October 29, 2024 • 21 mins
On the next episode of Keeping Ashland Healthy, Dr. Ashley and the Boss talk with Catholic Charities employee and Early Childhood Mental Health Specialist Nicole Mann. Nicole discusses Early Childhood Mental Health’s ins and outs, what organizations she works with in Ashland County, and what outcomes are being achieved. Early Childhood Mental Health is NOT Babies on couches but a natural approach to assisting young children in learning to manage their emotions and equipping parents with skills to ensure their child thrives. Nicole can be reached by calling Catholic Charities at 419-289-1903.
(Record Date: September 30, 2024)
(Record Date: September 30, 2024)
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
You're listening to the Keeping Ashland Healthy Podcast, a podcast
production of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of Ashlin County, Ohio.
Thanks for joining us, and welcome back to another episode
of the Keeping Ashland Healthy Podcast with Doctor Ashley and
the Boss.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Good morning, Boss. How are you?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'm doing well, Doctor Ashley, how are you doing?
Speaker 3 (00:22):
I'm doing well too?
Speaker 4 (00:23):
Thanks?
Speaker 1 (00:23):
All right, well, goody. So I'm pleasant this morning.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I hope the audience can can feel that pleasantness coming
through the microphones. Maybe maybe it's because we have a
special guest.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Yes, I'm really excited about this one today.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Me as well, because we have talked in the past
about early childhood mental health, but we never really unpacked
it to the audience and talked in death because we
didn't have the right person in the studio.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
This is the person.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
This is the person. Her name drum roll please, Yeah,
I don't have that effect. I wish I did.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Is Nicole Man. Nicoleman works over at Catholic Charities UH.
Catholic Charities is four one nine two eight nine one
nine zero three UH. Nicole has worked as an early
childhood mental health consultant for many many years. She's well
known in the community. She is an expert in her field,
and we are excited to talk about what this thing
(01:17):
is that we call early childhood mental health and you're
just the right person. Thank you for being here.
Speaker 5 (01:23):
Nicole, Well, thanks for having me absolutely so again for
our audience. It's it's your first time on the podcast. Uh,
tell us just a little bit about yourself and maybe
what all you had to go through to be an
early childhood mental health consultant.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
Sure, actually it was a journey.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (01:41):
So my background is in mental health. I have my
master's degree in community counseling from the University of Akron.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
That's where I got mine from. That was the best.
Speaker 6 (01:52):
Yeah, And at that time, after graduating from my from
my program, you know, I started to work community mental health.
Like all of us coming out of that program, my
interest was definitely with teenagers and with children. I enjoyed
that work a lot, and what I found was I
(02:15):
kept thinking, Wow, if I just would have met this
child a little bit sooner, a little bit sooner, a
little bit sooner, and pretty soon.
Speaker 4 (02:25):
I was the only person.
Speaker 6 (02:27):
At my agency at that time that would take anybody
under the age of eight, because you know, when we
went to school, they sure didn't teach us anything about
bringing a very young child into the counseling process. So
most of my colleagues just really weren't comfortable at all.
(02:48):
So I was getting a lot of these younger children
trying to figure out how to serve them best in
a counseling setting. And then in twenty sixteen, the state
of Ohio created the Whole Child Matters grant and that program.
(03:08):
Basically the purpose of that was because the state had
done enough research that they were seeing that young children
in preschool settings were being expelled from their centers at
a rate higher than our high school.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
At preschool level.
Speaker 6 (03:25):
At the preschool level, so our three, four and five
year old children were being told that they needed to
leave their centers for behavior because of behavioral concerns. So
the state, and it's great that we live in Ohio
because we are definitely a leader in this area, but
(03:47):
they decided, you know, what we need is someone that
can really work with children and in the environments where
they are so at home and at preschool or daycare. Right,
and they decided that each county in the state needed
someone with this early childhood mental health consultation credential.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
Wow, and that's where it all kind of began.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Wow, that's awesome.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
Yeah, that was awesome.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Well, I mean, I'm glad Ohio was so proactive, you know,
I know years ago. This goes all the way back
to two thousand and three, two thousand and four, when
I first started with the board. I'll never forget. It
was my first or second day on the job and
I came in and I opened up my door and
there were a bunch of puppets in my office. And
(04:38):
even in those early days, Nicole, we were doing some
early childhood mental health and they had received I think
it was through I don't know if it was Devereux work,
but they had all these you know, puppets and dolls
and things, which most people that know me know that
those things freaked me out anyway, so they arranged them
strategically throughout my office to get maximum freak out anyway.
(04:59):
So I didn't know what I had gotten into, Doctor Ashley.
I was like, am I supposed to be working with
these puppets in these dolls? But even back then three four,
Ashley County was pretty progressive and exploring this. And then,
as you say, when whole matters came on. I think
Catholic Charities was a recipient of some of those dollars
that came with that. It was like one of those
(05:19):
regional projects if I recall.
Speaker 6 (05:21):
Right, right, Yes, I worked together with a collaborative that
is our Northeast Ohio collaborative. There are ten counties in
my collaborative, which just gives me an awesome opportunity to
collaborate with other professionals that.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Focus in this area.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
And I maybe we're going you correct me, Nicole, but
I believe that you started at the very beginning, and
you may be one of the very few left from
that original group that started out on that regional grant.
There's a lot of turnover over the years.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
There has been some turnover.
Speaker 6 (05:53):
I'm thinking now, because we just had a meeting last week,
there are three of us.
Speaker 4 (05:59):
I think that we're in.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
That original corgis right.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
Yes, yep, we've been around for a while.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
Okay, so you know, in terms of you know, your
educational experience, it sounds like again like me graduating from
acron It wasn't really a specialty that we received in
our formal training at the master's level, but it's something
that you know, one you had an interest in, so
you started working, but then there was an opportunity through
(06:27):
funding to specialize if you will, or focus.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
And then you just took that. And then did they develop.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
A kind of credential or something for people that really
wanted to focus in on that early childhood mental health space.
Speaker 6 (06:37):
Yes, Yes, there has been a credential developed that really
focuses on that work with children ages six and under
six and it is that Early Childhood Mental Health Consultation Credential.
And there is a lot of training that goes into that,
I think, because when we go to school, that's that's
(06:59):
just not an air that was touched upon. So there's
a lot of training in assessment measures for children of
this age and then just strategies and resources to bring
to parents and teachers to be able to I mean,
what we're really talking about, right, is for parents and
(07:19):
for teachers, yes, to be as prepared as they can
be to handle their child's development and possible behavior concerns
that come up so that they can be that person
then to help that child.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Right, Because that's where I was going with my next question,
Doctor Ashley. You know, when I talk to folks in
the community about early childhood mental health. Immediately, the idea is, David,
are you putting babies on couches? And sometimes I say yes,
just to mess with them, but it is not correct
me if I'm wrong Nicole, But we are not putting
(07:55):
babies on couches. So what does early childhood mental health?
You've already touched on this. I mean obviously the parents
in the daycare or the preschool. You're working with the
young people, the six and under, but you're also working
with so maybe just tell the audience what does that
really look like, because babies on couches sometimes gets in
people's heads and they're like, you know, you can't possibly
(08:18):
do counseling with these really really young ones.
Speaker 6 (08:21):
If you can get a two year old to sit
still on a couch for half an hour, you know,
good for you. Look, but no, actually it is a
little counterintuitive because the primary work is really with the
adults in a child's life, Okay, that you know are
that biggest influence for that child. So most kiddos we
(08:44):
know spend most of their time at home with relatives
or extended family, or in a daycare preschool setting. So
my job is really to support the daycare provider, the
early childhood professionals here in Ashland County, so that they
(09:07):
so that they know to put their social and emotional
or that mental wellness lenses on, you know, to look
through that. So everything that they're doing in their classroom
or in their daycare centers, that they're doing and they're
being mindful that this child's mental wellness can be affected
(09:29):
by everything that's happening throughout the day. So, you know,
I tell teachers all the time, I'm not a teacher
and I am not an expert on early childhood education.
That's their expertise. But what I can do is I
can come to them and I can explain that as
you're teaching this lesson on shapes and colors and everything
(09:50):
else that young children do in their classrooms, that we
can also be teaching children how to develop friendships. We
can be teaching children how to manage those big motions
if they become frustrated, all of those things. So it
just brings a little bit of a different perspective to
some of the work that the teachers do. And my
job is to teach and encourage them in that.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Yeah, and from zero to six, you said, right age
of zero six.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Yes, zero to six.
Speaker 6 (10:19):
Typically once a child leaves preschool and starts into kindergarten,
that then is beyond the scope of what my job does.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Okay, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
It such a critical part of development that's happening at
that early absolutely right. So I think that's great that
you're doing that work.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Well, now I understand kind of what you've been doing
with me, doctor Ashley, because I feel like you've been
doing early childhood, done a health on me, because you've
been trying to help me manage my big emotions.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
That's what we've been doing. We've been working.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
Yeah, I didn't realize you were trying to pull some of.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
That on me.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
You can apply that at all ages.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
Nice, Absolutely appreciate.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
I'm gonna have to be more skeptical of some of
the things you're saying. So, so, in what ways are
you helping the parents and the teachers? Then you're you're
just as you say, you're more like a consultant, I guess,
for both the parents and the teachers in terms of
giving them insights on other areas outside of the primary
education area. As you said, making friends, et cetera. I
(11:19):
thought that was so you're just really giving them skills
or suggestions.
Speaker 6 (11:24):
Yes, basically, you know, I do a lot of observation
in the classroom, which helps me get an idea of
just how the classroom is functioning, how the individual children
are doing within that. There's really two different ways to
approach what I do. The first is when I'm looking
at an entire classroom of children and I'm working with
(11:45):
the teacher on this entire group of maybe fifteen children
that they have, and we're seeing that, you know, boy,
for this year twenty twenty four to twenty five school
year has just started, right, so the teachers are really
getting to know their children and for some teachers, they're
probably going, wow, this is a very different class than
with the kids I had last year. So we're looking
(12:08):
at that, what is this group's strengths, what are the
areas where they have some needs, and how can we
just meet all of those things for this entire group.
So the teachers looking at activities that would include all
of the children in their classroom or incorporating strategies and
things into what they do just on a day to
(12:30):
day basis.
Speaker 4 (12:31):
The second part of.
Speaker 6 (12:32):
What I do is when there's that individual child that
is struggling, and a teacher may call and say, you know,
we've tried everything that we know to do, and this
kiddo is just really having a hard time. Can you
come and give us some ideas and some suggestions. And
at that point, I'm another I'm another brain on the
team to give that mental health perspective and to just
(12:56):
be part of that team to try to develop a
plan child so he can be successful.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Yeah. I wondered about that, you know, because not everybody
is as receptive to receiving feedback or you know, so
as you were talking about, you know, observing and then offering,
is that something did you have to build relationships with
some of the school classrooms you're in with the folks
so that they're they're open to that. I mean, I
would imagine just some people are just naturally more open
(13:24):
to that kind of feedback, where other people might be like.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Don't tell me how to run my classroom. I'm a train.
Speaker 6 (13:29):
Professional, absolutely, And you know what, in Ashland we have
amazing early early childhood teachers. We really do, so shout
out to our Ashland Early childhood professionals and some of
these teachers I've been working with since I started in
this position, so they definitely are the experts in what
(13:50):
they do, but they know that I can just help
bring that that mental health, that's social and emotional piece
and just make it a little bit more of the
focus for new teachers.
Speaker 4 (14:01):
Yeah, there's a relationship building process. Absolutely.
Speaker 6 (14:04):
Nobody likes to have somebody come in and observe their classroom,
but I try to emphasize to them my job is
to support them.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
I am not a teacher.
Speaker 6 (14:14):
I can't criticize what they do in their role as
an educator. I can just try to bring that mental
health piece to them.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
That's great, and I appreciate hearing that. So many of
the teachers in the county are very receptive to what
you have to say. That says a lot about them.
Could you tell us a little bit if you're allowed
some of the different districts or are organizations that you're
working with currently.
Speaker 6 (14:37):
Sure, well, any preschool or daycare or even home care
provider for a child ages six are under has the
ability to receive early childhood mental health consultation services. So
my services are available to anyone that works with young
(14:58):
children here in the community. There are there are some
centers that I like to say they do the full program.
I mean they are committed to working with me as
their mental health consultant, and we implement the Devereaux assessment
(15:18):
to be looking at the children and seeing where their strengths.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Are and that individual base. Then the Deverau is that
classroom base or.
Speaker 6 (15:25):
Both kind of both the teachers fill out and actually
this year we have several centers that are having parents
fill them out as.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
Well, which is awesome. Different lenses of the same. Yeah, yeah,
we did.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
We used to do something similar to that doctor Ashley
with the Satisfaction and Outcome serpace. Really we got the
perspective of the therapist, the perspective of the person, and
the perspective of the family. If it was a child,
it was always it was always interesting to get different lenses.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
So that I think that's a wise approach.
Speaker 6 (15:52):
I think we all know a child can behave very
very differently at home. Yeah, then that child may behave
at school and vice versa.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
And that gives you additional inform on maybe how you
can design your consultation if you have that kind.
Speaker 6 (16:03):
Of information, absolutely, yeah, it's proven to be very helpful.
So I really I'm very appreciative of the teachers for
doing the extra work to collect those parent assessments as well.
But those assessments then, I mean they're done on each
individual child in the classroom, so we see for each
(16:24):
individual child where their strengths are, where the areas are
that maybe the child needs a little bit of additional
encouragement or support. But then we can also, like we
were talking about earlier, we can look at that entire
classroom and see as a classroom where these where's this
classroom strengths and where are the needs here. So, for instance,
(16:48):
if a teacher has a classroom where nine out of
their fifteen children are struggling with self regulation and managing
those big emotions that are maybe having temper tankrooms, we
know that as a group they would probably benefit from
some some strategies to just learn to manage their behaviors
(17:09):
and their emotions.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yeah, I love that We've been speaking with Nicole Man.
She's an early childhood mental health professional here in our county.
She's also licensed as a professional clinical counselor, and she
works through Catholic Charities which is four one nine two
eight nine nine zero three, And that was one of
my questions for audience members that have questions or want
(17:34):
to get in touch with you, is the best way
to contact that main Catholic Charities number.
Speaker 4 (17:39):
That is the best.
Speaker 6 (17:40):
Yes, I mean that will go directly to our office
where they will definitely get that message to me. I mean,
I can also be reached through email, and we can
certainly send that information out to your listeners as well,
but that main office number is a great pass to start.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
We can.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
If that's okay to do, I'll that in the episode
description that accompanies our episode today. I'm just excited because
this is another example, doctor Ashley, of how the Mental
Health and Recovery Board and our partners focus on prevention.
It's you know, we've talked a lot about that. When
we look at our overall funding in terms of percentages,
(18:20):
the Board funds more preventative programs than they do crisis
or treatment. And that's ideal because we feel like, if
we can do what Nicole's talking about, get ahead, that
we're helping ourselves and everybody down the.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
Road, right because a a lot of the services in
the mental health field, we talk about treatment, addiction treatment,
mental health treatment. But if we can get ahead of
the problem and do some prevention work. Would rather do that,
and this is really important prevention work.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Yeah, and Nicole, we're just so thankful that you're part
of this prevention effort and you have been for some
years and consistency in our field.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
It's getting harder and harder.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I know with the younger generation sometimes they like to
experience different, different opportunities, so we don't always have a
lot of folks that stick with it over the long term.
But I think there's some real benefits. You've you talked
about it. You've established relationships with some of our educators
in the area. They trust you that they know that
they can call on you and you can be helpful
to them the classrooms, the young people, the family. So
(19:24):
and I know you're learning year on year and quite frankly, Nicole,
I didn't warn you. I was going to ask you this,
but I have to imagine you've been a mentor, either
formally or informally to some of those other counties and
regions when you have your get togethers, because I would
imagine folks ask.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
What does Nicole think about this?
Speaker 2 (19:43):
She's been doing it for a little while. Does that
ever come up when you have some of your regional
or you're.
Speaker 6 (19:47):
Definitely starting to fall into the group of Oh, you've
done this for a long time, how did you do
it well? And there is a learning curve because I mean,
as we all know, nothing is ever exactly the same
when we're talking about young children. Yeah, so things are
always different. Maybe that's why this job is so rewarding
because every day is different. But it's amazing to see
(20:10):
these young children thrive and for parents and teachers to
gain confidence knowing that they can handle whatever comes their.
Speaker 4 (20:20):
Way with their child.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
And you've got them set up for kindergarten and beyond
and that that's wonderful.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
So that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Well, we've been speaking with Nicole Man from Catholic Charities
Early Childhood Mental Health Expert at four one nine two
eight nine one nine zero three. Nicole, we really appreciate
your time today.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Thank you, Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Absolutely thank you for listening to another episode of the
Keeping National and Healthy podcast. The podcast is a production
of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of Ashland County, Ohio.
You can reach the board by calling four one nine
two eight one three one three nine. Please remember that
the Board funds a local twenty four to seven crisis
line through Applese Community Mental Health Center.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
It can be reached by.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Calling four one nine two eight nine sixty one one one.
That's four one nine two eight nine sixty one one one.
Until next time, Please join us in keeping Ashland healthy.
Welcome.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
You're listening to the Keeping Ashland Healthy Podcast, a podcast
production of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of Ashlin County, Ohio.
Thanks for joining us, and welcome back to another episode
of the Keeping Ashland Healthy Podcast with Doctor Ashley and
the Boss.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Good morning, Boss. How are you?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'm doing well, Doctor Ashley, how are you doing?
Speaker 3 (00:22):
I'm doing well too?
Speaker 4 (00:23):
Thanks?
Speaker 1 (00:23):
All right, well, goody. So I'm pleasant this morning.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I hope the audience can can feel that pleasantness coming
through the microphones. Maybe maybe it's because we have a
special guest.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Yes, I'm really excited about this one today.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Me as well, because we have talked in the past
about early childhood mental health, but we never really unpacked
it to the audience and talked in death because we
didn't have the right person in the studio.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
This is the person.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
This is the person. Her name drum roll please, Yeah,
I don't have that effect. I wish I did.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Is Nicole Man. Nicoleman works over at Catholic Charities UH.
Catholic Charities is four one nine two eight nine one
nine zero three UH. Nicole has worked as an early
childhood mental health consultant for many many years. She's well
known in the community. She is an expert in her field,
and we are excited to talk about what this thing
(01:17):
is that we call early childhood mental health and you're
just the right person. Thank you for being here.
Speaker 5 (01:23):
Nicole, Well, thanks for having me absolutely so again for
our audience. It's it's your first time on the podcast. Uh,
tell us just a little bit about yourself and maybe
what all you had to go through to be an
early childhood mental health consultant.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
Sure, actually it was a journey.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (01:41):
So my background is in mental health. I have my
master's degree in community counseling from the University of Akron.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
That's where I got mine from. That was the best.
Speaker 6 (01:52):
Yeah, And at that time, after graduating from my from
my program, you know, I started to work community mental health.
Like all of us coming out of that program, my
interest was definitely with teenagers and with children. I enjoyed
that work a lot, and what I found was I
(02:15):
kept thinking, Wow, if I just would have met this
child a little bit sooner, a little bit sooner, a
little bit sooner, and pretty soon.
Speaker 4 (02:25):
I was the only person.
Speaker 6 (02:27):
At my agency at that time that would take anybody
under the age of eight, because you know, when we
went to school, they sure didn't teach us anything about
bringing a very young child into the counseling process. So
most of my colleagues just really weren't comfortable at all.
(02:48):
So I was getting a lot of these younger children
trying to figure out how to serve them best in
a counseling setting. And then in twenty sixteen, the state
of Ohio created the Whole Child Matters grant and that program.
(03:08):
Basically the purpose of that was because the state had
done enough research that they were seeing that young children
in preschool settings were being expelled from their centers at
a rate higher than our high school.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
At preschool level.
Speaker 6 (03:25):
At the preschool level, so our three, four and five
year old children were being told that they needed to
leave their centers for behavior because of behavioral concerns. So
the state, and it's great that we live in Ohio
because we are definitely a leader in this area, but
(03:47):
they decided, you know, what we need is someone that
can really work with children and in the environments where
they are so at home and at preschool or daycare. Right,
and they decided that each county in the state needed
someone with this early childhood mental health consultation credential.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
Wow, and that's where it all kind of began.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Wow, that's awesome.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
Yeah, that was awesome.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Well, I mean, I'm glad Ohio was so proactive, you know,
I know years ago. This goes all the way back
to two thousand and three, two thousand and four, when
I first started with the board. I'll never forget. It
was my first or second day on the job and
I came in and I opened up my door and
there were a bunch of puppets in my office. And
(04:38):
even in those early days, Nicole, we were doing some
early childhood mental health and they had received I think
it was through I don't know if it was Devereux work,
but they had all these you know, puppets and dolls
and things, which most people that know me know that
those things freaked me out anyway, so they arranged them
strategically throughout my office to get maximum freak out anyway.
(04:59):
So I didn't know what I had gotten into, Doctor Ashley.
I was like, am I supposed to be working with
these puppets in these dolls? But even back then three four,
Ashley County was pretty progressive and exploring this. And then,
as you say, when whole matters came on. I think
Catholic Charities was a recipient of some of those dollars
that came with that. It was like one of those
(05:19):
regional projects if I recall.
Speaker 6 (05:21):
Right, right, Yes, I worked together with a collaborative that
is our Northeast Ohio collaborative. There are ten counties in
my collaborative, which just gives me an awesome opportunity to
collaborate with other professionals that.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Focus in this area.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
And I maybe we're going you correct me, Nicole, but
I believe that you started at the very beginning, and
you may be one of the very few left from
that original group that started out on that regional grant.
There's a lot of turnover over the years.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
There has been some turnover.
Speaker 6 (05:53):
I'm thinking now, because we just had a meeting last week,
there are three of us.
Speaker 4 (05:59):
I think that we're in.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
That original corgis right.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
Yes, yep, we've been around for a while.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
Okay, so you know, in terms of you know, your
educational experience, it sounds like again like me graduating from
acron It wasn't really a specialty that we received in
our formal training at the master's level, but it's something
that you know, one you had an interest in, so
you started working, but then there was an opportunity through
(06:27):
funding to specialize if you will, or focus.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
And then you just took that. And then did they develop.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
A kind of credential or something for people that really
wanted to focus in on that early childhood mental health space.
Speaker 6 (06:37):
Yes, Yes, there has been a credential developed that really
focuses on that work with children ages six and under
six and it is that Early Childhood Mental Health Consultation Credential.
And there is a lot of training that goes into that,
I think, because when we go to school, that's that's
(06:59):
just not an air that was touched upon. So there's
a lot of training in assessment measures for children of
this age and then just strategies and resources to bring
to parents and teachers to be able to I mean,
what we're really talking about, right, is for parents and
(07:19):
for teachers, yes, to be as prepared as they can
be to handle their child's development and possible behavior concerns
that come up so that they can be that person
then to help that child.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Right, Because that's where I was going with my next question,
Doctor Ashley. You know, when I talk to folks in
the community about early childhood mental health. Immediately, the idea is, David,
are you putting babies on couches? And sometimes I say yes,
just to mess with them, but it is not correct
me if I'm wrong Nicole, But we are not putting
(07:55):
babies on couches. So what does early childhood mental health?
You've already touched on this. I mean obviously the parents
in the daycare or the preschool. You're working with the
young people, the six and under, but you're also working
with so maybe just tell the audience what does that
really look like, because babies on couches sometimes gets in
people's heads and they're like, you know, you can't possibly
(08:18):
do counseling with these really really young ones.
Speaker 6 (08:21):
If you can get a two year old to sit
still on a couch for half an hour, you know,
good for you. Look, but no, actually it is a
little counterintuitive because the primary work is really with the
adults in a child's life, Okay, that you know are
that biggest influence for that child. So most kiddos we
(08:44):
know spend most of their time at home with relatives
or extended family, or in a daycare preschool setting. So
my job is really to support the daycare provider, the
early childhood professionals here in Ashland County, so that they
(09:07):
so that they know to put their social and emotional
or that mental wellness lenses on, you know, to look
through that. So everything that they're doing in their classroom
or in their daycare centers, that they're doing and they're
being mindful that this child's mental wellness can be affected
(09:29):
by everything that's happening throughout the day. So, you know,
I tell teachers all the time, I'm not a teacher
and I am not an expert on early childhood education.
That's their expertise. But what I can do is I
can come to them and I can explain that as
you're teaching this lesson on shapes and colors and everything
(09:50):
else that young children do in their classrooms, that we
can also be teaching children how to develop friendships. We
can be teaching children how to manage those big motions
if they become frustrated, all of those things. So it
just brings a little bit of a different perspective to
some of the work that the teachers do. And my
job is to teach and encourage them in that.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Yeah, and from zero to six, you said, right age
of zero six.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Yes, zero to six.
Speaker 6 (10:19):
Typically once a child leaves preschool and starts into kindergarten,
that then is beyond the scope of what my job does.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Okay, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
It such a critical part of development that's happening at
that early absolutely right. So I think that's great that
you're doing that work.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Well, now I understand kind of what you've been doing
with me, doctor Ashley, because I feel like you've been
doing early childhood, done a health on me, because you've
been trying to help me manage my big emotions.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
That's what we've been doing. We've been working.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
Yeah, I didn't realize you were trying to pull some of.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
That on me.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
You can apply that at all ages.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
Nice, Absolutely appreciate.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
I'm gonna have to be more skeptical of some of
the things you're saying. So, so, in what ways are
you helping the parents and the teachers? Then you're you're
just as you say, you're more like a consultant, I guess,
for both the parents and the teachers in terms of
giving them insights on other areas outside of the primary
education area. As you said, making friends, et cetera. I
(11:19):
thought that was so you're just really giving them skills
or suggestions.
Speaker 6 (11:24):
Yes, basically, you know, I do a lot of observation
in the classroom, which helps me get an idea of
just how the classroom is functioning, how the individual children
are doing within that. There's really two different ways to
approach what I do. The first is when I'm looking
at an entire classroom of children and I'm working with
(11:45):
the teacher on this entire group of maybe fifteen children
that they have, and we're seeing that, you know, boy,
for this year twenty twenty four to twenty five school
year has just started, right, so the teachers are really
getting to know their children and for some teachers, they're
probably going, wow, this is a very different class than
with the kids I had last year. So we're looking
(12:08):
at that, what is this group's strengths, what are the
areas where they have some needs, and how can we
just meet all of those things for this entire group.
So the teachers looking at activities that would include all
of the children in their classroom or incorporating strategies and
things into what they do just on a day to
(12:30):
day basis.
Speaker 4 (12:31):
The second part of.
Speaker 6 (12:32):
What I do is when there's that individual child that
is struggling, and a teacher may call and say, you know,
we've tried everything that we know to do, and this
kiddo is just really having a hard time. Can you
come and give us some ideas and some suggestions. And
at that point, I'm another I'm another brain on the
team to give that mental health perspective and to just
(12:56):
be part of that team to try to develop a
plan child so he can be successful.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Yeah. I wondered about that, you know, because not everybody
is as receptive to receiving feedback or you know, so
as you were talking about, you know, observing and then offering,
is that something did you have to build relationships with
some of the school classrooms you're in with the folks
so that they're they're open to that. I mean, I
would imagine just some people are just naturally more open
(13:24):
to that kind of feedback, where other people might be like.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Don't tell me how to run my classroom. I'm a train.
Speaker 6 (13:29):
Professional, absolutely, And you know what, in Ashland we have
amazing early early childhood teachers. We really do, so shout
out to our Ashland Early childhood professionals and some of
these teachers I've been working with since I started in
this position, so they definitely are the experts in what
(13:50):
they do, but they know that I can just help
bring that that mental health, that's social and emotional piece
and just make it a little bit more of the
focus for new teachers.
Speaker 4 (14:01):
Yeah, there's a relationship building process. Absolutely.
Speaker 6 (14:04):
Nobody likes to have somebody come in and observe their classroom,
but I try to emphasize to them my job is
to support them.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
I am not a teacher.
Speaker 6 (14:14):
I can't criticize what they do in their role as
an educator. I can just try to bring that mental
health piece to them.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
That's great, and I appreciate hearing that. So many of
the teachers in the county are very receptive to what
you have to say. That says a lot about them.
Could you tell us a little bit if you're allowed
some of the different districts or are organizations that you're
working with currently.
Speaker 6 (14:37):
Sure, well, any preschool or daycare or even home care
provider for a child ages six are under has the
ability to receive early childhood mental health consultation services. So
my services are available to anyone that works with young
(14:58):
children here in the community. There are there are some
centers that I like to say they do the full program.
I mean they are committed to working with me as
their mental health consultant, and we implement the Devereaux assessment
(15:18):
to be looking at the children and seeing where their strengths.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Are and that individual base. Then the Deverau is that
classroom base or.
Speaker 6 (15:25):
Both kind of both the teachers fill out and actually
this year we have several centers that are having parents
fill them out as.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
Well, which is awesome. Different lenses of the same. Yeah, yeah,
we did.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
We used to do something similar to that doctor Ashley
with the Satisfaction and Outcome serpace. Really we got the
perspective of the therapist, the perspective of the person, and
the perspective of the family. If it was a child,
it was always it was always interesting to get different lenses.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
So that I think that's a wise approach.
Speaker 6 (15:52):
I think we all know a child can behave very
very differently at home. Yeah, then that child may behave
at school and vice versa.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
And that gives you additional inform on maybe how you
can design your consultation if you have that kind.
Speaker 6 (16:03):
Of information, absolutely, yeah, it's proven to be very helpful.
So I really I'm very appreciative of the teachers for
doing the extra work to collect those parent assessments as well.
But those assessments then, I mean they're done on each
individual child in the classroom, so we see for each
(16:24):
individual child where their strengths are, where the areas are
that maybe the child needs a little bit of additional
encouragement or support. But then we can also, like we
were talking about earlier, we can look at that entire
classroom and see as a classroom where these where's this
classroom strengths and where are the needs here. So, for instance,
(16:48):
if a teacher has a classroom where nine out of
their fifteen children are struggling with self regulation and managing
those big emotions that are maybe having temper tankrooms, we
know that as a group they would probably benefit from
some some strategies to just learn to manage their behaviors
(17:09):
and their emotions.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yeah, I love that We've been speaking with Nicole Man.
She's an early childhood mental health professional here in our county.
She's also licensed as a professional clinical counselor, and she
works through Catholic Charities which is four one nine two
eight nine nine zero three, And that was one of
my questions for audience members that have questions or want
(17:34):
to get in touch with you, is the best way
to contact that main Catholic Charities number.
Speaker 4 (17:39):
That is the best.
Speaker 6 (17:40):
Yes, I mean that will go directly to our office
where they will definitely get that message to me. I mean,
I can also be reached through email, and we can
certainly send that information out to your listeners as well,
but that main office number is a great pass to start.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
We can.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
If that's okay to do, I'll that in the episode
description that accompanies our episode today. I'm just excited because
this is another example, doctor Ashley, of how the Mental
Health and Recovery Board and our partners focus on prevention.
It's you know, we've talked a lot about that. When
we look at our overall funding in terms of percentages,
(18:20):
the Board funds more preventative programs than they do crisis
or treatment. And that's ideal because we feel like, if
we can do what Nicole's talking about, get ahead, that
we're helping ourselves and everybody down the.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
Road, right because a a lot of the services in
the mental health field, we talk about treatment, addiction treatment,
mental health treatment. But if we can get ahead of
the problem and do some prevention work. Would rather do that,
and this is really important prevention work.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Yeah, and Nicole, we're just so thankful that you're part
of this prevention effort and you have been for some
years and consistency in our field.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
It's getting harder and harder.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I know with the younger generation sometimes they like to
experience different, different opportunities, so we don't always have a
lot of folks that stick with it over the long term.
But I think there's some real benefits. You've you talked
about it. You've established relationships with some of our educators
in the area. They trust you that they know that
they can call on you and you can be helpful
to them the classrooms, the young people, the family. So
(19:24):
and I know you're learning year on year and quite frankly, Nicole,
I didn't warn you. I was going to ask you this,
but I have to imagine you've been a mentor, either
formally or informally to some of those other counties and
regions when you have your get togethers, because I would
imagine folks ask.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
What does Nicole think about this?
Speaker 2 (19:43):
She's been doing it for a little while. Does that
ever come up when you have some of your regional
or you're.
Speaker 6 (19:47):
Definitely starting to fall into the group of Oh, you've
done this for a long time, how did you do
it well? And there is a learning curve because I mean,
as we all know, nothing is ever exactly the same
when we're talking about young children. Yeah, so things are
always different. Maybe that's why this job is so rewarding
because every day is different. But it's amazing to see
(20:10):
these young children thrive and for parents and teachers to
gain confidence knowing that they can handle whatever comes their.
Speaker 4 (20:20):
Way with their child.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
And you've got them set up for kindergarten and beyond
and that that's wonderful.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
So that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Well, we've been speaking with Nicole Man from Catholic Charities
Early Childhood Mental Health Expert at four one nine two
eight nine one nine zero three. Nicole, we really appreciate
your time today.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Thank you, Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Absolutely thank you for listening to another episode of the
Keeping National and Healthy podcast. The podcast is a production
of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of Ashland County, Ohio.
You can reach the board by calling four one nine
two eight one three one three nine. Please remember that
the Board funds a local twenty four to seven crisis
line through Applese Community Mental Health Center.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
It can be reached by.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Calling four one nine two eight nine sixty one one one.
That's four one nine two eight nine sixty one one one.
Until next time, Please join us in keeping Ashland healthy.
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