership.
(30:14):
I'm taking you on a journey. Seductive communication is sort
of like the final level of the book on how
you use seduction to communicate and not seduction in the
sense of a sexual form, just knowing how to seduce
someone's mind to navigate in a certain way. And the
reason why I left it blank because I have to
(30:35):
be a part two to the book.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Now, come on, I got to be a part two
to the book now as a professor, right, you know,
I look at college courses as sometimes outdated. Yes, right,
And that bothers me a lot, especially with my kids,
you know, going to college because a lot of things
that they want to learn or that they're into a
lot of times these colleges don't necessarily teach, right. My
first major was communications. I left communications, who went to
(30:58):
business management and marketing. But for me, what I wanted
to learn from communications wasn't helping me with what I
wanted to do, right. Communications was a lot of reading,
a lot of interro a lot of this, a lot
of that. But I wanted to be hands on this
stuff like that. So talk about some of the courses
that you think should be in college and some of
the things that should be taken out of college.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Right, that's great, because I.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Have no disrespect a lot of the algorithms that I
learned in college I don't use.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I've never used. And if I have to, I have
a computer that will do absolutely. Now it's two parts
I want to get into. Now. Some of the courses
out in college, I have to be really careful because
I'm still a college professor and I don't want the
college to be listening right now. So I do believe
there should be more entrepreneur courses in college. We're going
(31:44):
to need AI courses in college. We're going to need
real estate courses in college. You're gonna need these things
in colleges now. I believe certain colleges are doing it.
Jar Rul's son shout out to Jordi. He just graduated
from SCAD in Atlanta, Savannah, I'm sorry, Savannah, and he
was home for his sister's wedding and we were in
(32:06):
the kitchen at Jo's house and he was saying, how
all these different courses that he's taking that gut that
it was never available to me as a student. So
some of the courses that we're talking about, like we've
been out, we've been removed from college for a little bit.
Some of these colleges are doing that like teaching him
how to cold. He can build games, he can do
all the things that I would never even.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
Throw it up.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
My daughter has been talking about.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
She like, that's what.
Speaker 3 (32:29):
But like even when John talks, He's like, listen, I've
visited campus, and I'm like, I've never seen a school
like this. So yeah, I do think we need those
particular courses. Now, let me just rewind as far as
like a communication course I mentioned in the book, I
credit Eddie Murphy to where to one of the reasons
I'm here today. In the movie Boomerang, Like Boomerang is
(32:50):
one of my favorite movies, it seemed like he was
a marketing executive. He garners so much attention for woman.
He was smart, he was he was everything. I'm watching
this and this goes back to my repensation. I'm watching
this movie, I'm like, I want to I want to
do that. I want to know how to do that.
So I was in college at the time. So I
went to my counselor. I said, listen, in this movie,
(33:12):
this guy Eddie Murphy play Marcus Grant, He's a marketing executive.
How do I get into marketing? She said, well, you
need to understand what communication is to understand what marketing is,
I said, well, Samnia for all communication courses. X amount
of years later, I'm doing marketing strategies for my own company,
so I needed that course. I needed these courses to
(33:33):
be able to do what I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Now, gotcha, Well tell him where they could get this book.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
Brother, You can get the book on Amazon. Right, if
you're listening, you could just type in Harold wilkersons to
be typing HARRYO. Nothing's going to come up. People always
make that mistake too, but that's a different story. Yeah,
but you can get the book on Amazon and a
(33:59):
search engine just putting It's beyond Words by Harold Wilkerson
and then to pop up. So please get the book
and one of the lessons I want you to understand
and learn to leave it off. I close deals with
the WNBA and I close deals with the NBA for
going over six six or seven seasons now. And it
all started for me attending one basketball game. I attended
(34:21):
a game, and it went from the person who handed
me my ticket to go sit on the floor, and
through strategic and intentional communication, I started closing deals with
the CEO of the New York Liberty, the CEO of
the Brooklyn Nets. Like it went from attending like how
do you attend a game? And then fast forward you
(34:43):
closing deals with the owners and CEOs of wnbas and
nbas and you hear all that and you pick up
the book.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
All right, Harry, Old ladies and gentlemen, pick up the book.
It's beyond words available.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
Now.
Speaker 1 (34:55):
Appreciate you, brother, Thank you.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
Do I get like the whole thing when they'd be like, Yo, tomorrow,
I'm gonna you on the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Can we close out the show first? I'm sorry, it's
Harry Yo. It's the Breakfast Club. Good morning. Wake that
ass up in the morning. The Breakfast clubm
The Breakfast Club News
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