March 4, 2025 • 18 mins
On today’s episode of Keeping Ashland Healthy, Dr. Ashley and the Boss highlight one of the many great RSVP speakers this year – Ron Bassman. Ron is the author of the book, ‘A Fight to Be.’ He’s a clinical psychologist who was involuntarily hospitalized twice as a young man and went on to be a leading advocate for more humane treatments for both individuals and the affected families. Register today for the RSVP Conference at the Board’s website – www.ashlandmhrb.org or by calling us at 419.281.3139.
(Record Date: February 27, 2025)
(Record Date: February 27, 2025)
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome. You're listening to the Keeping Ashland Healthy podcast, a
podcast production of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of
Ashland County, Ohio. Thanks for joining us, and welcome back
to another episode of Keeping Ashland Healthy with Doctor Ashley
and the Boss. How are you doing this morning, Doctor Ashley?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
I am doing great. How are you doing this morning?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
I'm a little stressed with the technology.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Yeah, I know that is stressful.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
We had updates, you know, a little bit of a
peak behind the scenes, audience. We had some updates to
the road Caster Pro two and you know, they always
caused me a bit of heartburn.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
They do for sure. But you know what what I
heard words chirping this morning and it made me really
glad Spring spring crash like so excited for spring this year.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
It has been a colder I mean it is Ohio,
right right, we should expect that, but it does seem
like it's been a bit colder than reason normal.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I'm just ready for the welcome sound.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
All right, Well, we are all ready and hopefully the
audience is too. One of those rodents you know, was
correct because there was a dueling roadent prognostication. If you
recall on on Rodent Day. We had I think Buck
Eye Chuck, who had a different prediction than the world
famous punks a tany.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Phil Chuck was right right, No, I think Chuck might
have been wrong. I thought.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
I think Phil was more doom and gloom and said,
you know, we've got more and more weeks, and Chuck
was optimistic. I think I think he was still a
little bit influenced by the big OSU National Championship. Yeah,
there were reports of him. Chuck was on high Street.
I don't want to read into that, but Chuck might
(01:46):
have been out and about. All right, Well, today's episode
we were focusing in a little bit on our r
s VP conference that we've been talking about a little bit,
but we wanted to highlight a speaker we have not
talked to you all about. Just by a way of reference,
the RSVP conference is March twenty six, and that will
(02:07):
be coming up. It's at Ashland University at the Upper
Convocation Center. If you get there about eight point fifty,
it starts right about nine runs to four. The registration,
I think the easiest way if you don't have a
fly er, you've not seen something on social media. Certainly
we advertise it there, but if you just go to
Ashlin MHRB dot org and that'll be in the episode description.
(02:31):
You know, I've encouraged folks, doctor Ashley, if they want
to be in person, because we're doing a hybrid conference meeting.
Folks can attend in person or they can zoom in.
The in person seats are going fast, so if they
want to benefit by the lunch and all the vendors,
Brooke will be there signing copies of her May Cause
Side Effects book. So if folks want that experience, that's
(02:53):
going quickly, So I would encourage folks to sign up
today or when they hear this podcast. But we have
limitted spots obviously over zoom, So twenty bucks in person
ten dollars over zoom. We think that's a very reasonable
price giving all the talent that is coming your way
for this conference.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
I think of a deal for the speaker.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
Agree, doctors, I agree, And so we wanted to talk
about one of our afternoon speakers, doctor Ron Bassman. Ron
is a you know, he's a clinical psychologist, which is interesting.
He was diagnosed though with schizophrenia in his twenties, hospitalized
twice involuntarily, I might add, hospitalized involuntarily twice for more
(03:38):
than a year. Doctor Bassman recovered and transformed those experiences
and became a licensed psychologist. Along with his psychotherapy practice,
he devotes himself to writing and speaking again. His experience
is his truth to power with the aim of exposing
and challenging the misconceptions of mental health professionals and the
general public, and most importantly, inspire other folks that may
(04:01):
have been struggled. I think a lot of people might
know Ron through his book, which was entitled A Fight
to Be Experiences from both sides of the Locked Door.
And again, Ron, we're going to zoom doctor Bassman in
because now he lives in Boulder, Colorado. He doesn't do
(04:23):
a whole lot of traveling. But what I'm so happy
and excited I want the audience to know. You know,
we call this Doctor Ashley the pat Risfer RSVP Conference,
and the reason for that is it was named after
Pat Risser, who was a board member in years past,
but also like Ron, and they knew each other, you know,
(04:44):
a survivor, a psychiatric survivor, and there was really they
lived through some of the more formidable times in this country,
the sixty seventies and eighties when it had to do
with what we call sometimes a psychiatric survivor or consumer
survivor movement developing that and bill that. So to have
somebody like Ron who lived through those formative years of
(05:06):
the sixties, seventies and eighties, when again folks forget that
lobotomies were going on up into the eighties, and Ron
was subjected to insulin coma as quote unquote treatment. Again,
most people were like, what, you know, the idea that
we're going to add insulin to a degree, then the
(05:28):
person cod and it goes into a coma state, then
bring them out of it, and then do it again
and do it again. Goodness, yeah, as a former treatment.
Again that I know, that's you know, fifty sixty years ago,
but doesn't seem that long ago to me. I guess.
And Ron lived through that. So those two hospitalizations. He
talks a lot about that in the book and he
may touch on that. So he comes from that that
(05:49):
those experiences, and as I said in reading his bio,
Ron has transformed. He's taken those experiences and not become
bitter and angry and last doubt, but he's you know,
he's tried to arm himself with education and gone on
to be, like I say, a clinical psychologist, and then
then to try to make the system better, to take
(06:09):
those experiences to change the system rather than just rail
against it.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
Yeah. I've been listening to him talk about these things,
and I think his perspective is unique because he has
both the practitioner part, the experience as a doctor, but
then also his experience as a patient, and he talks about,
you know, both sides of that and his I thought
it was interesting you mentioned treatments. On his website. He
puts treatments in quotes like my treatments included electro shock,
(06:40):
insulin comas, and massive doses of medication.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Yeah. Yeah, so right, we say that oftentimes because again,
these things that were maybe called treatments really were actually
doing harm. So so Ron will probably talk a little
bit about his personal experience how he came because again
and that was the that was the genesis, that was
the motivation for him to go on with the career
(07:04):
he went into and certainly shaped his his career. And
you know, he's been just for our audience who knows this,
and I know we have a few folks that know
this organization NARPA, the National Association for Rights Protection and Advocacy.
He's been you know, president of that organization, which is
a national organization again to try to protect folks from
the experiences he went through so nobody else has to
(07:28):
do that. He's also on the what they call the
Pammy Advisory Board in Boulder, our own Risser is a
Pammy Advisory Board member here locally for the Ohio UH
chapter of of you know, the Rights Protection Advocacy Board.
So the the issue of you know, being treated in
(07:51):
a negative, harmful way, it sticks with folks, whether that
was Pat, his his widow, Trish, who's still with us
and involved with the planning of the conference. And hopefully
folks can meet trist if they attend in person. It
really does shape them. And and the thing that Ron
focuses on and I want to bring the audience attentions
(08:13):
to and he'll he'll speak primarily about this when he
comes here in a few weeks is family members, because
you know, he believes that his parents were very loving,
but they signed off gave a cent to that the
quote unquote, as you said, doctor Ashley, treatments that he
received and that really confused him when he finally did
(08:34):
get out, was you know, why why did my family
think this was good for me? What were they told?
You know? And where they told the right kinds of information?
Were they not told information? And and because of that,
he's focused a lot of his work on trying to
(08:55):
help family members help other family members, and he uses
his own family and what he's gleaned from them as
a way to jump start that.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Yeah. So one of the things that I've learned from you,
actually as my mentor of something that you said early
on to me that stuck with me is that if
you have an issue, if you have a problem, don't
come to me with a problem without.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
What Yeah, yeah, at least a couple solutions.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Some solutions, some suggestions about how to improve that. Yeah.
And I love that Ron. You know, he had this experience,
he saw a problem with that, but then offers he's
done so much work in the space to try and
offer alternative solutions, yes, to help those who are maybe
in that situation. And I think this model is an
example of that.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah. So let me let me read. So some of
the things he's doing. He's trying to train families to
help other families that have children that might be struggling
with emotional distress. So families continue, in his view, they're
often kept in the dark, but what they can do
to help somebody that might be a family member in distress.
So he talks about what he's learned during the many
(10:00):
years of working on himself as well as people that
are struggling, is that we can do better. You know,
some of the new approaches to family therapy, he feels
I've been promising but still falls short because he believes
there's a healing power within the families themselves that needs
to be brought to bear and again, so he asked
the question, then, how is it that we've gotten to
(10:22):
the point that so many family members become convinced that
only a pharmaceutical solution can be effective? And for too long,
he says, the biochemical model has failed to fulfill its
promises and has blocked actually the emergence and development of
creative community based services. And doctor Ashley and our regular
listeners will know that that's one of the things the
(10:43):
board has really focused on is and the whole conference,
is that one of those alternative voices to the biochemical model,
we try to give platforms to people like Brooks Seam
and Deep Barbish and Ron Bassman this year and many
many years. We've been doing this for sixteen years. Dan
Fisher was one of our very first speakers. And Dan
(11:04):
Fisher who is a medical doctor. But his story is
very similar to Ron's because he again was hospitalized, you know,
and at a very young age, and it went on
to be a medical doctor and again be in charge
of kind of the institution that hospitalized him. Kind of
a situation. So but again, for too many years, the
biochemical model has just dominated. So oftentimes the recommended treatment
(11:28):
protocols almost guarantee the admission of their loved one into
the role of a chronic mental patient. So he talks
about that because how that happens is the language what
families are taught. So doctor, actually you have to do
a bit of a thought experiment. So if family members
are told by groups that are often happening in various counties,
(11:50):
or by the physician or the nurse, if the story,
you know, they're trying to help their loved one, son
or daughter, and if that story is something to the
effect of, well, your son or daughter, you know, has
a schizophrenia, which is a lifelong illness, and we're not
so sure you know what level of functioning or if
the REV will be able to work. But you know,
(12:12):
this is something, this is long term, this is chronic,
probably going to be in medications the rest of their life.
If that's the initial story that family members here from
the medical, from the helpers, you can see how maybe
that might set them up to not be optimistic or hopeful.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yeah, so what is the point in even looking for
another alternative solution to that?
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Right?
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Yeah? They just think it's that's how it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Yeah, so he talks about this families, then they're basically
advised to downgrade their expectations for their loved one, to
accept that they are dealing with a very serious mental
disease that's going to require psychiatric drugs, recurring hospital confinements.
And they're not given the research that you know, patients
(12:58):
that are on psychiatric medications tend to die twenty five
years sooner than general populations. They're not given the alternatives
that this could be a transient and short term, that
it's not unusual for somebody that's under extreme amounts of
stress from a variety of different things to maybe go
through a period where they're particularly distressed and emotional, they're
not going to be told other stories. And in short,
(13:20):
then because they're not told some of these alternative stories
from the get go, family members are often again unbeknownst
to them, contributing to maybe their loved ones chrinicity and
their lack of hope. And I think you read some
things around Ron and how he talks about hope that
(13:42):
you thought was impactful.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
Yeah, So one of the quotes that I wanted to
share was about hope. Ron says, I believe that as
long as a person is alive, some seed of hope,
some possibility is there waiting to be fertilized. Hope fights fear,
nurtures the courage, and inspires the vision and the work
required to resist giving up and accepting that your goals
are unattainable. Deep in the recesses of our being that
(14:06):
are safe sanctuaries, secure hiding places for never fully lost dreams,
but sometimes they're hidden so well that we can no
longer reach those parts of ourselves. The help we need
may come from expected and unexpected sources. That I really
like that we talk about hope and recovery. So Ron
says it is a myth that people don't recover right
(14:29):
from mental health stuff. Yeah, and we believe that here
at the board too. Recovery as possible. Yes, and if
you have that hope, you might try some different things
right and think about it differently.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
Now, That's why I said Doctor Ashley and our own
Pat Risser before he passed, many times he said that
he would tell folks I'm an ED recovery person. So
because there was a debate about that, you know, the
idea that I'm in recovery forever versus I'm recovered. So
he if he is an ED person because he felt
(15:03):
like he recovered full stop from some of his so
called diagnoses he received as a as a young man.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
So it's really cool they knew they knew each other too.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
And no, I mean, I'm excited. I don't you know,
I don't want to get him off topic. I might
ask him in advance, if you know, if he wants
to tell any stories about Pat that he might have,
So I'll ask him that informally. But I think you know,
as folks come to the conference, what they're going to
hear is in Ron's work now primarily is on training
(15:37):
up family so he believes that a family approach to
help family members helping other family members is a way
to go. It's like a peer So he provides some
structured training for families that are interested in doing this
uh and then they make themselves available to their local
community to talk to lead people through some of the struggles.
(16:01):
We've got professional led groups that do this, but that's
what's different. Ron feels like there's power in training up
other family members that have gone through it, and they
are the facilitators. Again, they don't charge. You know, it's
open ended. It's a support group if you will. And
this is something we don't have yet that I'm aware
(16:22):
of in Ohio. But that's partly why i wanted Ron
to talk to us about this, because I've been interested
in a family approach that have been trained in a
model that is not dominated by the medical model. We've
got family programs that are in Ohio and other states,
but they come from that medical model lens, which I
(16:44):
think does more harm than good. So I've been looking
for an approach that takes more of the social determinants
of health, psychosocial causes of distress, and teaches encourages from
that frame. And so I'm optimistic as he talks about
that we might be able to get some people trained
up in Ohio and even in Ashland County going forward
(17:06):
that we can refer our families to that might be
looking for that support.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Yeah, I think it's really exciting.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Yeah, very exciting.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
I'm excited to hear them talk so well.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Folks, if you've not signed up yet, don't wait, run
yes yet, maybe get signed up. If you want to
be in person, you need to make that commitment today again.
Twenty bucks Ashley MHRB dot org. It's the RSVP conference
March twenty six, starting around eight fifty for registration. Doctor
(17:35):
and Ashley and I will be there. If you want
doctor Ashley's autograph on anything, She's promised to sign anything
you bring her. So, so Doctor Ashley again, thank you.
We're looking forward to meeting folks in person at the
conference and just it's going to be a wonderful day
with our speakers and just getting to see folks that
come out. We've got a lot of return folks, so
(17:57):
it's nice catching up with some of our people from
where I'm state that come. And certainly we don't want
to coglect our folks on Zoom. But we'll try to
reach out to those folks as best we can given
that that platform.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Yeah, I'm excited. It's going to be great.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Thank you, doctor Ashley.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
Episode of the Keeping Ashland Healthy podcast. The podcast is
a production of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of
Ashland County, Ohio. You can reach the Board by calling
four one nine two eight one three one three nine.
Please remember that the Board funds a local twenty four
to seven crisis line through Applese Community Mental Health Center.
It can be reached by calling four one nine two
eight nine sixty one one one. That's four one nine
(18:36):
two eight nine sixty one one one. Until next time,
Please join us in keeping Ashland Healthy.
Welcome. You're listening to the Keeping Ashland Healthy podcast, a
podcast production of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of
Ashland County, Ohio. Thanks for joining us, and welcome back
to another episode of Keeping Ashland Healthy with Doctor Ashley
and the Boss. How are you doing this morning, Doctor Ashley?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
I am doing great. How are you doing this morning?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
I'm a little stressed with the technology.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Yeah, I know that is stressful.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
We had updates, you know, a little bit of a
peak behind the scenes, audience. We had some updates to
the road Caster Pro two and you know, they always
caused me a bit of heartburn.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
They do for sure. But you know what what I
heard words chirping this morning and it made me really
glad Spring spring crash like so excited for spring this year.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
It has been a colder I mean it is Ohio,
right right, we should expect that, but it does seem
like it's been a bit colder than reason normal.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I'm just ready for the welcome sound.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
All right, Well, we are all ready and hopefully the
audience is too. One of those rodents you know, was
correct because there was a dueling roadent prognostication. If you
recall on on Rodent Day. We had I think Buck
Eye Chuck, who had a different prediction than the world
famous punks a tany.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Phil Chuck was right right, No, I think Chuck might
have been wrong. I thought.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
I think Phil was more doom and gloom and said,
you know, we've got more and more weeks, and Chuck
was optimistic. I think I think he was still a
little bit influenced by the big OSU National Championship. Yeah,
there were reports of him. Chuck was on high Street.
I don't want to read into that, but Chuck might
(01:46):
have been out and about. All right, Well, today's episode
we were focusing in a little bit on our r
s VP conference that we've been talking about a little bit,
but we wanted to highlight a speaker we have not
talked to you all about. Just by a way of reference,
the RSVP conference is March twenty six, and that will
(02:07):
be coming up. It's at Ashland University at the Upper
Convocation Center. If you get there about eight point fifty,
it starts right about nine runs to four. The registration,
I think the easiest way if you don't have a
fly er, you've not seen something on social media. Certainly
we advertise it there, but if you just go to
Ashlin MHRB dot org and that'll be in the episode description.
(02:31):
You know, I've encouraged folks, doctor Ashley, if they want
to be in person, because we're doing a hybrid conference meeting.
Folks can attend in person or they can zoom in.
The in person seats are going fast, so if they
want to benefit by the lunch and all the vendors,
Brooke will be there signing copies of her May Cause
Side Effects book. So if folks want that experience, that's
(02:53):
going quickly, So I would encourage folks to sign up
today or when they hear this podcast. But we have
limitted spots obviously over zoom, So twenty bucks in person
ten dollars over zoom. We think that's a very reasonable
price giving all the talent that is coming your way
for this conference.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
I think of a deal for the speaker.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
Agree, doctors, I agree, And so we wanted to talk
about one of our afternoon speakers, doctor Ron Bassman. Ron
is a you know, he's a clinical psychologist, which is interesting.
He was diagnosed though with schizophrenia in his twenties, hospitalized
twice involuntarily, I might add, hospitalized involuntarily twice for more
(03:38):
than a year. Doctor Bassman recovered and transformed those experiences
and became a licensed psychologist. Along with his psychotherapy practice,
he devotes himself to writing and speaking again. His experience
is his truth to power with the aim of exposing
and challenging the misconceptions of mental health professionals and the
general public, and most importantly, inspire other folks that may
(04:01):
have been struggled. I think a lot of people might
know Ron through his book, which was entitled A Fight
to Be Experiences from both sides of the Locked Door.
And again, Ron, we're going to zoom doctor Bassman in
because now he lives in Boulder, Colorado. He doesn't do
(04:23):
a whole lot of traveling. But what I'm so happy
and excited I want the audience to know. You know,
we call this Doctor Ashley the pat Risfer RSVP Conference,
and the reason for that is it was named after
Pat Risser, who was a board member in years past,
but also like Ron, and they knew each other, you know,
(04:44):
a survivor, a psychiatric survivor, and there was really they
lived through some of the more formidable times in this country,
the sixty seventies and eighties when it had to do
with what we call sometimes a psychiatric survivor or consumer
survivor movement developing that and bill that. So to have
somebody like Ron who lived through those formative years of
(05:06):
the sixties, seventies and eighties, when again folks forget that
lobotomies were going on up into the eighties, and Ron
was subjected to insulin coma as quote unquote treatment. Again,
most people were like, what, you know, the idea that
we're going to add insulin to a degree, then the
(05:28):
person cod and it goes into a coma state, then
bring them out of it, and then do it again
and do it again. Goodness, yeah, as a former treatment.
Again that I know, that's you know, fifty sixty years ago,
but doesn't seem that long ago to me. I guess.
And Ron lived through that. So those two hospitalizations. He
talks a lot about that in the book and he
may touch on that. So he comes from that that
(05:49):
those experiences, and as I said in reading his bio,
Ron has transformed. He's taken those experiences and not become
bitter and angry and last doubt, but he's you know,
he's tried to arm himself with education and gone on
to be, like I say, a clinical psychologist, and then
then to try to make the system better, to take
(06:09):
those experiences to change the system rather than just rail
against it.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
Yeah. I've been listening to him talk about these things,
and I think his perspective is unique because he has
both the practitioner part, the experience as a doctor, but
then also his experience as a patient, and he talks about,
you know, both sides of that and his I thought
it was interesting you mentioned treatments. On his website. He
puts treatments in quotes like my treatments included electro shock,
(06:40):
insulin comas, and massive doses of medication.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Yeah. Yeah, so right, we say that oftentimes because again,
these things that were maybe called treatments really were actually
doing harm. So so Ron will probably talk a little
bit about his personal experience how he came because again
and that was the that was the genesis, that was
the motivation for him to go on with the career
(07:04):
he went into and certainly shaped his his career. And
you know, he's been just for our audience who knows this,
and I know we have a few folks that know
this organization NARPA, the National Association for Rights Protection and Advocacy.
He's been you know, president of that organization, which is
a national organization again to try to protect folks from
the experiences he went through so nobody else has to
(07:28):
do that. He's also on the what they call the
Pammy Advisory Board in Boulder, our own Risser is a
Pammy Advisory Board member here locally for the Ohio UH
chapter of of you know, the Rights Protection Advocacy Board.
So the the issue of you know, being treated in
(07:51):
a negative, harmful way, it sticks with folks, whether that
was Pat, his his widow, Trish, who's still with us
and involved with the planning of the conference. And hopefully
folks can meet trist if they attend in person. It
really does shape them. And and the thing that Ron
focuses on and I want to bring the audience attentions
(08:13):
to and he'll he'll speak primarily about this when he
comes here in a few weeks is family members, because
you know, he believes that his parents were very loving,
but they signed off gave a cent to that the
quote unquote, as you said, doctor Ashley, treatments that he
received and that really confused him when he finally did
(08:34):
get out, was you know, why why did my family
think this was good for me? What were they told?
You know? And where they told the right kinds of information?
Were they not told information? And and because of that,
he's focused a lot of his work on trying to
(08:55):
help family members help other family members, and he uses
his own family and what he's gleaned from them as
a way to jump start that.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Yeah. So one of the things that I've learned from you,
actually as my mentor of something that you said early
on to me that stuck with me is that if
you have an issue, if you have a problem, don't
come to me with a problem without.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
What Yeah, yeah, at least a couple solutions.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Some solutions, some suggestions about how to improve that. Yeah.
And I love that Ron. You know, he had this experience,
he saw a problem with that, but then offers he's
done so much work in the space to try and
offer alternative solutions, yes, to help those who are maybe
in that situation. And I think this model is an
example of that.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah. So let me let me read. So some of
the things he's doing. He's trying to train families to
help other families that have children that might be struggling
with emotional distress. So families continue, in his view, they're
often kept in the dark, but what they can do
to help somebody that might be a family member in distress.
So he talks about what he's learned during the many
(10:00):
years of working on himself as well as people that
are struggling, is that we can do better. You know,
some of the new approaches to family therapy, he feels
I've been promising but still falls short because he believes
there's a healing power within the families themselves that needs
to be brought to bear and again, so he asked
the question, then, how is it that we've gotten to
(10:22):
the point that so many family members become convinced that
only a pharmaceutical solution can be effective? And for too long,
he says, the biochemical model has failed to fulfill its
promises and has blocked actually the emergence and development of
creative community based services. And doctor Ashley and our regular
listeners will know that that's one of the things the
(10:43):
board has really focused on is and the whole conference,
is that one of those alternative voices to the biochemical model,
we try to give platforms to people like Brooks Seam
and Deep Barbish and Ron Bassman this year and many
many years. We've been doing this for sixteen years. Dan
Fisher was one of our very first speakers. And Dan
(11:04):
Fisher who is a medical doctor. But his story is
very similar to Ron's because he again was hospitalized, you know,
and at a very young age, and it went on
to be a medical doctor and again be in charge
of kind of the institution that hospitalized him. Kind of
a situation. So but again, for too many years, the
biochemical model has just dominated. So oftentimes the recommended treatment
(11:28):
protocols almost guarantee the admission of their loved one into
the role of a chronic mental patient. So he talks
about that because how that happens is the language what
families are taught. So doctor, actually you have to do
a bit of a thought experiment. So if family members
are told by groups that are often happening in various counties,
(11:50):
or by the physician or the nurse, if the story,
you know, they're trying to help their loved one, son
or daughter, and if that story is something to the
effect of, well, your son or daughter, you know, has
a schizophrenia, which is a lifelong illness, and we're not
so sure you know what level of functioning or if
the REV will be able to work. But you know,
(12:12):
this is something, this is long term, this is chronic,
probably going to be in medications the rest of their life.
If that's the initial story that family members here from
the medical, from the helpers, you can see how maybe
that might set them up to not be optimistic or hopeful.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yeah, so what is the point in even looking for
another alternative solution to that?
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Right?
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Yeah? They just think it's that's how it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Yeah, so he talks about this families, then they're basically
advised to downgrade their expectations for their loved one, to
accept that they are dealing with a very serious mental
disease that's going to require psychiatric drugs, recurring hospital confinements.
And they're not given the research that you know, patients
(12:58):
that are on psychiatric medications tend to die twenty five
years sooner than general populations. They're not given the alternatives
that this could be a transient and short term, that
it's not unusual for somebody that's under extreme amounts of
stress from a variety of different things to maybe go
through a period where they're particularly distressed and emotional, they're
not going to be told other stories. And in short,
(13:20):
then because they're not told some of these alternative stories
from the get go, family members are often again unbeknownst
to them, contributing to maybe their loved ones chrinicity and
their lack of hope. And I think you read some
things around Ron and how he talks about hope that
(13:42):
you thought was impactful.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
Yeah, So one of the quotes that I wanted to
share was about hope. Ron says, I believe that as
long as a person is alive, some seed of hope,
some possibility is there waiting to be fertilized. Hope fights fear,
nurtures the courage, and inspires the vision and the work
required to resist giving up and accepting that your goals
are unattainable. Deep in the recesses of our being that
(14:06):
are safe sanctuaries, secure hiding places for never fully lost dreams,
but sometimes they're hidden so well that we can no
longer reach those parts of ourselves. The help we need
may come from expected and unexpected sources. That I really
like that we talk about hope and recovery. So Ron
says it is a myth that people don't recover right
(14:29):
from mental health stuff. Yeah, and we believe that here
at the board too. Recovery as possible. Yes, and if
you have that hope, you might try some different things
right and think about it differently.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
Now, That's why I said Doctor Ashley and our own
Pat Risser before he passed, many times he said that
he would tell folks I'm an ED recovery person. So
because there was a debate about that, you know, the
idea that I'm in recovery forever versus I'm recovered. So
he if he is an ED person because he felt
(15:03):
like he recovered full stop from some of his so
called diagnoses he received as a as a young man.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
So it's really cool they knew they knew each other too.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
And no, I mean, I'm excited. I don't you know,
I don't want to get him off topic. I might
ask him in advance, if you know, if he wants
to tell any stories about Pat that he might have,
So I'll ask him that informally. But I think you know,
as folks come to the conference, what they're going to
hear is in Ron's work now primarily is on training
(15:37):
up family so he believes that a family approach to
help family members helping other family members is a way
to go. It's like a peer So he provides some
structured training for families that are interested in doing this
uh and then they make themselves available to their local
community to talk to lead people through some of the struggles.
(16:01):
We've got professional led groups that do this, but that's
what's different. Ron feels like there's power in training up
other family members that have gone through it, and they
are the facilitators. Again, they don't charge. You know, it's
open ended. It's a support group if you will. And
this is something we don't have yet that I'm aware
(16:22):
of in Ohio. But that's partly why i wanted Ron
to talk to us about this, because I've been interested
in a family approach that have been trained in a
model that is not dominated by the medical model. We've
got family programs that are in Ohio and other states,
but they come from that medical model lens, which I
(16:44):
think does more harm than good. So I've been looking
for an approach that takes more of the social determinants
of health, psychosocial causes of distress, and teaches encourages from
that frame. And so I'm optimistic as he talks about
that we might be able to get some people trained
up in Ohio and even in Ashland County going forward
(17:06):
that we can refer our families to that might be
looking for that support.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Yeah, I think it's really exciting.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Yeah, very exciting.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
I'm excited to hear them talk so well.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Folks, if you've not signed up yet, don't wait, run
yes yet, maybe get signed up. If you want to
be in person, you need to make that commitment today again.
Twenty bucks Ashley MHRB dot org. It's the RSVP conference
March twenty six, starting around eight fifty for registration. Doctor
(17:35):
and Ashley and I will be there. If you want
doctor Ashley's autograph on anything, She's promised to sign anything
you bring her. So, so Doctor Ashley again, thank you.
We're looking forward to meeting folks in person at the
conference and just it's going to be a wonderful day
with our speakers and just getting to see folks that
come out. We've got a lot of return folks, so
(17:57):
it's nice catching up with some of our people from
where I'm state that come. And certainly we don't want
to coglect our folks on Zoom. But we'll try to
reach out to those folks as best we can given
that that platform.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Yeah, I'm excited. It's going to be great.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Thank you, doctor Ashley.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
Episode of the Keeping Ashland Healthy podcast. The podcast is
a production of the Mental Health and Recovery Board of
Ashland County, Ohio. You can reach the Board by calling
four one nine two eight one three one three nine.
Please remember that the Board funds a local twenty four
to seven crisis line through Applese Community Mental Health Center.
It can be reached by calling four one nine two
eight nine sixty one one one. That's four one nine
(18:36):
two eight nine sixty one one one. Until next time,
Please join us in keeping Ashland Healthy.
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